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SW-User
There was riots in Vancouver years before when Vancouver lost the hockey playoffs. They had to shut down the subways. This in a nation mostly considered calm; Canada. Couple that, Vancouver has one of the lowest violent crime rates in Canada, but they lose the playoffs; havoc and mayhem? What for?
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SW-User
@SW-User Coincidentally, about three years back, our whole country got together and cheered on the Toronto Raptors winning the NBA championship. I wonder the outcome if they lost, Toronto has a higher crime rate (still not high), but for some reason I expect it would have been less, basketball is not our sport (though a canadian invented it), yet I think the celebration of them winning was larger than most hockey teams can say to have? So if we are talking sports, what gives? It has somewhere to do with identity.
JimboSaturn · 51-55, M
@SW-User Same when my brother was in Montreal, he was downtown helping to protect his friends shop and he said people were acting like complete morons.
JimboSaturn · 51-55, M
@SW-User The funny thing is that your "home team" comprises of players from elsewhere, they have nothing to do with you. You don't know them. Its a crazy identity thing.
Ynotisay · M
I was just thinking about that. And the answer is I have no idea. Identifying so closely to athletes competing, while you're nothing more than a passive observer, is nonsensical to me. In the U.S. there might be a fight in the stands by drunk idiots but soccer overseas is a completely differently animal. It's the only sport that consistently has the type of outcomes like in Indonesia. What the U.S. excels in are "celebrations" that result in huge property damage. Anyone caught up in mob mentality, over something they had nothing to do with, is emotionally weak. I'll never understand it.
SW-User
@Ynotisay that's it. How being a passive observer can create such a reaction in people is really confusing.
It's sad...but I think it's mostly due to lack of awareness of the collective...that said I've seen a lot of friends at my gym reach a fit level and the male ego takes over.... At that point they shun all feminine energy within because the ego is too big...the alpha thing...it's male energy can be selfish. Most sports competitive nature brings out this alpha energy. The thing is the divine duality needs of the compassion and love from the feminine energy too, so that's en example of the importance of this balance and importance of humbleness.
MasterofNone · 26-30, M
Some people use sports teams as a symbol to express their feelings. Examples would be how once the Barcelona supporters were very aggressive against Real Madrid supporters where the latent cause was that Catalonians weren't taught/allowed to speak that language in Catalonian region of Spain.
Then there was a movie about a cricket match in india, set in 19th century where some indian villagers played the game against their British rulers.
So the emotions associated with these games are probably more than just sports. It's an expression of many other things just like how artists express all their turmoil through healthy means (art) but sometimes it does not remain healthy and the means of expression shifts.
I suppose the real question is how can we escape this sad sad condition isn't it? And I wish we were not so touchy-feely-crazy Kind of people but we are. 😂
In a world where we fight over so many small things, there definitely is an end of the spectrum where we kill over small things lol and that's terrifying and meaningless even but as isolated events, perhaps fascinating too
Then there was a movie about a cricket match in india, set in 19th century where some indian villagers played the game against their British rulers.
So the emotions associated with these games are probably more than just sports. It's an expression of many other things just like how artists express all their turmoil through healthy means (art) but sometimes it does not remain healthy and the means of expression shifts.
I suppose the real question is how can we escape this sad sad condition isn't it? And I wish we were not so touchy-feely-crazy Kind of people but we are. 😂
In a world where we fight over so many small things, there definitely is an end of the spectrum where we kill over small things lol and that's terrifying and meaningless even but as isolated events, perhaps fascinating too
SW-User
@MasterofNone interesting points.
ABCDEF7 · M
I think the reason lies in groupism. When they get the power of similar ill minded people with an advantage to not getting identified, accused & arrested individually, the devil inside them is free to act.
All the moral & civility was just because of the social & legal fear. The inside reality gets exposed.
All the moral & civility was just because of the social & legal fear. The inside reality gets exposed.
SW-User
@ABCDEF7 So that kind of barbarism is inherent in human psyche. Yeah. It is showing up in a lot of places.
ABCDEF7 · M
@SW-User Not in every human, It depends on how someone has grown themselves. But unfortunately there are many.
