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What do you think of men who do this?

At work we have this trash collector. He's a young guy of 20 or 22.

He frequently lowers his gaze when he talks to women. Like he never looks you in the eye. Just the 1st glance then he looks down/away.

He's a religious muslim and in Islam that's part of the teachings. It's called غض البصر. Don't stare so you don't get turned on.

But it's an obsolete one nowadays and most don't do it anyway.

Some women get offended by the extreme lack of eye contact. Some are trying to mock & tease him.

As a whole we kinda find it funny & out of place bc he's overdoing it. With the guys his eye contact is just fine.

But – personally I kinda feel bad for him and think it's cute. He's very polite and sort of shy otherwise. I told my female coworkers to leave him tf alone.
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revenant · F
He could just be very shy. Not very nice of some to tease him or get annoyed
revenant · F
@littlepuppywantanewlife imagine a scenario where guys would gang up on some girl because she is *too* shy..
@revenant I have seen bizzare. Guys watching foreigners as if they haven't ever seen a beautiful woman. It's gross when people stare constantly and ganged up.
PatKirby · M
@revenant

Sounds familiar, I used to live with two Muslims and they were the same way. I respect that, he's probably still a virgin. Not harming anyone.
Carissimi · F
They should leave him be. Men can’t win. If they “look” they are accused of sexual harassment, if they don’t look, the guy is mocked. These women need to look in the mirror. You just can’t please some of them. They are offended either way. I feel sorry for men in this respect. He’s a young guy, and these women are being disrespectful to him and his beliefs. It’s disgusting.
Good for you!
Teasing would only make him feel worse.
People should never be made to feel uncomfortable or unwelcome in their place of work.
SW-User
Indeed. Especially when someone is young and has a job like his. It is already low-paying & unpleasant. Must feel like bullying.
@hartfire
Carissimi · F
It is bullying. @SW-User
Misanthropic · 26-30, M
I don't look people in the eyes unless I either know them very well or dislike them. The reason is I have had negative experiences with people being intimidated by me looking them in the eyes. There is a level of eye contact you are supposed to maintain before it is considered threatening. Too much work to get the right balance.
@Misanthropic that tracks. Im sure ive inadvertently creepered with these peepers.
This comment is hidden. Show Comment
My eyeballs did you a heck or you did someone else a heck with yours?
Matt85 · 36-40, M
I do that. It helps me to be confident.
Matt85 · 36-40, M
@SW-User I'm not sure exactly how it works, it just kinda calms the soul, maybe even bores it a little... But it's a good boredom. Out of sight, out of mind.
SW-User
I see. Btw that parrot is darn cute @Matt85
Matt85 · 36-40, M
@SW-User Yes, Patrice is lovely.
BlueVeins · 22-25
Sexual repression is a pernicious infection.
TheOrionbeltseeker · 36-40, M
@SW-User I Have seen guys 35 years old and following the same, will treat you with utmost respect but at the same time, will do their vows to the Lord they care about. It's not about thinking women as sexual object rather it is trying to be sinless in his own eyes.

In this case, Maybe he is just too young but I think he will flourish as he age.
pianoplayingsteve · 31-35, M
@BlueVeins I live in an Islamic country and everyone just looks at everyone else like normal.
BlueVeins · 22-25
@pianoplayingsteve Yeah, that's bc they all watch 4 hours of porn in secret when they get homeeeee
Classified · M
It doesn't seem like a big issue, I think. Eye contract would be nice, but he's not harming anyone.
Moon3624 · 18-21, F
It seems like the man is minding his own business without harming anyone as he tries to lead a modest life.
Those women are wasting their time backbiting this poor man while he on the other hand seems to be focusing on his career and relationship with God.

Your post reminded me of :
واللهِ لَوْ صَحِبَ الإِنْسَانُ جِبْرِيْلا ... لَمْ يَسْلَمِ الْمَرْءُ مِنْ قَالٍ وَمِنْ قِيْلا
قَدْ قِيْلَ فِي اللهِ أَقْوَالٌ مُصَنَّفةٌ ... تُتْلَى إِذَا رُتِّل القُرْآنتَرْتِيَْلا
قَدْ قِيْلَ أَنَّ لَهُ وَلَدًا وَصَاحِبَةً ... زُوْرًا عَلَيْهِ وَبُهْتَانًاوَتَضْلِيْلا
هَذَا قَوْلُهُمْ فِي اللهِ خَالِقِهِمْ ... فَكَيْفَ لَوْ قِيْلَ فِيْنَا بَعْضُمَا قِيْلا
—-
الناس لاتسلم من كلام الناس
SW-User
هو بصراحة
كيحيد عينو على البنات
بطريقة مبالغ بها شوية
بحالا شاف شي جنية ههه
و لكن اكيد كنحترم هادشي
خصوصاً انه شاب مهذب
@Moon3624
cherokeepatti · 61-69, F
He’s not hurting anyone and they do need to leave him alone. It’s much better than talking to a man who is looking at your boobs.
SW-User
Haha true @cherokeepatti
cherokeepatti · 61-69, F
@SW-User high functioning autistic people also have problems sometimes making eye contact.
throughTheMotions · 51-55, M
The way I see it, He is a man of convictions and he stays true to what he believes. It's not my place to question what drives his beliefs, but he's not hurting anyone.

