I can't believe this. I know a man in his 60's who had polio, he contracted it when he was a newborn (back then we didn't have the vaccines in my country and babies were getting infected like crazy). He had to be in the hospital his first two years of life, away from his family and now has a paralyzed leg. Every day he thanks god for the vaccines we now have available. And he's one of the very religious and conservative people, but he'd never side with the anti vaxxers. I guess privileged people have to learn the hard way. It makes me sad to say, but no amount of evidence will help them understand, until THEY are the evidence.
@SomeMichGuy He hates people and spreads his malicious mischief through outright lies and twisted claims. Look above, where his attitude is that he’s vaccinated so he’s safe (suddenly vaccines work and are good, huh?) so everyone else can be ut at risk as far as he’s concerned.
@sputnik So how many people do you know that are fully vaxed against covid that have had covid? Honest question please answer honestly. Remember Fauci and Biden and Harris are all fully vaxed and then had covid. Most of my vaxed friends have had covid more than once. None of my unvaxed friends have had covid more than once. The problem you have is you can't distinguish between a good vaccine and a quack vax. The covid vax are quack medicine and should be avoided. Salk Polio vaccines work and should be used. Isn't that simple? It is called EVIDENCE BASED SCIENCE. Something that you seemingly are incapable of understanding.
@hippyjoe1955 Covid has evolved. It is a mistake to call all variants by the same name. Unvaxxed people who had Covid are getting it again. Vaxxed people are getting Covid. Omicron BA.5 is breaking through both kinds of pre-omicron protections. 2nd cases of unvaxxed are milder than first cases. First cases of already vaxxed are milder than first cases of unvaxxed. The research supports these claims.
T cells stand strong against Omicron
... They found that antibody cross-neutralization of Omicron was very low or absent compared with WT, Beta, and Delta variants, but could be partially restored by a third booster vaccination. T cells recognized Omicron just as effectively as other VOCs, suggesting that vaccinated individuals maintain T cell immunity, which could provide protection in the absence of neutralizing antibodies, limiting severe disease.
@hippyjoe1955 Your expertise in immunology will probably lead you to quickly recognize that low antibody cross-neutralization means there weren't enough antibodies to entirely prevent infection. And your expertise will also inform you that the phrase "T cells recognized Omicron just as effectively as other VOCs" means than vaccinated people, once infected, can quickly mount a robust cellular response, resulting in less severe illness.
Wait till dippyjoe reads this,he will try to get you to believe he had polio ten times,it didn't affect him and the vaccine does not work. You just cannot fix stupid as already said here.👇
@JHNTHN and had posted about COVID vaccines when OP had clearly said polio.Looks like one of the nurses in the phychiatric ward is missing a cellphone.Their long term resident dippyjoe went and stole it then logged into SW.
One of my cousins was married to a man who was one of the last people to contract polio before the vaccine came out. He was a quadriplegic most of his life, and on a respirator the last few years after post-polio syndrome kicked in and took out his remaining mobility.
@LeopoldBloom Polio is an AWFUL disease. The anti-vaxxers who go around claiming vaccine causes autism have misinformed millions, leading to the return of polio and other diseases.
Funny how vaccines were a common part of healthcare until Russian Bots convinced the GQP they weren't. Now the anti vaxx crowd is convincing their minions that MonkeyPox is a homosexual desease. This will just lead to BillyBob not going to see a Doctor and spreading the desease because he's no Homo.
Oh, my goodness…I’m fairly certain anyone U.S. born under 55 only knows what that was like by anecdotal accounts. I remember classmates in wheelchairs who were polio survivors.
I had polio vaccine when I was a kid and would recommend it to others. There is a huge difference between vaccines and the vax. Here in Alberta the Provincial Health Authority who had fired a bunch of doctors and nurses because they chose not to vax have now lifted all vax mandates. Their reasoning? Because the vaxes don't work. Strangely enough more doctors and nurses died from the vax than the virus. How is that for ironic. BTW does anyone know if the covid vax reduced the kids immune system and so he got polio? The vax does cause VAIDS so....
