Why Is It So Hard? [Spirituality & Religion]

@Harriet03
I gave you a dog to rescue.
Obviously you gave up on your dead pet. 😉

@ThatCommieChick
You have intentionally recalled wrong and misleading information.
Did you insist you knew my name too and got it wrong.
Don’t pretend you know the Bible.

@CookieLuvsBunny
No Dr. has a clue about the source of the biblical readings. I am glad you have convinced yourself that it is false.
The source of the Word makes sense and so do the witnesses to what they testified to. There is enough to find a saving Faith but you lack that. Faith is what it comes down to. I know my God and it isn’t some passive generic creator that commiechick is proposing.
There is a God you can know through
Jesus, the second Adam and yes Adam was real. Jesus has given us the opportunity to come and receive a saving knowledge of the real Living God. Accept no substitutes.

@LadyGrace I'm truly sorry to here of your injury. I sincerely hope that your recovery is swift and as painless as possible.

I've given this response a lot of thought as I don't wish my answer to sound paternalistic or deprecating. For the purpose of this particular discussion I am making the statement that Jesus existed and was crucified by the Romans. I don't think a discussion about the divinity of Jesus is necessary for what I'm about to say. I hope you can agree with that.

I don't know your background, but I'm going to assume that you had an epiphany at some time in your life. I have spoken to a number of people who have said that they found God during a "dark night of the soul." If that does not describe your position, then I apologise.

Others have had epiphanies (used in the broad sense as defined in sect 3 a) 2) of https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/epiphany)
that have not involved Jesus. So it is possible for someone to believe that their particular beliefs are the correct ones. I accept that you don't hold that you are the only one to have it right, but I'm making a point that there are some who refuse to accept that others can have their own spiritual truths.

I also had a "dark night of the soul" situation that lasted for far too many nights (read decades), that resisted pretty much every intervention that I tried. My epiphany came from reading Buddhist philosophy. That doesn't mean that I identify as a Buddhist, but that I follow some of the teachings, practices and philosophies. While I can't be called a "true Buddhist", my interpretation of the teachings does not diminish the interpretations of anyone who calls themselves a Buddhist. Similarly, someone who interprets the teachings of Jesus differently to someone else, doesn't diminish the other person's beliefs or interpretation. For me to say that your belief in your God is wrong is totally inappropriate. To say that your belief that that the Bible is historical truth (if that is what you believe) is incorrect is a different thing all together. On a spiritual level, the Bible is true, on a physical level, it is not. These are my opinions and you have every right to disagree with them.

You ask if anyone has a better way to salvation. You take salvation as eternal peaceful life after death. I see it as internal peaceful life before death. Have I achieved it? Partially, but I really do need to improve my practices lol.

As I said, these are my opinions, do with them as you will. But I do truly hope that you get well soon.

@Bushranger Thanks so much for your well wishes and speedy recovery. They are very much appreciated.

As to your interesting conclusions to my own beliefs, to which I do differ on some points, I'm afraid I'll have to discuss this at a later date. I'm really not feeling up to answering at the moment, but look forward to when I am able. In the meantime, take care.

Ok. Finally getting back to you. Sorry for the delay. @Bushranger

[quote]
I don't know your background, but I'm going to assume that you had an epiphany at some time in your life. I have spoken to a number of people who have said that they found God during a "dark night of the soul." If that does not describe your position, then I apologise. [/quote]

Yes, this is true, but it is not what one would call [i]necessary[/i] to experience Christ. Each have their own experience. It’s not at all about feelings. In other words, some believe that if they don’t “feel” God when they talk to Him, that He didn’t hear them. That is not the case, nor true at all. When I prayed to God, I was honest with Him. I told Him I wasn’t sure if he heard me at all, but I was hoping he did. I just took a chance and was trusting He did. Well, I found out real quick, the next morning after I had asked Him the night before, to save my soul and be a part of my life, that He indeed heard me! I was quite shocked that the God of this huge universe, heard little old me! 😆 Like....who am I, that He should hear me??!!! lol. But He sure did!! And it was not my imagination, as I did not even know what to expect. Or to even expect anything! When God placed His Spirit in me, as promised in scripture to new believers, many things happened. The Holy Spirit is a healer. My body was healed of sickness....and with the Holy Spirit as my teacher of spiritual things, I had a new understanding of His Word. I could now discern and understand, the things of God, including His Word. I don’t care who believes me. I know what happened to me, but I do, naturally, love to share. It’s ok if some cannot accept it. I just can't help sharing such an amazing thing that changed my life completely and for the good. That happened on July 23, 1973. I’ll never forget it. I had never believed anything like that was real or could happen. I thought some believers were faking it, but boy was I wrong. 😆 I sure found out for myself. God sure showed me he’s real. lol

[quote]Others have had epiphanies (used in the broad sense as defined in sect 3 a) 2) of https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/epiphany)
that have not involved Jesus[/quote].

