@badminton it’s just that your eyes haven’t opened, and probably never will, did you know that the very words CONSPIRACY THEORY was coined by the CIA, to shut people up, a bit like, RACIST, or FAR RIGHT, or CLIMAT DENIAL, it seems to work doesn’t it
And Biden, who had no right as a Vice President, was even able to keep his in a unsecure garage and his classic Corvette. They are just willing to bend the law in any shape or form to keep Trump out of the White House. They definitely don't want tit for tat if he gets in.
That you actually believe that says a lot about you..And that you can even defend what Trump has admitted on recordings doing with those papers says you are not American..😷
🤔 [b]... milk donations: [/b]a person who's worth BILLIONS 🙄🙄🙄
🤔 [b]... Stormed the Capitol:[/b] i believe a window was broken... cost $10-15 dollars to repair, as opposed to Dems Terrorist Wing of BLM/Antifa causing $2 [b]BILLION[/b] in damages NATIONWIDE - how many deaths, i believe the figure hit 67 when a reporter said after turning back to camera after watching a Federal Court building being BURNT DOWN:
"On the whole, these are peaceful protests"
...then that idiot from CNN stating to the nation:
"Where does it say protests have to be peaceful"
🤔[b] ...less than 100%:[/b] Senator Graham {ex-Judge} verbally ripped the Dems apart for what they put Kavanagh through, but obviously YOU know better
🤔[b]... Keeping my own Council[/b]: YOU outline WHERE I've NOT been 'genuine' ... if you 'suspect', you should be able to provide examples ... just [b]COPY & PASTE [/b]
🤔 ... if you CAN'T, you're bullSCHIFFING ... [b]AGAIN[/b]
@BigGuy2 I think you have had enough of my attention. Since my only point was to get your words out there for others to see and judge, I think I'm done here. Thanks for playing..😷
Let me put this as clearly as I can. Only presidents AFTER 1978 are subject to the Presidential Records Act of 1978 that established the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA).
AND.
Trump is NOT charged with possession of secret documents. Nope.
Trump IS charged with refusing to hand them over when asked multiple times by NARA, their rightful owner.
You say "whatabout Biden?" Well, Pence & Biden both immediately handed their documents over to NARA; Trump tried to hide the docs and deceive NARA. Big difference.
You say "whatabout Obama?" You were lied to. Obama never possessed the documents, NARA always did. NARA now stores many of them in a presidential library built to NARA's specifications, but NARA has always owned and controlled the documents.
I'm sorry you were lied to about Obama's documents. It wasn't the first right-wing lie foisted upon you; it won't be the last.
@sunsporter1649 Nice try! Failure to comply with civil penalties results in a criminal violation. Trump is [u]NOT[/u] being charged with possession of secret documents. No, not at all. Trump [u]IS[/u] being charged with refusing to give them back to NARA, their rightful owner, when asked multiple times. And Trump IS being charged with obstructing justice in the process of his refusal.
You've demonstrated that Trump had a legal recourse he chose not to use. Guess who initiated no actions and asserted no violations?? Guess who lied to NARA and hid boxes instead?? Yeah, Trumpy, that's who.
Lemme again direct your attention to 44 US Code § 2203, Management and custody of Presidential records, subsection (g) paragraph 1 [quote](g) (1) Upon the conclusion of a President’s term of office, or if a President serves consecutive terms upon the conclusion of the last term, the Archivist of the United States shall assume responsibility for the custody, control, and preservation of, and access to, the Presidential records of that President. The Archivist shall have an affirmative duty to make such records available to the public as rapidly and completely as possible consistent with the provisions of this chapter.[/quote]
Failure to comply with civil penalties is a criminal violation. [b]Checkmate,[/b] dude.
