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Abortion is right or wrong

Abortion: Is either right or it's wrong. It is either.life.or.it's death. If you say that.you are " pro choice " and one of the choices is abortion then you are pro abortion.

I have no rules to.respond. If I only.wanted those who agree with my stance to respond, I would talk to my.pro life friends and I would never learn anything.new. think it is important to understand why people believe what they do. Life experiences that helped shape their beliefs. I personally think it's petty playground bullying to use " religious zealot " or " indoctrination " terms as an attack but if thats your flag, then fly it.

I.believe in God, heaven and hell, good and evil but I don't consider myself religious. I haven't been to church in 7 yrs. I went to a catholic grade and high school. I was NEVER taught who was or wasn't going to hell. I was actually taught the opposite. It is okay to say that someone might be or is in heaven, but NEVER say that someone might be or is in hell. Unless you.are with them when they draw their last breath and know their heart and soul you have no right to pass judgement. If you do then you have just made your reservation. This being said, I am NOT judging the one who has had or believes in abortion. I AM judging the violent act of deliberately and intentionally stopping a human life in any stage of development. Everyone has a RIGHT and a RESPONSIBILITY to support policies that support their moral and ethical beliefs.

I do wish that pro abortion would just say that they believe that a woman has a right to abortion for any reason at any stage instead of " it's not a human being " or " it's not a person " or any other excuse

I have three beautiful good friends who have had abortions. All before I met them. Before this I never knew anyone or their stories. I DO have compassion for the reasons they chose abortion. Two regret their decisions and theirs.seemed more tragic than the one who has no regret. I will ALWAYS love these women.

As long as there is help for EVERY unwanted and unplanned pregnancy and there is, t I will ALWAYS support making and keeping abortions illegal.

I have some questions. #1 Are only those who believe in God and are pro life " religious zealots " and" indoctrinated " ? What about those who are pro abortion and believe i God ? What about pro life Atheist ? They aren't " religious zealots ", are they indoctrinated ? What about those who believe in God and heaven and hell but don't believe in organized religions ? It seems to me that " religious zealot " and " indoctrination " are being used to fit ones narrative. Believing that one day that we will all answer for what we have done or didn't do is NOT preaching fire and brimstone.. Most pro abortion who believe in God believe this. They believe the answers will be seen differently

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whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M

The only people who should EVER get a vote on this are women.. And if the subject ever comes up it is going to be a fraught decision and should be the choice of the woman involved who doesnt need to be preached at by anyone. Her beliefs and needs are all that matters and the only time anyone else should have a say is if they are prepared to sign on the dotted line to accept the child themselves and pay for it. 😷

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whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M

@specman I am saying it is NOT a child, and it is her decision how she deals with her situation. Which she sure as hell knows better that you and I assume you arent prepared to accept responsibility for. Its her responsibility. Its her decision. Adoption is an interesting option. In a world were termination was easily available alongside established adoption procedures with support for the mother through pregnancy and recovery you may well get more babies born for adoption. But until both options are a free choice out in the open, we will never know...😷

specman · 51-55, M

@whowasthatmaskedman It is still wrong and I will alway's be against it. As I am against all murders. I hope that every mother that has had an abortion that was not a medical emergency does live with the guilt of murder, because that's exactly what happened. It's a very selfish act.

whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M

@specman OK. We are close to common ground. It is a deeply traumatic decision and will weigh on the womans mind, possibly forever. Equally, the consequenses of an unwanted child she cannot provide for and cannot give the start in life any child deserves are also traumatic in a different way. Either way, that trauma, that shame, that guilt and those consequences belong to the woman involved to decide. It would be lovely if that decision could be better informed and better supported on either side. And its still no ones decision but hers, unless someone else is prepared to pick up the tab..😷

Doomflower · 36-40, M

I'm unapologetically pro choice. I could write you a short novel on my many reasons. I'll try to be brief.

Even if we grant that a fetus is a whole person with all the rights of someone who has been born, I am still 100% ok with abortion. For any reason and at any stage until the fetus is viable on its own without need for additional life support.

The person carrying the fetus has rights too and can withdraw or never give consent to be pregnant. No one has the right to occupy another person's body without their consent. Including fetuses.

If the kid was already born, would the parents be forced to donate their tissues and organs to make sure they survive? No? Why then, force a pregnant person to do the same? Why is it different if they're born?

Also, the child does not get the opportunity to consent to being born. So many people wish they were not and for all we know, that fetus is going to turn into a person who has that same wish.

All people suffer. All people die. No one is exempt. Why create another person to suffer and die when you could adopt and alleviate suffering that exists in the world?

