LeopoldBloom · M
It was never their country. There has never been a Palestinian homeland. It was under Ottoman control, then British, and they were offered, for the first time in history, their own country in 1948. They turned that down and attempted to take over the entire area and obliterate every Jew living there, and failed. They wanted a judenrein Middle East, despite the fact that there has been a continuous Jewish presence there for thousands of years.
Also, several Arab countries have made peace with Israel. This latest attack is from Hamas, which doesn't represent all Arabs and doesn't even represent all Palestinians.
By the way, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem did support Hitler, so based on your doctrine of collective guilt, the Palestinians are responsible for European antisemitism.
Also, several Arab countries have made peace with Israel. This latest attack is from Hamas, which doesn't represent all Arabs and doesn't even represent all Palestinians.
By the way, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem did support Hitler, so based on your doctrine of collective guilt, the Palestinians are responsible for European antisemitism.
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Guitarman123 · 31-35, M
@Thinkerbell its the same subject. The ussr and Germany had no association back then as Germany didn't have a socialist revolution like lenin and trotsky hoped would occur as they saw Germany as a potentially powerful ally in spreading socialism throughout the world. Ussr economy suffered because of the russian civil war
Thinkerbell · 41-45, F
@Guitarman123
Nonsense.
Both countries had an interest in the arrangement they consummated.
The Red Army needed expert modernization, and the Germans needed an area outside of Germany where they could secretly train airmen, armor crewmen and develop new weapons, in contravention of the Versailles treaty.
The notion that Lenin and Trotsky wouldn't have known about this is absurd,
like nearly all of your notions, Guitsie. 🙄
And stop using the silly euphemism "socialist revolution" for the communist revolution in Russia.
(Yes, yes, I know... they hadn't achieved communism according to Marxist theory [and never would, of course] )
Germany HAD a socialist revolution. The Kaiser was deposed and social DEMOCRATS led the majority coalition for most of the duration of the German Weimar Republic, unlike the one-party "socialist" dictatorship that was established in Russia.
Now scurry off to some other irrelevancy, Guitsie,
and dodge answering the points I raised, as usual. 🤣
Nonsense.
Both countries had an interest in the arrangement they consummated.
The Red Army needed expert modernization, and the Germans needed an area outside of Germany where they could secretly train airmen, armor crewmen and develop new weapons, in contravention of the Versailles treaty.
The notion that Lenin and Trotsky wouldn't have known about this is absurd,
like nearly all of your notions, Guitsie. 🙄
And stop using the silly euphemism "socialist revolution" for the communist revolution in Russia.
(Yes, yes, I know... they hadn't achieved communism according to Marxist theory [and never would, of course] )
Germany HAD a socialist revolution. The Kaiser was deposed and social DEMOCRATS led the majority coalition for most of the duration of the German Weimar Republic, unlike the one-party "socialist" dictatorship that was established in Russia.
Now scurry off to some other irrelevancy, Guitsie,
and dodge answering the points I raised, as usual. 🤣
Guitarman123 · 31-35, M
@Thinkerbell someone should have told lenin and trotsky that a "socialist revolution " happened in Germany, would have benefitted them so much and their economy wouldnt have suffered as much after the russian civil war. Sadly they both died thinking Germany had no such revolution and wasn't interested in allying with the ussr.
GailCob · 61-69, F
Wrong!
You incorrectly report this as direct speech. It is not. It's more like one of the million says attributed to Einstein.
Its correct attribution is to Nahum Goldmann, a well-known critic of Ben Gurion. It is alleged it was said to him in a private conversation in 1953. If you can report verbatim as direct speech over one hundred words spoken to you some time in the past, and part of a much larger conversation, then congratulations of you genius memory.
This alleged quotation should be taken with a very large packet of salt, both because of its author's antipathy to ben Gurion, but also the impossibility that such accuracy could be obtained in reported speech.
You incorrectly report this as direct speech. It is not. It's more like one of the million says attributed to Einstein.
Its correct attribution is to Nahum Goldmann, a well-known critic of Ben Gurion. It is alleged it was said to him in a private conversation in 1953. If you can report verbatim as direct speech over one hundred words spoken to you some time in the past, and part of a much larger conversation, then congratulations of you genius memory.
This alleged quotation should be taken with a very large packet of salt, both because of its author's antipathy to ben Gurion, but also the impossibility that such accuracy could be obtained in reported speech.