Sporty: Now that you've [i]finally[/i] acknowledged that NARA is the rightful owner of those documents and that Trump's failure to return them is a criminal act, you are [i]finally[/i] interested in the charges against him? Good. Let me direct your attention to the 49 page indictment. No, I'm not gonna read it aloud to you! Don't worry, if Jack Smith forgot to dot an 'i' or cross a 't', Trump's pal Judge Cannon will be quick to dismiss the matter!!
@sunsporter1649 Get out the sun! You don't a verify single damn thing! You know he doesn't have such a name! He gave you the link. Are you just a provocateur? Someone to muddy the line of thought with unimportant details?
Boxes of classified documents from his vice-presidency were found, among several places, in Biden's garage, with the door up. Anyone could have accessed them. Unlike President Trump, Biden had no legal authority to declassify anything.
@LordShadowfire Declassification is a process, and Trump did not go through that process. And that is immaterial any way, since the indictment doesn't depend on document classification at all.
Since we’re talking special treatment, how come Trump gets to rape women to his heart’s content, but everyone went nuts when Carter said he had “lust in his heart?”
@LeopoldBloom ... why do you's nutjobs ALWAYS claim the other side do what you set in motion, the Russian collusion is a prime example ... J6 is another
Leo, it is.really not worth trying to reply. Trump was classic outsider. Use whatever common sense you have. Dems hated him, republicans hated him, the only people who liked him were blue collars. Prove the laptop! Are you kidding? Even the NYTimes has apologised. You watch both sides for yourself. There is not one story, but one million. Speaking of proof, Comer, Chairman of Oversight, has bank records proving millions of dollars went from the ccp to both bidumbs.
There was one meeting at Trump Tower with russians. The female who said she had the goods on HTC was really there to talk about Americans adopting russian children. But, you would not know about that, would you? You want to play games while I dig up proof for your lazy ass from events eight years ago. Manifort went to jail for tax fraud years before he even met Trump! Kept in solitary because he would say what prosecutors wanted him to say about Trump! Do you believe in testimony forced by solitary confinement? I don't. You people talk about Trump being a fascist, but it was dem prosecutors who pit Manifort in solitary. I do have contempt for your ignorance. Banning books? The Bible like you people did? Do you know why the Florida books could not be shown on tv? The books were so pornographic they could not pass the tv station's standards. So, you want to show little children books so pornographic they can't be shown on the show about them? But, burn the Bible! Now, why is it I have contempt for you???
@MarthannBann888 Trump was hardly an outsider. He never held public office, but he was deep in New York City politics most of his life due to his real estate holdings. You are correct that the Republican leadership hated him, because they knew he was incompetent and polarizing. And they were right. Trump is responsible for the Republicans' poor showing in 2018, 2020, and 2022, and 2024 will be even worse.
How can you prove that the laptop story would have had any effect? You remind me of those people who say Bernie would have beaten Trump in 2016 because of one poll in August where he led in a hypothetical matchup.
Comer has no proof of anything. He's even admitted it. There is one guy no one has seen for three years, that Rudy Giuliani claims has a tape of something.
There were over 100 meetings between Trump, his staffers, and Russians.
The Bible ban was trolling to show how your anti-trans agenda can backfire.
I support parents deciding what their kids can be exposed to. You want to shove your degenerate agenda down everyone else's throat. That's why I have total contempt for you and people like you. You're fascists. Mind your own business!
They’ve been and still are going after Trump because he is not a beltway owned person, he has ideas for America that does not sit well with the Ilk of George Soros, Klaus Schwab, the BRIC group, or Xi Jin Ping. The current players, aka administration and many agency heads are terrified he’ll return to the Oval Office. As far as document handling / mishandling is trumped ( no pun intended) up. Biden did it, Pence did it.
As for Biden, his actions alone, not controlling the border, along with his flunkies, “czar”Harris and that low life Mayjorkas head of DHS are treasonous.
The current investigations of how he got the vast amounts of money he did;
his cabal is trying to keep away from the spotlight. His involvement with Ukraine and China ( Hunter) are long known by his party and now are being looked into and that is scaring his handlers.