It can be misconstrued though. I've seen this in the workplace be seen as disrespectful towards women.
Justmeraeagain · 56-60, F
I never understood picking on someone who hasn't done anything offensive or cruel just different.
That also shows a lack of confidence. You say he’s shy. That’s just another way of showing you that’s true.
When I was 12 I went to an eye doctor and the nurse would frequently lash out at me for no reason. It scared me.

Later on, I realized I kept lowering my gaze.

Guys don't realize they do it. Some learn earlier than others.

You're sweet for defending him.
SW-User
What a trashy nurse. The essence of her job is to be caring AND you were just a kid. I'm sorry she treated you like that ):
@SinlessOnslaught
@SW-User Awww thanks. I learned from it though. I look women in the eyes.

Sounds like this guy just hasn't had his "nurse lashing out" moment yet. 😆

Maybe you could say something to him subtly or hint somehow? I'm not sure what you could do or say but it's something to think about.
SW-User
I am glad you learned from it with a positive attitude (:

I am being casually nice. I greet him and say thank you but I don't engage in personal conversations bc from what I've seen with other women, it definitely makes him feel uncomfortable.

@SinlessOnslaught
4meAndyou · F
You are absolutely correct. Personally, I look down if I see someone of the opposite sex whom I find extremely attractive. Feeling that attraction makes me feel shy.
Northwest · M
It's very difficult to shed one's "family of origin" issues. He's the janitor, so presumably from a lower income family, mired in religious prejudice.

I've worked with people in the tech industry, from deeply religious Muslim countries who did the same. They also would passive-aggressively avoid communicating with female engineers. I found it very disrespectful and insulting to women. While the poorly educated janitor's world may be too small to see the bigger picture, these guys know better.

One of these days, we'll stop believing religion is a thing. Maybe.
SW-User
I hate those passive aggressive controlling types. This guy is meek & soft spoken. He is enduring the teasing with calmness. I'm trying to notice his qualities as a person as well.
صحيح بخصوص المعتقد ذاته
الهدف من غض البصر هو عدم إثارة الغرائز
ولكن حينما يكون بشكل مبالغ به
أنا كامرأة أشعر و كأنني مجرد جسد بلا عقل أو روح
شعور مزعج
خصوصاً عندما يكون الرجل متشدداً و له نزعات عنيفة
@Northwest
Northwest · M
@SW-User You're describing a guy, who's intimidated by his family, and the teasing he gets. It's an accident of birth. The same guy, born to a more affluent, educated and open minded family, would be an asset to any partner he chooses.

As to what you said in Arabic, I feel for you. I cannot imagine how degrading it is, to be looked at (or in this case, not looked at), to be held responsible for men's hormones, just for being a woman. But in Abrahamic religions, a woman is the original temptress, and Adam was simply minding his own business, when Eve made him eat the forbidden fruit.

Christianity pretty much got over it, Islam has yet to reform. Israel is taking a step backward, its new government is going to introduce legislation to force gender separation.
black4white · 56-60, M
i dont know the guy or the situation but have ya thought it has nothing to do with religious belief..maybe the guy is just all out shy when it comes to women...this alone happens to many many men. He is probably just far more comfortable with men then women...

If the guy was staring at boobs and being disrespectful i am sure this post would have a different tune... i bet this...if you start talking to him and he was comfortable with you(or any female) he is more apt to look them in the eyes and the conversation would feel more normal.

Thanks for standing up for the young fella. Just a very shy guy when it comes to women.
SW-User
He is religious. He recites Quran on his breaks & prays on time. Also the way he avoids looking is exaggerated. It's clear he's making a conscious effort besides being shy @black4white
black4white · 56-60, M
@SW-User Thanks for the clarity and in that case just leave the young man alone...i think you have done right by him so for that i applaud you. You are a blessing ....:-)
WhateverWorks · 36-40
I think people put way too much importance on eye contact and should pay more attention to the tone of someone’s voice.

Some cultures considered eye contact disrespectful and aggressive. Some people feel uncomfortable. Some considerate it a gateway something sexual. 🤷🏻‍♀️
Hassan · 22-25, M
Well , looking down means he's turned on or will get.
This is not strength dear, islam is all about repression .. It's easier to not think of a pink elephant when u don't repress yourself from it.
For long, religions portrayed women as evil who'll drift u away from god.
I can have sex everyday and be close to god.
We were born from sex, if sex wasn't pleasureble you wouldn't do it.
We destroyed women in the middle east, repressed sexual thoughts and now what we got? Men addicted to porn, can't make a conversation with women, rape...

We should look at things from the big image Asmae and be realistic. We as species don't know anything abt sex.
Look at how miserable people are bcz religions taught them that they only should have sex with one partner. They turn their marriage to fights and hell.

We should alll tell these men wether they r religious ,monks priests... that Celibacy is enough, enough spending time with boyfriends😂😂 get to know girls, they're not evil.

Like a child stops playing with his toys on the onset of 9-10 without Celibacy or repression,one stops sex once he discovers something more intense. It's a stage of growing that should be embraced.