CopperCicada · M
Why do people identify with a political ideology to the point that they engage in violence?
Why do people engage in religious practice to the point that they engage in violence?
Is there a difference between these and people who are violent over sports?
Why do people engage in religious practice to the point that they engage in violence?
Is there a difference between these and people who are violent over sports?
CopperCicada · M
@SW-User I remember growing up and watching people drag actual alligators by their pickup trucks through the neighborhood when Georgia beat Florida. Just tie one up to the trailer hitch. Seems a very similar identification as politics and faith.
SW-User
@CopperCicada yes it seems so. Why though is what is confusing.
Slade · 56-60, M
@CopperCicada OMG
dancingtongue · 80-89, M
It is just an extreme form of tribalism: you have no choice as to race, ethnicity, (or to a lesser extent the country, religion) you are born into, but you pretty much choose the sports team you root for. So those who tend to become intolerant, rabid believers in "my way is the only true way", are even more so.
SW-User
@dancingtongue ah. Some form of control in their lives? Interesting point.
Riverman2 · 56-60, M
It is incredible how the herd gets worked up into a violent stampede. Perhaps we ought to take note of this and cool down the political rhetoric a bit,?
SW-User
@Riverman2 What causes the herd to get so worked up?
Riverman2 · 56-60, M
@SW-User I don't know exactly what triggers people to act like devil possessed animals. I am just saying all this spewing of hatred seems to be pushing towards something awful. We better all find some common ground to focus on.
popmol · 26-30, M
its adrenaline, colloseum. it builds on all frustration put people into camps and such.
its the closest you'll get to our most animalistic ways that is not sex.
its the closest you'll get to our most animalistic ways that is not sex.
SW-User
@popmol it just feels so wrong.
popmol · 26-30, M
@SW-User well its what colloseums in modern years are
alan20 · M
That's something I've wondered since early childhood and I think the main reason why I've never had any interest in team sports; I appreciate there are other aspects, like the development of social co-operation. There may be an analogy with nationalism and more obviously racism. Violence is wrong except in clear self-defence and defence of loved ones or those who are definitely the victims.
alan20 · M
@SW-User It seems to be a confusion of the two extremes - love and hate. Showing your own "gang" how much you love them by attacking another. On a more basic level it's ignorant perversion, like the bully looking for someone weaker to prove his or her greater power. I expect it comes from a deep feeling of inadequacy. I wonder if it has increased or was always so.
SW-User
@alan20 I wonder too. When you put it like that, you can see that behaviour on here too on a lower scale when someone is being verbally attacked and herds join in, a lot out of hearsay. So perhaps it is an inherent trait in us.
alan20 · M
@SW-User I can't see you as a member of a posse demanding a lynching but American western movies used to condemn such behaviour more than they do now - I think. Possibly social media has increased the public appetite for gossip, rumours, victimisation. If so it's a poor comment on what society has come to. And leads back to your original question !
SW-User
Disgusting, that whole behavior. Too bad they didn't care that much about real important issues.
SW-User
@SW-User when people are so reactive, they can't see the real things.
SubstantialKick · 36-40, M
Sports is basically a religion for some people.
SW-User
@SubstantialKick Yes, so it seems.
Mamapolo2016 · F
Strains my mind to realize a football match is collectively more dangerous to life than a widespread hurricane.
Mamapolo2016 · F
@SW-UserFrom what I read, the sore loser fans stormed the pitch and fighting started. The police arrived and released tear gas to dispel the rioters, which panicked everybody and they stampeded.
That's my take from the news. I have been wrong before.
That's my take from the news. I have been wrong before.
SW-User
@Mamapolo2016 So it's still the losing that is eliciting this violence.
Mamapolo2016 · F
@SW-User Can't argue with that. I was just saying that they might not have foreseen all those deaths.
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SW-User
@SW-User in what way?
therighttothink50 · 56-60, M
Pea brains.
SW-User
@therighttothink50 why though?
JimboSaturn · 51-55, M
Group think? Same as primitive men going to war. Funny once you stop watching sports for a while, you start seeing it as silly and ridiculous.
SW-User
@JimboSaturn Indeed
alan20 · M
@JimboSaturn I find it extraordinary that so many Irish, including my own son, are fanatical about English football teams !