For all his faults, Trump is no worse than Biden, but he is certainly being targeted.
@MarthannBann888 What a classic (and fallacious) maneuver. You lack the intellectual capacity to counter any of the arguments presented to you, so you dismiss them and personally attack the person making them.
It's only a "crime" when Trump does it. Even though the POTUS has unfettered authority to declassify documents, and even though there is no declassification process that the POTUS must follow, it's only an issue for Trump. It's fine for the other presidents. It's also ok for Biden, who took docs as a senator and VP, even though it's against the law for senators and VPs to do that. When you read the charges against Trump in the indictment, you'll notice each of them are related to [b]classified documents[/b] that Trump actually declassified. But when he declassifies something, it doesn't count.
Indictments don't mean much. As Alan Dershowitz says, you can indict a ham sandwich. He also says the case against Trump is weak. But the deep state is quite motivated to keep Trump out of the White House. Two hours after the FBI released information about Biden taking a $5 million bribe, the indictment in Trump was released. Just a coincidence, I'm sure 🙄
@BizSuitStacy ... VERY well said - some nutjob on here actually stated that all this is an attempt to fool/or sway the VOTERS into believing Trump is 'Big Bad Orange Man' ... as can be seen by the AMOUNT of indictments coming through
@BizSuitStacy ... what the nutjobs try and do is give the impression that an 'impeachment/Indictment is a GUILTY verdict, rather than just an accusation
@MarthannBann888 says [quote]You people would hear a lot less "what about ism" if you owned up to what you do in the first place.[/quote]
Recall the EIGHT (8) separate republican controlled House and Senate committee investigations of Hillary Clinton and Benghazi. Yes indeed, four investigations weren't enough. Six weren't enough. And all EIGHT separate republican controlled Congressional committees exonerated her. Do you believe know better than all EIGHT committees?
Special Counsel John Durham spent four years investigating Hillary and the FBI's Russian investigation. After four years had had two failed prosecutions of low level FBI agents and got another agent sentenced to community service. Nobody stopped or impeded his investigation.Are you claiming that you have evidence that was missed by the whole four year Durham investigation??
The evidence doesn't support your bothsidesism. The evidence says Trump is uniquely corrupt. Sorry you're unable to deal with it.
@sunsporter1649 DUUUDE!!! The 1917 Espionage Act doesn't give a hoot about classification status! Haven't you been paying [i]any[/i] attention??
But since you insist, the relevant passage is near the end of 18 U.S. Code § 793(e). Hint, look for "... willfully retains the same and fails to deliver ..."
How about a few facts to go along with your rant? There was no Presidential Records Act prior to 1978, so no President prior to that time was bound by it. That would eliminate Kennedy, Johnson, and Ford, and of course Nixon, who you purposely left out, who was the reason for the law in the first place.
None of those Presidents that you mentioned took documents in the numbers or of the significance to national security that Trump did. None of them refused to give back classified documents other than Trump. None of them disobeyed a subpoena for documents. Trump's traitorous actions have resulted in him getting caught red-handed. He will be tried and convicted.
@MarthannBann888 Let us see your "proof" of sales of "nuclear where with all" to China. This should be interesting.
Trump's traitorous actions are finally coming back to bite him. He is calling for protests tomorrow in Miami. Will you be there with your Second Amendment solutions?
They didn't refuse to give them back. They didn't share top secret information with people they knew should not see the information. They didn't have family members getting billions of dollars for unexplained reasons. After a one hr privare meeting with Putin Trump said Russia and the US should have a joint cybersecurity taskforce.
Your keyboard seems to be stuck in the caps lock position, dude.
Ex presidents can end up, accidentally, and mostly due to no fault of their own, having classified documents.
When that's discovered, either by the President, his staff, or the records office, the proper authorities are notified, and arrangements are made to return said documents to the national archive.
