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No way forward for America

Having watched the smoke clear and the dust settle a little, I asked myself the question, "What happens next for America?" And there are no acceptable options. None.. America was on life support with printed currency. Chinese manufacturing and Arab oil, while the world admired the Emperors new clothes.. But thats gone now, with the government of "Evil McNasty" about to take over and bury the rotting body..America is about to become a street hooker for the few rich people left and its not going to be pretty.. And there is no escape. Even the fanciful idea of rounding up and shooting the facists before they take over is a complete betrayal of American values..America sold its place in the future of the world and it is the fault of American voters...
https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/trump-is-america-not-a-fluke/
Elessar · 26-30, M
Every empire comes with an expiry date
Elessar · 26-30, M
@BohemianBabe They either become paranoid or they don't live long. Nobody's safe in authoritarianism: neither the troops, nor the upper class, nor the governing elite, not the leader. It's indeed literally an "everybody loses" scenario.
@Elessar From Julius Caesar to Engelbert Dollfuss.
Elessar · 26-30, M
@BohemianBabe Caesar wasn't paranoid enough lol
GuiltyBiStander · 31-35, F
@whowasthatmaskedman

Maybe it feels like trolling to you, because you keep getting tangled up in your own misinformed biases.

What I want is just some clear facts and honest answers.

When you blurt out how
"America was on life support with printed currency, Chinese manafacturing, and Arab oil" what are you really talking about? Is that an economic view, political, or just emotional venting?? And when you jump from that to " Bury the rotting body, America about the become a street hooker, there is no escape..." is that supposed to be a logical conclusion or something you pulled out of your horoscope?? Then you double down in comments playing bogus fear cards about how China or the Arabs will just stop shipping consumer goods or oil, without explaining how or why - or even mentioning that the US is now the world's leading producer of oil and natural gas.

As far as trying to lecture me about the difference between domestic commercial debt, and debt held by foreign creditors - I'm not sure that you really understand the relationship so please don't try.

You're entitled to your own personal feelings, and your opinions. You can believe that the world is flat, or in fire breathing dragons if that suits you. It's still a free country. But when you offer up something like this as a discussion based on facts, have some real facts and expect reasonable debate.

Otherwise it's just you telling everyone you're having a bad day. And if that's really what's up here, thanks for sharing and I hope you feel better soon ✌
GuiltyBiStander · 31-35, F
@whowasthatmaskedman

Well "mate",
you're not just living in another country, it's evidently a different world.

Take care & be well.
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@GuiltyBiStander I can concede we are certainly on different planets..Good luck with yours..😷
GuiltyBiStander · 31-35, F
@whowasthatmaskedman

Lovely sentiments, but I think you'll find it's a small world ... after all.
GuiltyBiStander · 31-35, F
Excuse me Mr. World Banker, but I see a thick cloud of smoke covering up a lot of information - and I think it's coming from your direction 😑

Since you care so much about numbers and balance sheets, how come you're not pointing out that by far the biggest share of US
government debt is domestically held ? :


Oh! And that terrible foreign debt held by all those evil overseas money lenders, just waiting to send us the bill and bankrupt poor old Uncle Sam? It's $7.9 trillion as of August 2024 - But that's only anout half of what THEY OWE US :


That's right. Just like other countries buy our debt, we buy theirs. We've been doing it for over 70 years. And right now foreign governments OWE US over $15.3 trillion.

So based on all this I'm sorry to say I just don't see a "way forward" for your worn out arguments. I'm sure you just wanted to entertain everyone, but try a different scary story.

Maybe sasquatch ? ✌
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@GuiltyBiStander On that last point we agree. America is way past being on the brink of collapse and it kept afloat only by the good will of its creditors..😷
GuiltyBiStander · 31-35, F
@whowasthatmaskedman

Stop saying that, and really look at the numbers - If that's actually what you care about.

One more time :
Foreign governments hold $7.9 trillion in US debt.