@hippyjoe1955 Once again, lying and providing absolutely nothing to back it up. Meanwhile, in reality: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41541-021-00324-5 https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-covid-vaccine-animal/fact-check-covid-19-vaccines-did-not-skip-animal-trials-because-of-animal-deaths-idUSL2N2NJ1IK https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-afs:Content:9792931264
Oh, and it's not even the first mrna vaccine tested on animals or even humans. https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2017/02/animal-trial-shows-promise-zika-mrna-vaccine https://www.cell.com/molecular-therapy-family/molecular-therapy/pdfExtended/S1525-0016(17)30156-9 https://speakingofresearch.com/2021/08/27/human-mrna-vaccine-trials-in-the-2010s-a-history-lesson-in-animal-research/
We are not anti vax we are anti test subject we have had every other vaccine, don’t blame it on us because you are too naive to see what the government is doing. Monkey pox and now this? But it’s the republican supporters fault. Please lol 🙄
And again irregardless of those numbers and my opinion that it being deliberately tied to the government manipulation that is my own opinion (and many others) and I respect if you don’t believe it
But you mean to sit there and tell me that that mean and his Individual choice represents an entire population of people (who have other vaccines) but refuse to get the Covid vaccine that have no connections to him whatsoever.
That’s a weird thing to even do why are you blaming your fellow Americans? Everything is always republicans or democrats fault. Why does someone always feel the need to blame someone else and tie it to politics for something irrelevant
@DeluxedEdition Where did you find that bar graph? When was it made? Who published it? What's the date on it?
My graph is marked KFF for Kaiser Family Foundation, and dated Oct 2021. Your graph appears to be way out of data; essentially obsolete data from early in the vaccination period. It's like posting someone's baby picture and saying that's what they look like as an adult.
Sorry, you need to provide data that has a DATE on it if you want it to be taken seriously.
You have to connect the polio-antivax dots for them. They're not capable. Pretend you're talking to a child. Use crayons instead of the aggressive graphite.
@windinhishair have you got your head buried. People have died because of the covid injection. Do you really think noone has died from the covid injection?
@gol979 The number of people who have died after being injected is dwarfed by the number of covid dead. The injections have saved millions of people. Your approach is like not wearing seatbelts because every once in awhile, someone is thrown from a terrible wreck and survives. Dumb.
The media has said nothing about Covid or the monkey pox since September.
DEAD wrong, dude!
BBC: Loss and suffering at heart of Covid inquiry Inquiry chair Baroness Hallett promises 'thorough and fair' review at first preliminary hearing.
NATURE: Will there be a COVID winter wave? What scientists say Emerging variants and waning immunity are likely to push infections higher in the northern hemisphere as influenza also makes a comeback
CNN: Long Covid: What science has learned about the loss of smell and taste Imagine waking up one morning after recovering from Covid-19 to find that your coffee smells like unwashed socks, your eggs reek of ...
BLOOMBERG: Long Covid Symptoms Last Months After Omicron Surge There are millions of long-haulers in the US alone, and there will be millions more if we don't develop better vaccines and treatments.
And this is off the front page of today's New York Times, fresh from my phone:
@Punches That doesn't make you incapable of being deceived. And if you are really a scholar of the Bible you know that a belief in your own infallibility is the OPPOSITE of humility!
In THIS world, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. You are proposing a GiAnTt CoNsPiRaCy of tens of thousands of semi trucks full of corpses and not a single leak or whistleblower, not a single statistic of all the "hidden deaths," no evidence except your personal opinion, which, actually, happens to disagree with the personal opinions of some other sincere true believers in the Bible. Sorry, that's insufficient.
oh cool. maybe seeing their families suffering will remind them why we have vaccines. we tried warning them nicely, this is their fault. my sympathies for the innocent kids but not for tha parents that made the decision.
It means that there is more fear of government than of being handicapped for life. It has to do with conspiracy theories, paranoia, and fear. Since God says that he gives us our leaders, and if we are Godly, we will never beg for bread. I am personally not fearful of anything at all, except Gods wrath for not being kind and obedient. I am not afraid of any vaccines, that have been researched and prevents serious illness. I'm happy we have these vaccines. These vaccines come from answered prayers because God answers prayers. Great research come from the USA and some other countries!
@hippyjoe1955 And on to more outlandish claims, LOL!!!
In school they taught me that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. And you have no evidence whatsoever.
The data I provide originates in peer reviewed journals where statistical data is carefully checked. The "data" you provide is a collection of unverifiable personal anecdotes. Sorry, dude, I'm sticking with the peer reviewed journals.
This message was deleted by the author of the main post.
Would you bet your life that all of those people died from.the virus. 🙂
I DID bet my life that the vast majority of them died from the virus. Here, I'll walk you thru the numbers:
Here in the table are US death numbers for the top ten causes of death for six years ending in 2020. Notice how there are 20% more deaths in 2020 than the average of the previous five years? Doing the math, that's 500,000 excess deaths in 2020.
Notice how, in 2020, 345,000 of those 500,000 excess deaths are classified as Covid? Notice how almost all causes of death rose in 2020, including cancer & heart disease?