Cheeto Benito, not only knowingly took classified documents, but he bragged about it, was showing them to visitors, and he ignored every effort to have said documents returned, and instructed his legal team and staff, to lie to authorities.
If what's happening is unprecedented, it's because Cheeto Benito thinks he's above the law. Look how much the MAGA crowd loves it:
[media=https://youtu.be/p0bxtnHrDRM]
I know you weren't aware of this, dude, and you're just asking, so hope this clarifies it for you.
Because like the Russian collusion rubbish, it’s all made up shit, and like the the stormy Daniel’s 36 charges bulllshit, it’s all made up, and blown up, one charge for writing a cheque another for paying the money another for the cheque being cashed, another for entering the payment onto a ledger, x 6 because the lawyer bill was paid in 6 payments, all this is about is to stop Trump running, because they know he would easily win, but of course all the useful idiots run with the liberal left wing media crap, and get their daily brainwashing propaganda which they are so used to,
I don't really blame you for your opinion because that is what has been presented to you and everyone else.
If you can, let's dial back the temperature.
Do you suppose that there might be some folks lying besides Trump and friends?
My First husband lied about everything in his life, he even lied about his birthday cake. He would tell me he hated liars, that everyone else was a liar. But him.
Suppose those people who are telling you Trump is a shit human being are lying? Just for arguments sake.
Here is a train of thought for you to consider.
The Donald is running for president?? Thought he was a democrat. Well, he is a good father. He is not as connected to the establishment as the others. The most administrative experience.
Books have not been written about the people he murdered. He knows a lot about people around the world. He likes me. He wants people to have good lives at their own expense. He wants working people to be able to keep some of what they make. He thinks there should be enough research on green cars to ensure they balance what they use with what they save yin energy. Trump cannot be bought. People who can be bought hate him. He never said he had all those women. He said he could have them because some women throw them selves at rich men. I know that is true. They are called groupies. I listened to the tape many times. What they said was simply not true. To be scathing is one thing. To lie and be scathing is cheap.
"The initial announcement of Rosemont Seneca's and the Chinese government's Bohai Harvest joint investment fund in December 2013 revealed plans for a one billion dollar investment. Seven months later they increased it to 1.5 billion. "Chao Deng, " Bohai, Harvest and US investment Firms Expand Target for Outbound Fund." Wall Street Journal, July 10, 2014.
“Under the statutory scheme established by the PRA, the decision to segregate personal materials from Presidential records is made by the President, during the President’s term and in his sole discretion.” - US District Judge Amy Berman Jackson
@BizSuitStacy he’s knowingly omitted a tonne of evidence that clears trump. He don’t mention trump declassifying crossfire hurricane docs.. at all.. which it seems it’s all about. Barry wanted them docs back to reclassify them and stop trump showing everybody what a dirtbag he is.. and since it’s in Florida and not DC. Might get thrown completely out before it begins 🍿 And trumps polls not budging.. that’s the best part …
ppl the establishment want gone normally take a plea deal and tap out by now.. because they’ve sold the house, car, gone a million $ in debt for lawyers… Trump got the cash to take it to the next level each time.. must be frustrating for them😎🍿
Same as Keri lake. She was supposed to run out of money Money ages ago and go away. But she’s got pillow guy money and can afford to keep pushing..
@TheOneyouwerewarnedabout True only one! Why is it that the dems have to pursue him??? Could it be that if Trump is elected, bidumb will be hung for treason?
You left out Nixon, yet all before 1978 there wasn't ANY kind of laws against it. However none of those had anything of any significance. Only the one fool had anything above classified confidentiality.
Not even Nixon had them. He shredded them hence the presidential records act to begin with!
Because other than the strictest, most government limiting read of the Constitution of these United States, nobody has more authority than a president, or former president.