Yes, absolutely. I was just going to say the same. That’s the difference. They do not involve the Lord. However, I would assume they are just as real to them, as my experience is for me.

[quote]So it is possible for someone to believe that their particular beliefs are the correct ones. I accept that you don't hold that you are the only one to have it right, but I'm making a point that there are some who refuse to accept that others can have their own spiritual truths.[/quote]

Oh yes, I’m sure, but the question [b]is[/b], from which spirit? Demonic or Holy? Satan is very clever in disguising and mimicking the Holy Spirit, deceiving many. He’s an expert at that. He never comes on as evil, to his victims. He always makes sin look innocent, fun, harmless, and very enticing, dulling the senses to consequences. With actions, come personal responsibility, which many choose to ignore altogether. Responsibility is a good thing, or we’d never grow and learn, as individuals, of course.

[quote]For me to say that your belief in your God is wrong is totally inappropriate. To say that your belief that that the Bible is historical truth (if that is what you believe) is incorrect is a different thing all together. On a spiritual level, the Bible is true, on a physical level, it is not. These are my opinions and you have every right to disagree with them. [/quote]

I wouldn’t say inappropriate. We all have a right to our opinions. You just happen to see things differently, not disrespectfully. I don’t separate my belief in God from His Word. The two go hand in hand. God [b]is[/b] the Word. Here’s what I mean by that. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The phrase "the Word" (a translation of the Greek word "Logos") is referring to Jesus, as indicated in other verses later in the same chapter.

[quote]You ask if anyone has a better way to salvation. You take salvation as eternal peaceful life after death. I see it as internal peaceful life before death. Have I achieved it? Partially, but I really do need to improve my practices lol. [/quote]

Salvation is so much more than a promise of heaven after we die. It begins the moment we accept Jesus as our personal Lord and Savior. It is then that one is given the free gift and experience of the filling of the Holy Spirit. This Holy Spirit (God’s Spirit) dwells in each, who have invited and accepted Jesus into their heart and life. This new filling, produces peace, joy, and love in the new believer. One would not really understand that, until they actually experience it, as I did, and every new believer in Christ, as well. However, I’m not talking about just believing. Even Satan believes in God, yet he is not committed to Him, nor has he asked forgiveness of his sins, so his sins still separate him from God. When we make a personal commitment to someone, that shows our heart means business. God knows our heart for Him, by our commitment to Him. He knows we truly love Him. We’re not all talk, with no commitment. He gave His all for me on the cross, when He died for my sins. I cannot give Him less. Over the years, He has proved time and time again, that He is trustworthy. He has answered many questions and prayers.

[quote]As I said, these are my opinions, do with them as you will. But I do truly hope that you get well soon.[/quote]

Thank you so much for your well wishes. I really appreciate that.

@GodSpeed63 Although yes we should keep it on track to the Epicurus quote.

@Underconstruction Good questions. Good thinking and great philosopher!

@Platoscave Yes

@Bushranger [quote]Oh, well[/quote]

Don't get me wrong, I do understand. If you will, read Matthew 23 and see how Jesus felt about man made organized religion. Have a great night my friend.

@GodSpeed63 Tell me what your definition of a man made oranised religion is.

@Bushranger Tomorrow, my friend. It's getting late here.

@Harriet03 Talking snakes? Why would I believe in talking snakes?
What do you want evidence for?

@Native Its all in the book!

@Harriet03 You aren't making any sense. Do you think I'm religious?

@newjaninev2 [quote]Really? What is it about the Theory of Evolution that leads you to make that claim?[/quote]

It's been explained to you many times over with evidence included, why do you need to hear it gain?

@newjaninev2 [quote]I don't even expect coherence, relevance, or reason[/quote]
I see he's just proven you right again. :)

@newjaninev2 @suzie1960 If nothing else, he's consistent, to the point of perseveration.

@Bushranger I have went by this one: I cant prove if free will exists or not but I can live like I did have a choice. That way if I don't have free will it doesn't matter and if I do I will have exercised it.
But having had OCD most of my life I have seen how what I want is overridden by other things. If I really had free will I could choose not to be sick.
I think many people hand onto free will cause when someone does something bad they want to blame that person and not instead see that person as a victim as well. It is a desire for vengeance that is addicting for people. They want to blame someone and they they direct blame.