There are millions of kids in foster care. It makes no sense to make more people when we can't take care of the ones we have!!!

Forcing or even encouraging people to have children they don't want and/or cannot afford is a recipe for disaster for the adults and the children. Kids don't go to foster care if their parents are doing well and they're a happy family.

There is no way to ban abortion. All you can do is ban safe abortions and prosecute people who have miscarriages.

Most people seeking abortion are already parents.

Fetuses aren't legally people.

And if you do believe in heaven/hell, abortion makes certain they do not have a chance to sin and earn an eternity of suffering. Of course that depends on your flavor of Christianity.

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missyann · 56-60

@Doomflower What have I said that I don't support ?

Doomflower · 36-40, M

@missyann

Palliative natal care that alleviates pain and comforts the babies through the dying process.. even when the mothers and families don’t want to see these babies, the nurses comfort these babies

Not only did you fail to support your claim, when I went to look for support of it what I found was quite different from your characterization.

missyann · 56-60

@Doomflower There is nothing to support. Hospice is available to every person who needs it. Where did you see that there is a hospital that doesn't care for babies born with life limiting conditions ?

The sites you gave me talked about abortions late term that spoke about the conditions deformity, and handicaps that I still say that they deserve life no matter how little time.they have.

Really · 80-89, M

How do you feel about soldiers killing 'foreign' people to maintain control over a part of the earth's surface, or murdering internationally because one govt disapproves of another's politics? In today's world this sick, focused obsession with other peoples' abortions is lunatic.

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missyann · 56-60

@Really I never said that most abortions occur in the third trimester. I know that most don’t occur in the third trimester but those that do like her or not medically necessary, so there’s no reason for them.. nothing I said is an exaggeration. Abortions are done the way I said they are. None are humane for the unborn life only humane for the women who have the right to kill the unborn

Pro abortion are the ones who try to come up with every excuse why abortion is justified. Pro life says one thing that life begins at fertility. ( conception ). Your side can’t even decide when you believe that life begins some say when they’re viable some when they can feel pain when they have consciousness. Ect….. come up with one excuse and stay with it.

Really · 80-89, M

@missyann OK bye

missyann · 56-60

@Really thank you I . I’ve proved my point..

justanothername · 51-55, M

You sound very much like you are married to a member of the Taliban with many of the views that you express and by that I mean that you express the view that a woman doesn’t have the right to speak up in todays society even though you list yourself as being a woman and have just stated your views on abortion.

As you probably know, the Taliban as very conservative in their traditional views and they don’t believe that women/girls should have or be able to express their views.
The Taliban have banned all women from getting any education.

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missyann · 56-60

@justanothername I didn’t say that it wasn’t the hardest decision that a woman could make. I asked you if you considered it murder to deliberately and intentionally choose to kill an innocent human being ?.

justanothername · 51-55, M

@missyann I can’t imagine anything that could be harder mentally or emotionally. Obviously not all women are impacted the same but it’s a tough decision to make and one that an individual woman should be allowed to make.

SW-User

Unless you believe that murdering another human is justified, it's wrong. While they are growing inside your womb, a fetus is otherwise separate to you...their body and all the organs inside it, all of their physical features, and ultimately their life, is theirs and not yours.

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CrystalSkull · F

@missyann I’ve read of at least 5 cases since this ban in America.

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SW-User

I believe that if literally faced with no other alternative, you should have the right to decide. What I hate is pro-lifers on here who claim to care about the unborn, but do not give a shit about the "born".

missyann · 56-60

@SW-User PCC and pro life offer assistance in every situation before and after.

I don't understand why abortion supporters always say that we don't.care after the baby.is born

reflectingmonkey · 51-55, M

everyone agrees that in a perfect world there would be no abortion, no one thinks abortion is "good". pro choice see abortion as a dificult choice to remedy a dificult situation. its not ideal. the reason why people discuss whether "its a human" or not is because for non-religious people good and evil are social consensus and we create laws based on these social concensus. but its based on debate, we need to define rights, define what is a person, in order to establish right and wrong behaviors. the big difference with religious people and why they're the main people who are pro-life is that they believe in some absolute good and evil dictated by a god so therefore unchangeable, undebatable. I am open to the idea that there might be a god but for this same reason I am offended by most religions and religious people for having the audacity to think that they know what god wants and thinks. for this reason I consider books like the bible to be blasphemous because they speak in the name of god. no one can claim to know such things. when a debate like abortion comes along, you have the philosophers that want to weight out the good and the bad and take an intelligent decision and then you got the pretentious religious people who simply "know" what the truth is and what the ultimate good is. its an insult to everyone else and possibly an insult to a god unknown. "you point of view is just your point of view but my point of view comes from GOD" 🤮

SW-User

I am fully pro choice. It is up to the woman as to whether she wants to make a clearly insurmountable choice. Not one single woman has ever, EVER maliciously terminated a baby.