What is it with you nutjobs and this 'whataboutism' ... at least have the balls to say:
[b]"Nothing to see here, let's move on"[/b]
The inter-action below is from another of you nutjobs, his reply to my initial comment sums up the Democrat /'Leftard'/Flea-bitten rat cornered mentality PERFECTLY:
[i]BigGuy2 · 26-30, M @whowasthatmaskedman ... it's quite telling that Trump's admitted it, the others did the same, but they didn't admit ... speaks volumes on Trumps character doesn't it[/i]
Reply being:
[i]whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M @BigGuy2 OK........Lets go with that for now....😷[/i]
... that reply - "... for now ..." - sums up you's nutjobs PERFECTLY
@LeopoldBloom and I'm not going to give you a citation. I'm only here to play. I wouldn't have said it if I hadn't read it from a reputable source....but if you like, you can call me wrong. I don't care. All that matters really is what they actually do anyway.
@LeopoldBloom Leo, and other constitutional attorneys say that the action of taking the documents made them declassified according to the constitution. You can make fun of this if you will, but since you have only one point of view, I would be careful what I say. The documents belong to Trump.
Rules for thee, but not for me. Trump is being prosecuted not for breaking any laws but for being a political threat to President Biden. Biden cannot win reelection without cheating again, so he has to prevent Trump from running.
Lord, lord! Let's count! Fake surveillance during the campaign. Fake charges immediately after swearing in. Two and a half year investigation resulting in zip, zilch, nada. Continued accusations following investigation as though there had been no findings. Unwarranted tax investigations resulting in no charges. Unwarranted impeachment investigations resulting in no removal from office. Persecution of supporters resulting in threats to them and their families. Most charges to supporters had no relation to Trump or the campaign. Now accused of stealing that are the property of the president. If you don't know about this please look it up yourself. This stuff is common knowledge, is reported on frequently except on liberal channels This is a very sparse list as I am working from memory. Thing is you should already know this.
@MarthannBann888 We need to forgive people like LordShadowfire for their ignorance. They will never hear the truth about Biden's and the Democrat party's corruption while binging CNN and MSDNC.
It doesn't matter to me, and yes, I do know some are classified.
Going after these papers is the worst kind of insurrection in and of itself. This "investigations" is a war on the American people. All of the prosecutors are democrats. Meuller's team were all democrats. Trump doesn't have due process. The prosecutor has a zero to eight record in front of the supreme court, according Mark Levin, one of Reagan's attorneys. This is a cover up for bidumb's criminality. Twenty million from the Chinese military. Twenty shell companies that do nothing but get checks. Ukraine top officials with tapes of further criminality. Dems have made half of this country hate him. Just like old time snake handler preachers. He is condemned, according to dems. So, anything done to him is justified. But, condemnation by "we don't like him" is unforgivable. You people, by your constant lies, are destroying this country. All the while bidumb is selling us down the river.
I know you are going to say are you kidding? But, I can't make you look at both sides and see where the lies really are. That's for you.
@MarthannBann888 nonsense! Name one constitutional scholar who says that presidential papers are the property of the president! It has nothing to do with what is in them. The Presidential Records Act of 1978 states this clearly. It was an act passed by bipartisan vote on Congress.
Very few presents presented to a president can be accepted as their possession, there are strict rules as to what is personal and what isn't. Actually, there isn't a word about this in the constitution, the rules are set by Congress and departmental regulations.
You might also be interested to read how presidential papers can be archived in presidential libraries, but remain the property of the US government while there. Such is the case in all presidential libraries currently.
What kind of non sensical question is that. All caps so guess you are yelling it and lets just start with the first president you mention...how the hell could he have taken secret service papers home? He never got to go home. Based on your posted age do you recall 22-Nov 1963?
Maybe we should try for transparency instead of keeping things secret from the public? I'm sure I am alone "Here" on that idea. Public right to know? Lolz! Nobody knows what that might even mean, "Here".
There is nothhing of the extent of this from former presidents that can be compared to Trump and the documents were declassified in the former presidents cases.