JimboSaturn · 51-55, M
@alan20 At least he should cheer for an Irish team, see there is the tribalism that is at the bottom of this shit lol
Coppercoil · M
Its misdirected internal anger.. its a very long answer.. but youll find the core of it in the roman gladiatorial games and how they were used to keep the masses focused on other things and not the government and systems that control them.
plungesponge · 41-45, M
I've never understood sports mania. Always seemed creepy af to me to be cheering on some other dude and use the credit for his physical prowess to lord over other people, and cuss him out when he doesn't perform
SW-User
@plungesponge I remember how rowdy it used to get when footie matches were played and there was intense energy you could feel around. I would feel intimidated in tubes/trains when it held a whole group of these fans.
But this is a whole new level.
But this is a whole new level.
Rolexeo · 26-30, M
It brings out the tribalism in people. Tbh I don't understand why sports have this effect tho, it couldn't be anymore barebones, essentially they're just wearing different colors
SW-User
@Rolexeo Yeah. It is bizarre how identified people get to their teams.
bookerdana · M
Fan,of course is short for fanatic and in the stadium its the truest of the true believers.Many sports have an inherent violent component ....add alcohol and you have a riot
SW-User
@bookerdana I did not know fan was derived from fanatic. But yeah it makes sense.
Iwillwait · M
It's really just like any other war or conflict derived by prejudices. We are a violent species.
Iwillwait · M
@SW-User Humans like "Sides," , " Conflict," , "Belonging," and "Violence."
SW-User
@Iwillwait That makes sense. You are so right.
Iwillwait · M
@SW-User Not sure I want to be "So right," about something so wrong.
Elessar · 26-30, M
People used to gather at the arenas to see people (slaves) getting butchered, society hasn't evoved that much since there. Humanity is and will always be tribalistic at the core
SW-User
@Elessar You'd think civilisation brought some level of civility in humans. But you're right, at the core people are just tribal.
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SW-User
@jshm2 Passion? Killing other humans because they are of the opposing team is passion? Or barbarism?
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Unlearn · 41-45, M
People start seeing it as more than mere sports. They start identifying with it and it becomes us vs them...
SW-User
@Unlearn Some kind of brainwashing going on there. I don't know how or what, lol. But identifying with something as impersonal as sport is weird.
eMortal · M
Don’t forget it’s Indonesia, they don’t deal with small numbers.
SW-User
@eMortal tbh I don't know much about that country or its culture.
eMortal · M
@SW-User let’s just say the stadium was overcrowded. Officially about 6,000 more people than the intended capacity 40,000. I saw the images. It looks like there were 20,000 more.
SW-User
The issue in the U.K had more to do with religious tensions.
SW-User
@SW-User yeah I get that. But the game also triggers their tension.
SW-User
@SW-User true
It's an ongoing problem with Hindus and Muslims though
It's an ongoing problem with Hindus and Muslims though
the primate lurks just beneath the surface
SW-User
@metaldog Yeah
Absence of True Sportsmanship - i.e. Team spirit.
eMortal · M
Emotions
SW-User
@eMortal barbaric ones.
Justenjoyit · 61-69, M
For me its all basic human behaviour
SW-User
@Justenjoyit Was it always like this?
Justenjoyit · 61-69, M
@SW-User I dont know I dont follow sports but I watch how people just get so enthusiastic about it all like a heard of animals lol
SW-User
Humans are still barbarians for the most part, and people who like sports tend to be even moreso
SW-User
@SW-User yes. To get that invested in competitive sport is certainly feeding some primal need.
TjNewton · M
I'm a huge football fan it's tragic some were murdered that has gone beyond rivalry it's turned into a war i'm shocked tbh
SW-User
@TjNewton Yes. Really shocking.
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SW-User
@SoLeRiMix I did not know all that about Indonesia football clubs. Wow.
SoLeRiMix · 31-35, M
@SW-User You know it now.😇
[media=https://youtu.be/7oxSwYv0wVo]
[media=https://youtu.be/7oxSwYv0wVo]
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SW-User
@SW-User I suppose that is what makes humans so dangerous.