Get off your high horse!

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missyann · 56-60

@SW-User You are ridiculous. Your pissed.Because you don't have a good answer

SW-User

@missyann I do. Pro-lifers are all about controlling women when it gets down to it. There are reasons why a woman needs to abort, and none of them are taken lightly. I say again, get off your high horse.

missyann · 56-60

@SW-User I can care less what a woman does with her body. I DO care that she think that she has the right to murder.

Most abortions are a permanent solution for temporary problem

CrystalSkull · F

As long as there is help for EVERY unwanted and unplanned pregnancy and there is, t I will ALWAYS support making and keeping abortions illegal.

Except there isn’t. In my country it’s legal within a certain trimester and no one screams “baby killer”. No old men and women judging and telling young girls and women they are murderers for having autonomy over their own bodies. Make abortions illegal, women die. Why does no one speak of this? It’s like they only care about what women are allowed to do…..after that not one damn is given. That is why indoctrinated zealot is used.
Funny thing is where is the outrage and screams of murder and baby killer when countries with pregnant women and babies are bombed.

AbbySvenz · F

If you don’t want an abortion, then don’t get one. That’s your choice.

You don’t get to choose for me or anyone else, though.

Why is that so difficult?

missyann · 56-60

@AbbySvenz Wether you think it is morally right or wrong. This IS a moral issue.

I refuse to sit back and say " I think it is wrong to own a slave or to molest a child, but I have no right to choose for anyone else "

Why is this so difficult for pro abortion to understand ? ALL laws are created on morals and ethics. Otherwise no one would care what we do to hurt each other

justanothername · 51-55, M

Abortion is an individual decision that a woman has to make when required. It is not about “right” or “wrong”. It’s about what is the best outcome for the mother.
Every abortion case is different and done for different reasons and ALL of those reasons are incredibly difficult ones to make.
The best thing you can do is to support any woman who chose to have an abortion.
The mental impact on a woman of having an abortion is not entirely dissimilar to the mental impact of post natal depression.
Both are hard to deal with yet both happen. The main difference is that the shear act of having an abortion is seen as a crime in many US states.

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justanothername · 51-55, M

@missyann Still needing to be controlling, judgmental while splitting hairs I see.
A woman’s body is a woman’s body. That woman has a right to Decide what happens to her own body.

specman · 51-55, M

@justanothername Who's gonna mourn for the baby that was killed just because the baby's mother did not want the baby. The choice of murder is a hard one huh. Yeah let's comfort the woman who just didn't want her baby. When she had the choice to birth and put the baby up for adoption. Then again that might just be too much of a hassle or selfish of her.

missyann · 56-60

@specman Any excuse to justify a " womans right to be comfortable " Disgusting "

BiasForAction · M

Wrong question. Just a provocation.

Better question: how to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies?

Kypro · 51-55, M

It’s not as simple as some think. If a woman can’t get abortion, it can lead to her or the baby’s death. How is that pro life? Do you want anyone deciding for you when you can live or die?

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missyann · 56-60

From how you described it, this woman was suffering from an abruption, and she should have been induced in a hospital setting to deliver the baby but you don’t intentionally kill the baby because it stop developing

missyann · 56-60

@Kypro I don’t know everything and I don’t claim to. This is why I asked the question. To understand what we were talking about.

missyann · 56-60

@Kypro A mother’s life ALWAYS comes first. Not one baby has had to be intentionally and deliberately killed to save a mother’s life

With ectopic pregnancy. The baby will never develop to birth. The intention is to save the mother’s life, not to kill the baby

When the baby is in danger an early induction or a c section should be done

99.5%of abortions are for convenience and lifestyle

RocktheHouse · M

Abortion is taking away the life of an unborn baby. It's murder plainly.

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RocktheHouse · M

@justanothername You mean less than one percent of abortion cases? Yes, If abortion is necessary to save the woman's life , that is up to the woman to Decide if she wants to take that risk or kill the baby... That doesn't change the fact that abortion is murder.

missyann · 56-60

@justanothername There has never been a case where a baby has to be intentionally and deliberately killed to save a mothers life. An Ectopic pregnancy, the baby will NEVER become viable. The intention is not to kill the child. It is to save the mother. Intention matters.

justanothername · 51-55, M

@missyann There have been plenty, there have been cases to support every argument that had ever been had over abortion.