If there's any validity to the claim that lots of deaths have been mis-classified as Covid, why did almost all causes of death increase in 2020? Wouldn't mis-classification produce a reduction in those other causes? The evidence says mis-classification is a red herring.
@ElwoodBlues The data strongly suggest that the death rate due to covid is higher than has been reported. This happened with the swine flu in 2009 as well, and the death toll was updated a couple years later to reflect the more accurate numbers.
@Zonuss Is this your way of trying to change the subject and avoid discussing the compelling death data???
I see elsewhere under this question that I gave you a chance to take a stand on the death data, and you ducked the question then as well. Is this what they call "weaponized ignorance"??
@doong I'm telling you, I'm doing just fine on the vaccine I received. Now, if you were hesitant about the J&J vax, I would understand. I personally know someone whose girlfriend got that one, never had any problem with any other vaccines in her life, and she went to the hospital with blood clots.
@doong Novavax vaccine delivers 89% efficacy against COVID-19 in U.K. in Jan 2021. By your definition that's not a vaccine, LOL!!! By May 2021 it was getting about 60% efficacy in South Africa. Again, by your definition, not a vaccine!
How about more recent variants??
“There is no way to know for sure how much protection Novavax will offer against some of the new COVID-19 subvariants, as the company’s phase 3 clinical trial was conducted prior to the circulation of delta and omicron,” Rockwell said.
Mother Nature rarely tries to get our attention so fervently. In a game of wills, she's gonna win every single time. Looks like the earth is tiring of us.
Anti vaxxers didn’t cause polio to make a return, and most so called anti vaxxers are actually fully vaccinated against most diseases, they just don’t trust the Covid vaccine.
The main cause is an open border and allowing all and sundry come in without medical and criminal checks. Third world countries still have these diseases, and when you have no checks on who is coming in, this is what happens. If you really believe someone who didn’t get “vaccinated” against Covid caused polio, you are very ignorant.
@Carissimi Unfortunately, There's a big swath of uneducated people claiming vaccines cause autism; they primed the pump for the current popularity of anti-vax fervor. And guess what famous NY billionaire used to count himself among the vaxx=autism croud?
@soar2newhighs Interesting WaPo doesn't say exactly when he traveled. NYT says he didn't travel during what would have been his transmission window.
NY TIMES
On Friday, Rockland County officials said that “the person did not travel outside the country during what would have been the transmission window,” adding that “up to 95 percent of people infected have no symptoms, which makes tracking down the transmission difficult.”
The patient in the new case, a young adult who did not recently travel outside the country, was hospitalized but is no longer, officials confirmed. Officials said the person had presented with paralysis but wouldn’t say if the patient was still dealing with that side effect.
Lemme just underline that NYT quote: “up to 95 percent of people infected have no symptoms, which makes tracking down the transmission difficult.” In other words, polio transmission is common among unvaccinated, but serious symptoms are rare.
That's got to be absolutely terrifying to public health officials.
@ElwoodBlues Not a criticism of you but your post stated he hadn’t traveled. I followed up as I was unaware of this guy’s situation and as you see in my initial post citing the Wapo, it said he had traveled. Nothing more.
@Kwek00 Very true. This is one of those issues people are referring to when they say "those who fail to study history are bound to repeat it." Muslims are another cheap target.
@windinhishair Just stupid human behavior, trying to find scapegoats for misery they either can't explain or the refusal of doing some self reflection. In René Girards (a conservative thinker btw) philosophical work called "The Scapegoat". He starts by discussing a 14th century french poem (Le Jugement dou Roy de Navarre) written by "Guillaume de Machaut", about a time when the black plague breaks out. And the human tendency in the community was to blame people that think diffrently (as in: "weren't christian enough") and Jews. And then the poem describes the genocide that follows. 700 years later, and a large part of humanity is still stuck in that mentality.
@thedarkside Given that thanks to this dude, there is now more polio in the USA than the entirety of Latin America, it can be safely said you don't know what's going on either and just fall for whatever bigotry is floated your way.
I have been saying that, if the polio vaccine had had the reception of the CoViD vaccines, we'd all be living side-by-side with people living with polio.
Now our breakdown of herd immunity is making that true.
I wish these idiots could talk with the mothers who were so relieved to get their kids the Salk vaccine (I have had this conversation...it's very eye-opening, if one is unaware).
@windinhishair YES, instead of everyone whose only interface with STEM was balancing their checkbook trying to critique science which they can't understand. Luddites trying to run the show.
It does suggest he could have been infected by someone who had been abroad, or was visiting the USA from abroad, where the disease is still fairly common.