Guitarman123 · 31-35, M
@tigard after ww2 the united nations instead of giving Palestine independence, they told them to share the lands with israel which Palestine turned down because they didn't want to share their land with settlers. Early jews who lived in Palestine in around 1882 were actually welcomed by the arabs and lived there peacefully. Its only when zionists made their intentions to invade the land clear that Palestine started showing signs of resistance. Actually England gave such responsibility to the united nations who like i said told Palestine to share their land with people of israel. Again, it was the zionists such as david ben gurion who put into preparation the ethnic cleansing of Palestine as they had greater military resources. Palestine simply wanted to be able to live on their lands in peace and independently pf England or the united nations
tigard · 41-45, C
@Guitarman123 Ethnic cleansing...lol.
The Zionist concept does not exclude non-Jews from living there with full benefits.
There was no Palestine. That area was a colony of Great Britain, and as such, GB, along with the UN was in a position to say "we're going to keep this area as a British colony," or "we're going to facilitate the establishment of two new countries in this area." It's important to recognize that GB didn't give away Palestinian property to the Jewish state; they transferred governance of the area to what would become Israel. Similarly, the intention was to transfer governance of another section of that land to the Palestinian people, but as I said above, because of the land grab of the adjacent Arab countries, that never happened.
The Zionist concept does not exclude non-Jews from living there with full benefits.
There was no Palestine. That area was a colony of Great Britain, and as such, GB, along with the UN was in a position to say "we're going to keep this area as a British colony," or "we're going to facilitate the establishment of two new countries in this area." It's important to recognize that GB didn't give away Palestinian property to the Jewish state; they transferred governance of the area to what would become Israel. Similarly, the intention was to transfer governance of another section of that land to the Palestinian people, but as I said above, because of the land grab of the adjacent Arab countries, that never happened.
Guitarman123 · 31-35, M
@tigard it really does. They have no place for anybody who doesn't follow zionism. Sorry, but their was a Palestine that was under occupation by england prior to the uk putting the decision of what to do with Palestine and israel to the united nations. It was the united nations that told Palestinians to share the lands with israel amd that eventually lead to zionists ethnically cleansing the people of Palestine by destroying hundreds of villages and forcibly evacuating innocent men, women and children who already lived on the lands. Palestine was never promised its own land and zionists believed that they we're entitled to commit the actions they did because god promised them the land
SamInAZ · 41-45, M
@Guitarman123 that's what happens when we are taught that some people are more inherently special than others because of horrible things that happened in their past...you end up with a society full of people that fear speaking up because they don't want to be labeled as "the bad ones" over seeing those people as humans capable of both good & evil.
Richard65 · M
There's a lot of debate about Arabs, Jews, Palestinians, etc, all claiming this homeland or that territory. The fact is that people who had been living in a specific location for generations, irrelevant of ethnic or religious heritage, background or beliefs, were effectively just turfed out of their family homes, homes they'd lived in forever, so their homes and land could be given to the victims of a global war and genocide from Europe.
If someone came to your family home in London or New York and threw you out so it could be given to someone else, how would you react?
If someone came to your family home in London or New York and threw you out so it could be given to someone else, how would you react?
Guitarman123 · 31-35, M
@SW-User i support Palestine as an independent people
tigard · 41-45, C
@Guitarman123 So you're opposed to the existence of the nation of Israel, right?
Guitarman123 · 31-35, M
@tigard im opposed to zionism and it oppressing people
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IronHamster · 56-60, M
@Guitarman123 ...still spiraling down down down...
Guitarman123 · 31-35, M
@IronHamster i don't see you saluting the flag
IronHamster · 56-60, M
@Guitarman123 You really want the last word, don't you? It must mean so much to your miserable existence. Ok. Go ahead. Say something and I won't respond. Make it a zinger so I feel entertained reading it.
SW-User
@tigardMore lies to promote hatred for the Palestinians. Hitler didn’t need anyone to tell him what to do. What you claim is ridiculous and false lies. It’s all a plan to gather hatred for a specific ethnic group that are powerless. Hitler was a mad man and what he did only came from his mind only. Stop spreading lies like the media. Many people know these accusations are lies. The truth always comes out.
tigard · 41-45, C
@Guitarman123 @SW-User "the media is pro israel"
More antisemitic tropes. Open your eyes. Where today is the media pro-Israel?
But that's the kind of propaganda you and your type promote.
More antisemitic tropes. Open your eyes. Where today is the media pro-Israel?
But that's the kind of propaganda you and your type promote.
SW-User
@tigard Oh now you’re accusing us of being antisemitic- of course. I don’t hate innocent Isrealis. I want peace and peace means not committing genocide in Gaza. I’m done with you. Blocked
Guitarman123 · 31-35, M
@tigard the bbc and has been for years
smiler2012 · 61-69
@Guitarman123 it is called religious tolerance granted old wounds run deep between the muslims and israel .but it is rather like the next door neighbour you have you hate they are there and there is nothing much you can do too change that fact. so rather seek aggression and conflict look for peace and tolerance
btchstfu · F
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basilfawlty89 · 36-40, M