Kypro · 51-55, M

Many ignore the mother's life when in danger from pregnancy. Killing the mother to save the child isn’t pro-life.

Kypro · 51-55, M

It’s not that simple. Those who favor forced birth should adopt children if they care that much.

LordShadowfire · 46-50, M

@Kypro I like that. That's a good idea.

Budwick · 70-79, M

Killing unborn children is wrong.
It's no more complicated than that.

Arorin · M

Everyone fighting over this issue has already been born.

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CrystalSkull · F

@SW-User Aren’t you the man? Big guy? Google is your friend, look it up yourself, if you have nothing but empty pseudo intellectual ethics to offer, go try somewhere else. I don’t have to try anything, just get a vasectomy bro…then you don’t have to worry about your precious capital.

SW-User

@CrystalSkull I have looked it up that's what I'm basing my argument on. Look. It's an emotional topic. I'm not here to fight you but I do expect you to point out where my logic fails if you are going to attack it. Rape stats I know say that abortions that take place due to rape account for around or less than 1 percent. So clearly that's not the primary reason for abortions

CrystalSkull · F

@SW-User thank you for the gift, I am fine thank you.

Torsten · 36-40, M

hmm i would argue it being wrong to end a life, but thats just me 🤷‍♂️

BizSuitStacy · M

Right vs wrong is difficult to determine as opinion and law comes into play.

I will say that human life begins with the zygote...when the sperm penetrates the egg. That's biology and anyone who says otherwise is fooling themselves.

When does the human begin to have rights? I don't know the answer.

The human nervous system begin developing around 12-16 weeks, and at that point, the fetus begins to feel. At that point, I consider abortion barbaric.

The vast majority of abortions result from unwanted pregnancies. And the vast majority of unwanted pregnancies are the result of not using birth control, or using birth control incorrectly.

I'd rather focus on preventing unwanted pregnancies.

Fukfacewillie · 56-60, M

People who vote to allow the state to force child birth are evil.

missyann · 56-60

@Fukfacewillie It is NOT forced birth. A woman is already pregnant if she chooses to abort.

A woman can do anything she wants to her body ( even taking precautions to ensure that DOESN'T get pregnant ). She shouldn't have the right to KILL another innocent human being. At fertility ( conception ) There is a unique human being with it's own DNA different from hers. This means if she aborts, she is intentionally choosing to kill an innocent human being. No other group has the right to. A woman shouldn't either

Gloomy · F

I do wish that pro abortion would just say that they believe that a woman has a right to abortion for any reason at any stage instead of " it's not a human being " or " it's not a person " or any other excuse

It's absolutely right if a women chooses to have one.
A woman should have a right to an abortion for every reason and we don't allow it at any stage because we have to define personhood and make legal arrangement by listening to scientific facts so when a foetus might have a chance of surviving outside the womb on its own we could say it is too late to abort.

It seems to me that " religious zealot " and " indoctrination " are being used to fit ones narrative.

Not necessarily given how many religious fundamentalist mistreat women who want to and who had an abortion. There is no objective, universal moral authority so you can use your personal believes and just ascribe them to a god.

eMortal · M

It’s real a woman’s choice. Doctors are just there to assess the risks and provide care. If you care so much about life go feed the hungry.

missyann · 56-60

@eMortal How do know what I support ?

Ducky · 31-35, F

In my personal opinion, there is no right or wrong to it. Both sides that are for and against abortion make compelling arguments with solid points to argue if abortion constitutes as murder or not. It's truly a debatable topic that may never reach a general consensus. However, I do believe it is also a very personal decision that should be left up to the women who gets the abortion. For that reason, I support women's rights to have them. You're not going to see me dispute it much, but those are my views and I'm sticking to them.

Spoiledbrat · F

It's only ethical to have one before the fetus is fully developed. That's why it's only legal to have one up to a certain point.

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missyann · 56-60

@Spoiledbrat Both stages

Spoiledbrat · F

@missyann That's what I said. A baby doesn't magically appear. It takes time. That is why it is legal up to a certain point only.

Spoiledbrat · F

But they are very different stages. And no one is asking you to have an abortion.

saragoodtimes · F

we're looking for bacteria growing on the moon and that's life but an unborn child is disposable. sounds crazy

BohemianBabe · M

It's possible to be an Atheist and want abortion to be illegal, but it's pretty rare because Atheists generally follow the science.

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BohemianBabe · M

@sunsporter1649 Deflection because you know you're wrong.

sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M

@BohemianBabe Since when did you become pro-life?