@ArishMell Because of the strain he got they know he got it from someone outside the us who was vaccinated with the no longer used in the US oral vaccine that uses a live attenuated virus to make it.
@tindrummer yes when were at school as kids we got a sugar lump of polio vaccine, this protected us from getting polio, your right once you get it, but not before
@itsoeasy Yeah, according to https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK545991/ the UK had serious supply problems in the early days of their vaccination program. UK chose a different initial polio virus than the US, and, for a few years, refused to import US Salk vaccine, partly based on a major failure in the US called the Cutter Labs Incident.
So I'm guessing the UK prioritized getting one sugar lump to every kid at first, and then provided followup doses when supply permitted.
As a public service, even though those who need to hear it will intentionally misunderstand or refuse to read, I present again an illustrated explanation of how vaccines work.
These are your white blood cells:
Their job is to fight off intruding microorganisms in your body. Think of them as a police force, authorized to kill and eat suspects.
Unfortunately, these cells, while lethal, are not always the most adept at assessing threats. That is why vaccines were invented. In essence, a vaccine is the equivalent of a surprise training session for your white blood cells:
This shows them what the enemy looks like, without exposing your body to the actual disease.
That way, should you be infected with the genuine article...
@ElwoodBlues I am ducking nothing. I gave you the real facrs and that is just what they are. Not all of the people here in North America who had the virus were on file or on record. And some are still getting it and not reporting it. And many of those people are vaccinated. Now if you care to get out of your little box and ask around you might be surprised to hear the real stories from real people. Not fake news. ☺️
@ElwoodBlues The problem is that the fool involved was Playboy Playmate Jenny McCarthy, who was a ferocious mother who insisted that her boy, Evan, was made autistic by the vaccines he got.
Her influence made the scientific community go on a quest to check the dependency, and a very exhaustive search produced nothing...if memory serves, one of the studies used a Dutch medical db of that country's citizens to find a null result.
She was the darling of shock jocks, the leader of anxious mothers, and the insistent voice about vaccines. She tried to claim she wasn't anti-vaccine, but only that people should get educated and work out their own solutions...like asking the doctor if there were a "natural" way to achieve the same effect...!
The fact that RFK, Jr., is also anti-vaccine is just astounding; he is apparently trying to negate some of the positive service of his family... His arg. seems to be numerical--"we only had 'n' vaccines when *I* was a kid, why do we now need 'm > n' vaccines?"--which is no argument at all.
So a sexy Playmate who was a mom and a Kennedy...and the powder keg of people who think that their lack of study & knowledge trumps the study & knowledge of others...et voilà! we have arrived at today. 🥺
@SomeMichGuy Yeah, I used to joke about "not quite doctor" Jenny McCarthy, an "investigator" whose earlier body of work was widely published in the "anatomical journals" of Mr Hugh Hefner. No, she never got a college degree.
It's amazing how much damage a few determined idiots can do.
I knew a lady that had polio. The reason she got it was because her father didn't get his children vaccinated because he figured they were part of the master race and they were too strong to get it. I sometimes think that too many people in the US are starting to think that way. Many years later the same woman developed cancer and when she phoned her father to tell him about it he told her she must not be his daughter because cancer didn't run in his family. Crazy/stupid thinking. Cheers and Happy New Year!
@Subsumedpat Trump at the Centre for Disease Control, People are really surprised I understand this stuff. Every one of the Doctors said, How do you know so much about this? Maybe I have natural ability. The Scientists and Doctors had to listen to that verbal diarrhea while Trump lied and contradicted them.
@gol979 The source as you quote it says "This is indicative of a transmission chain from a person who received the oral polio vaccine." Source also says that's an overseas strain of polio.
We've already established that the US considers the old oral polio vaccine to be defective and that some strains of polio have evolved to evade oral polio vaccine.
How in the world can you thereby conclude that vaccine therefore causes polio?? And how does the premise "vaccines cause polio" explain successful eradication in most of the world??
You are proceeding from false principles and can't admit it. Your claims don't fit the facts, and you can't admit it. It's all there for everyone to see. Too funny!!
@LordShadowfire @ElwoodBlues whattt. You mean Big Harma produced a product thats utter garbage? And a product that causes a virus to mutate to be able to avoid magic injections? You 2 sound like dirty "anti-vaxxers"
@gol979 Jesus fuck! How fucking stupid are you? The guy from America who got polio wasn't vaccinated. The person he got it from got a shitty oral vaccination that's been banned in the United States for 20 goddamn years! Are you genuinely this fucking stupid, or are you a fucking troll?