Unless these people had to go celibate to stop playing with toys then idk😂😂😂
Moon3624 · 18-21, F
@Hassan
You couldn’t reply to any of the points I mentioned not even the last one so you started to throw random words.

Anyways,

Al-Kahf - Verse 103-105

{
Say, ˹O Prophet,˺ “Shall we inform you of who will lose the most deeds?
˹They are˺ those whose efforts are in vain in this worldly life, while they think they are doing good!”
It is they who reject the signs of their Lord and their meeting with Him, rendering their deeds void, so We will not give their deeds any weight on Judgment Day.}

Have a good day 💆‍♀️
Hassan · 22-25, M
@Moon3624 back again to copy paste 😂
It's over, no one cares .
Debates r pointless , only time can tell.
It's good to eat, be nice human, love n be loved , laugh,breath... otherwise idc, if I'm doing smth bad I'll get karma. Bye for now
Moon3624 · 18-21, F
@Hassan
You cannot handle an adult conversation
So you started to throw random childish comments like “no one cares it’s over “

Leave the verses aside , You couldn’t reply to one single point I made.

Indeed, goodbye.
yeronlyman · 51-55, M
Culturally there will be norms

From my perceptive that’s sad
Cultural oppression has female but also male “victims”

Regardless of what females think
And what society thinks
Many men suffer terrible loneliness
Just nobody ever bothered asking them
MountainMonk89 · 51-55, M
Respect and reverence is such a rare commodity nowadays, that I don't begrudge anyone trying to keep it as a habit.
Moon3624 · 18-21, F
Both genders in Islam have to غض البصر not only men
Which is basically not to sexually check the other gender out .
Of course there are times when you need to look at the other gender when you ask questions or in court or business related
Just like how the women used to look at prophet Mohammed when he would give khutba or when They’d ask him questions and vice versa.
—-
"
فنظر الرجل إلى المرأة ونظر المرأة إلى الرجل مباح بشرط ألا يكون النظر لموضع عورة من الرجل أو المرأة وألا يقترن النظر بشهوة وإلا فيحرم النظر مطلقا.
مما حرمه الإسلام - في مجال الغريزة الجنسية- إطالة النظر من الرجل إلى المرأة ومن المرأة إلى الرجل. فإن العين مفتاح القلب
"
JimboSaturn · 56-60, M
I think it's his choice and it comes from a good place.
You're very kind but it's sad that he's so sexually repressed that he's afraid of even acknowledging to himself that a woman is attractive.. sexual tension is going to stunt his emotional growth
@SW-User
He probably will never learn the basics and basic is all his relationship will ever be.
SW-User
@SW-User Basics to handle a wife? I'm thinking he's probably one of the lucky ones and so will his wife be... they can grow and learn with each other. It's a concept the world at large has forgotten.
SW-User
I didn't say it ain't possible. I said I wonder *how* when someone has such minimal exposure to the opposite sex. @SW-User
Magnolia21 · 22-25, F
The guys who stare too much are thirsty. The guys who look away are afraid of offending. And the guys who look the perfect amount aren't interested.
MartinTheFirst · 26-30, M
@Magnolia21 That's too easy to hack though, it's deeper than that. You can read them more clearly in person.
alan20 · M
He's fighting between his upbringing/conditioning and his attraction to girls. Show him kindness.
I doubt I'd mind it. Seems like a good dude.
Maybe he is extremely shy and adding those religious ties ,even if not as common but still existent in culture, adds to the shyness
He is young haha
IamBack · 31-35, M
احسن ما يبحلق 😅 الله يقويه
YoMomma ·
I oh i heard somewhere they aren't allowed to make eye contact with women.. its like a sexual offense of something . Or maybe he is shy idk .. but they shouldn't harass him over it
blindbob · 41-45
i think it's hot.
They assume too much .

They aren't him, they dont know him, they can't know for sure thier assumptions are correct .

He could be just shy , as you say
Amylynne · 31-35, F
so many men from that world do a lot of eye aversion, if find it more comfortable than the ones that go into howling catcalls at The American Slut. we all sholud feel safe to make eye contact but allass to often it becmoes and invitation to be.. interfered with
that said, I make eye contact a lot./ and be ready to look strong and happy
SW-User
Damn. Back in my 12th grade, I used to stare straight at our English teacher's eyes when she was looking at me. When she wasn't looking, I'd stare at the boobies. 😬
Anyway, never got into trouble. I was a good student lol
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DDonde · 31-35, M
I don't think anything about him at all
MartinTheFirst · 26-30, M
Yeah just leave him alone
deadgerbil · 26-30, M
It sucks and unfortunately he drank the religious bs Kool aid but hopefully they lessen up on him since he seems to be innocuous
SW-User
Yeah. I am giving him credit on his own unique character as a person regardless of his beliefs. He is very gentle. @deadgerbil
SkeetSkeet · 100+, F
I found it weird 😂 he was trying not to make eye contact with me and a couple times when he did, he panicked. His mom was there too so she probably thought I was seducing him with my haram eyeballs.
I am same shit 😂

 
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