BohemianBabe · M

@sunsporter1649

Ryannnnnn · 31-35, M

I don't care what people call it. Sometimes life can be sad, some circumstances are unfortunate. Those who cannot accept that can shout at the wind but it will still continue to blow regardless.

independentone · M

Personally I'm against abortion unless it is for medical reasons, but I'm pro choice. I don't think the government should have the right to tell women what they can and can't do.

Doomflower · 36-40, M

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Doomflower · 36-40, M

@missyann I want you to acknowledge that sometimes there's no option that is without some level of barbarism and that in the case of Gisella what she did was mercy to the women and the fetuses they carried. The alternative was to have the pregnant person and fetus dissected alive.

missyann · 56-60

@Doomflower Yes, maybe in this case. Approximately 6 million Jewish people were helpless and slaughtered because other's failed to act and defend them.

Over 60 million helpless babies have been legally slaughtered since 1973. Like the Jewish people, for no other reason than being conceived. Today, there is no group of human beings being Persecuted like the unborn are and no reason will ever justify abortion.

missyann · 56-60

@Doomflower I do understand her reason and respect her doing what she thought was right. Her reason wasn't Selfish.

SW-User

If a woman has the right to physically abort a child I helped bring into this world, then I should have the right to financially abort any child I do not wish to claim. My wallet my choice.

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CrystalSkull · F

@SW-User you’re embarrassing yourself and I have better things to do. Nice try big guy.

SW-User

@CrystalSkull No worries. Take care of your beautiful self. ☺️

CrystalSkull · F

@SW-User have a lovely day.

TheOneyouwerewarnedabout · 46-50, MVIP

Makes Moloch happy

missyann · 56-60

@TheOneyouwerewarnedabout ?

RocktheHouse · M

@TheOneyouwerewarnedabout Exactly, imagine that - people were sacrificing their infants in biblical times. Mass graves of newborn babies have been discovered. It's no different than abortions.

TheOneyouwerewarnedabout · 46-50, MVIP

@RocktheHouse

MarineBob · 56-60, M

My problem with it is that .most want the taxpayers to pay for it

FloorGenAdm · 51-55, M

It's like potato chips I mean you can't eat just one.

MrBrownstone · 46-50, M

You don’t understand how pro choice works.

FaithfulTalia · F

It's wrong and there are so many better alternatives. There can never be enough support for pregnant women. Both mothers and the unborn life they carry are precious.

missyann · 56-60

@FaithfulTalia So agree. PCC provides everything a woman and her unborn baby needs. Pro abortion continues to try to close them down

Roundandroundwego · 61-69

You have to admit, it's best if the woman has the exclusive right to choose.
That woman in Texas wasn't wrong. But he had a gun...

SW-User

WRONG! BABIES RULE !! A TRILLION BABIES BY 2050 !! WE CAN DO IT !! THINK BABY !!

RedBaron · M

Well whoopee-dam-doo for you.

Renaci · 36-40

Please go away.

LordShadowfire · 46-50, M

So here's what I think. I think it's the woman's choice. I might not always agree with her choice. If she's getting an abortion because she was careless, forgot her pill, or told the guy to skip the condom, that's irresponsible. But trying to regulate it leads to all kinds of complications, medical and otherwise.

To me, the mother's life is more important than that of the fetus. She can always have another kid, but if she dies of cancer because her doctor couldn't give her chemotherapy because it would risk injuring the fetus, that's an even bigger tragedy. And that's happening in the world today. There was a woman in another country, whose name escapes me at the moment, who died because of that exact circumstance. And yes, the fetus died, too. But worse yet, because she died, she couldn't have another baby later on down the road. Her entire line died because of a barbaric law on the books.

And they tried to do that in Ohio last year, too. There were several cases of women being denied essential medical care, including chemotherapy, because their doctors were afraid of being prosecuted if the fetuses died. A federal judge had to step in and tell Ohio to cut the bullshit.

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OogieBoogie · F

Enter in on an argument where someone has written a saga, and USED CAPITALS to emphasise thier opinion ?
🤣😂🤣

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OogieBoogie · F

@sunsporter1649 oooh, aint you all judgey judgey and think you know my life.
You awesome christian you 😜
Must be awful being such a cranky ol man😂

sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M

@OogieBoogie Have all the abortions you want, just don't expect the rest of us to pay for it.

OogieBoogie · F

@sunsporter1649 repeating yourself doesnt make it true.😏
But you go girl.

ImperialAerosolKidFromEP · 51-55, M

Where are all the prochoicers wagging their fingers at all the men here for lecturing the OP?

babyboy42 · 41-45, M

wrong

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