@LordShadowfire You're not going to get polio because you were vaccinated for polio. I am afraid for the kids who have parents who don't vaccinate their kids for polio though.
The media has said nothing about Covid or the monkey pox since September. It just goes to show you that they create the narrative and the fear in your little head. Get out of the matrix please. ☺️
@Punches Far from true. People decided the pandemic was over. Incidentally, something can still be a serious health threat and not reach pandemic levels.
If you're curious, people are contracting, suffering and dying from new cases of COVID every single day and a fall surge is being prepared for. You know how I know? Responsible media.
@LordShadowfire Oh my gyod okay so for you and elwood, every thought you two have is consumed about stupid vaccines. Like oh, some chronic masturbator got carpal tunnel because he was unvaccinated against Parkinsons!" Then y'all get bent out of shape as hell.
Okay so here we are three months later and the planet isn't dead of all these "outbreaks" yet.
The three of you need to calm the hell down. Quit try to project your hypochondria about every little thing onto the world. Geeeze! Okay you are horrified of covid, fair enough, but now you are worried about everything else?
You know what the media is doing? They are just entertaining themselves by scaring people with every little thing. Kind of like how some people entertain themselves by aggravating the neighbor's dogs?
Wait a second, something just came in. Someone somewhere in the world had a bleeding hangnail! We all better go out and get an arm amputated so it doesn't happen to us! 😮
Oh my gyod okay so for you and elwood, every thought you two have is consumed about stupid vaccines.
LOL!!! You obviously haven't seen my climatology posts!!!
Like oh, some chronic masturbator got carpal tunnel because he was unvaccinated against Parkinsons!
SERIOUSLY?? Are you seriously gonna deny any connection between 65 years of mass polio vaccination and the near eradication of polio? SERIOUSLY?? In your mind that's mere coincidence???
There are some religious communities in New York who, for whatever reasons refuse polio vaccine, and now polio virus is being detected in the sewage in these communities and the first case of polio paralysis has emerged. And you're gonna sit there and DENY any connection between lack of polio vaccination in a community and the resurgence of polio virus in that community? SERIOUSLY??
What's next - will you deny any connection between smoking and lung cancer? Will you ignore hurricane warnings and evacuation orders like the former citizens whose bodies are still being picked out of the wreckage in Florida??
You know what the media is doing?
Yes. The media is reporting on the high price of vaccine idiocy, and the high cost of people who can't follow a simple chain of cause and effect reasoning.
Look, I'm not worried about polio spreading in my family or my community — we have enough basic common sense to all be vaccinated. And our high polio vaxx rate confers herd immunity that pretty much protects those among my community who are immuno- compromised.
But the taxpayers of New York now need to spend many millions of health dept dollars because a community of idiots deny basic epidemiological science. Money that could be much better spent on otherpressing health issues is instead going to clean up a very preventable mess. We have limited resources. Too much idiocy wastes those resources and damages us as a society.
We've spent 60+ years and untold $billions eliminating the scourge of polio from our country. And now science denying idiocy has brought it back to the point that it threatens those among us who are immuno- compromised.
Oh my gyod okay so for you and elwood, every thought you two have is consumed about stupid vaccines.
No, I just get really triggered by liars like you.
Okay so here we are three months later and the planet isn't dead of all these "outbreaks" yet.
I'm sure that just over a million dead Americans and several million disabled ones, including one of my good friends, will be pleased to know the planet will go on.
Quit try to project your hypochondria about every little thing onto the world.
IT'S NOT HYPOCHONDRIA WHEN I CAN LITERALLY GET COVID FROM SOME INCONSIDERATE PIECE OF SHIT STANDING INCHES FROM ME IN A CONVENIENCE STORE! OKAY, GENIUS? THAT LITERALLY HAPPENED!
And it's not hypochondria when a guy who was using some off-brand, banned-in-the-US fake-ass "vaccine" for polio, LITERALLY GOT POLIO BECAUSE HE WASN'T EFFECTIVELY VACCINATED!
And now, I shall wait while you completely ignore every point I made in this comment and accuse me of attacking you, because that's what you do when I present facts.
Lolz. What a wanker.. anything to get us to be good little conforming sheep like you huh?.. I bet we were all the 2nd gunman on the grassy knoll too? 😜
DUUUDE!!! If the vaccine induces polio, why isn't it doing so worldwide?? Why is polio spreading ONLY in vaccine refusing religious communities in NY??? What's happened to your critical thinking skills????
Even says it in the article
No, it says no such thing in the article. That's why you can't supply a quote.