@canusernamebemyusername While I pretty much believe in free will, if it didn't exist and was just a belief with no basis in fact, I wouldn't lose sleep over it.

@Bushranger Same. I don't mind a belief in free will cause if it doesn't exist I cant help it anyway. lol Ill just try to act like I do have a choice anyway:P

@Bushranger [quote]Your belief in your truth may remain the same.[/quote]

It's not my truth I believe in, it's what the Word of God says.

@GodSpeed63 Can you at least rephrase it. It's getting way too tedious.

If you are so certain of your truth, why are you scared of examining alternatives? Is your faith so tenuous that it won't withstand any examination?

@GodSpeed63 It's what you believe the "word of god" says but it isn't the truth.

@newjaninev2 Wouldn't that take us back to a steady state hypothesis?

@Bushranger I’m thinking that spacetime began with the expanding universe, so it’s meaningless to talk about ‘before’ the universe, and if there’s no before, can there be an ‘after’? If not, what are we left with?

I should emphasise that I have no position here... I’m just playing with ideas (I know how much you enjoy that)

@newjaninev2 I think I see where you are going with this, but there is still an implied beginning. While what we perceive as spacetime commenced with the expansion, that doesn't negate the existence of another spacetime prior to this one. That other would not by necessity have the same rules and laws as ours. So the question is, did that prior spacetime create ours, or did ours just come into existence independently?

You're right, I love a good discussion. There's nothing like throwing around ideas.

@Bushranger [quote] I asked if you considered harm to children as evil.[/quote]

Wouldn't you?

@GodSpeed63 Avoiding the question again.

@suzie1960 It's not even worth the effort.

@suzie1960 [quote]you really have lost it.[/quote]

Wishful thinking but I've never heard of Matron.

@GodSpeed63 That doesn't surprise me. You possibly think of her as mummy.

@suzie1960 [quote]You possibly think of her as mummy.[/quote]

For your information, my mother died in 2005 and my dad died in 1989. How are your folks doing?

@Underconstruction I can't go one God further

@Underconstruction You got that right.

@TheWildEcho Amen to that!!

@suzie1960 [quote] Just as I predicted, you failed to present any evidence to prove me wrong.[/quote]

You know better than that, Suzie Q, or do you? Well, just keep dreaming on.

@GodSpeed63 I know you're a liar without any evidence to back up your ridiculous claims. You've just proven that.

The wind is blowing, that must be the doing of Kári. It is certainly evidence of his power.

@GodSpeed63 Perhaps if God had written it entirely by himself we wouldn't have numerous interpretations of the words. It would be interesting to see if all the violence would still be in the Bible if He had.

@GodSpeed63 The man part.

@hippyjoe1955 Hey gramps, take your namenda.

@GodSpeed63 Well maybe you don't but every other believer here acts like i'm somehow less if i don't believe and get mad if i ask questions

@kodiac I'm sorry that you are being treated that way by those who themselves believers. I assure that there are true believers in Christ that are respectful to skeptics on here.

@kodiac You should ask questions, and have every right. I know Godspeed does not feel negatively towards you or your questions. He's a nice man. I feel the same as he does about how some are treating you. It's not right. Those may not be followers of Christ. Questions are always welcome.

@CharlieZ heh!

@suzie1960 [quote]I know you haven't presented any evidence.[/quote]

Isn't past your bedtime?

@GodSpeed63 Not at all but I expect your carer will soon be arriving with your night medication.

@suzie1960 😆

@CopperCicada [quote]They've never been really non-denominational though.[/quote]

Why do you say that?

@GodSpeed63 I've not found a non-denominational church that had a wide table for a variety of believers and people with different backgrounds. They might say there is no specific confession or credo. But there is-- whatever the pastor says.

@CopperCicada [quote] I've not found a non-denominational church that had a wide table for a variety of believers and people with different backgrounds. [/quote]

Our church has a variety of believers with different backgrounds and our Pastor does his best to teach the truth that God gives to Him to teach.

@BlueClapTrap I don't understand how it's subjective. There either is a god as portrayed in the bible, or there isn't. You admit that there is a lack of evidence, and it's unreasonable to believe something without sufficient evidence.

@BlueClapTrap its really not.

@Gentlequill No Quob is>:(

@Pinkstarburst Yes, That is true. We have the freedom to question and ask for proof. We are all different, that's how God made us. Each of us is unique and there are no too alike. Please understand, freedom and responsibility go hand in hand, you can't have one without the other lest your life goes into chaos. We have freedom to believe, to choose, to live, and to worship as we wish but we're responsible to believe in the truth, choose truth, to live our lives according to truth, and worship God in deed and in truth.

@JohnOinger YOU are a God!