The US holds $15.3 trillion in debt owed to us by other countries.

What's keeping those accounts in favorable balance is not "the good will of creditors", it's our own basic financial strategy. And it's been working since 1944.

Telling everyone we're doomed with no way out is irresponsible.
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@GuiltyBiStander Just ONCE. Do not confuse foreign investment by governments with Commercial debt owed by corporations and consumers for goods alreadt purchased, delivered and consumed by America and its citizens. Now fo away. This is starting to look like you trolling..😷
ChipmunkErnie · 70-79, M
You better tell all the economic experts who say the US economy is leading the world that you want to set them straight. Or tell the energy experts that, while we now produce more energy than we use, we're failing there, too. Or that the average per capita income in America's poorest state is higher than the average per capita income in the UK and dozens of other countries.

Of course, what Trumpism will do to that, who knows. Even Musk has predicted "hard times" coming for the average American once Trump's in office.
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@ChipmunkErnie Allow me to reprint the reply I just made to another comment to you, since it works so well.
"You are missing two vital points. All of your numbers a based on growing $Trillions of foreign debt that WILL need to be paid bak.. and the dollars you are quoting and speanding for your own good numbers are being devalued by continuing to print money with no underlying value. Pen and Teller can explain the trick to you..😷"
specman · 51-55, M
The country was in despair and everything that is bad was called good and everything that was good was called bad. Those days will become history when Trump takes office.
@specman True! Trump is going to wreck America like he did last time. And also like last time, people will be desperate to go back to when things were just alright.
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@BohemianBabe You are not going to sell this to MAGA types..They jump off a building thinking they can fly and admire the view on the way down..😷
@whowasthatmaskedman The Trump Cult won't acknowledge reality, but keep in mind, this election had 21 million less voters than the 2020 election. Tons of people tuned out because things were relatively good, as opposed to 2020 when Trump was president.
What we need to do is work on reaching these people. The average American is left-leaning, they're just not politically engaged.
Convivial · 26-30, F
I often wonder when the point is reached that other countries stop lending money and demand the principal gets paid....
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@Convivial Soon. When America is under the greatest pressure. But if I had to guess, a couple of years. It does depend on how outrageous the moves Trump makes are..The Chinese and Saudiis will just stop shipping until America agrees terms..Something like that😷
Convivial · 26-30, F
@whowasthatmaskedman it's a rather large gun to be holding under the table...
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@Convivial This is the new warfare. Its economic. Cheaper, less damage and most of the casualties are on the losing side..😷
lpthehermit · 56-60, M
AND WITHOUT OUR ECONOMY THE REST OF THE WORLD GRINDS TO A HALT...YOU AINT SEEN NOTHING YET BUCKO
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whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@lpthehermit You have a point. It is going to hurt everywhere. But there are those ready to step up and almost no one is exposed to the US invesment market like they were last time. The lessons of Iceland have been learned and BRICS is waiting to take the business. America will be a total wreck.. Other nations will suffer varying degrees of fender bender.😷
Andrew7Jackson · 61-69, M
Every empire usually collapses from within. That is now what is happening with the U.S. All the Chinese have to do is wait and observe from the sidelines and in due course pick up the pieces.
GuiltyBiStander · 31-35, F
Meanwhile, in your own backyard -


So tell us all again how lucky you are that you're not us 😏
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@GuiltyBiStander Exactly.. Like I said, Americas collapse will hurt us.. It will hurt everyone.. But it will remove the $US as the reserve trade currency and take up to half the value out of the $US in purchasing powe (worst case). And that means it will make those holding $US very unhappy..They will almost certainly demand payment for further imports in another currency or some other for like gold. And thats only the start. They they come knocking with all the IOUs and othering terms on which they will keep supplying America. Make no mistake, this will be economic warefare designed to remove America as a global power. And they have all the economic firepower to do it..And with Trump in charge America has few allies..😷
GuiltyBiStander · 31-35, F
@whowasthatmaskedman

No.

That's not "exactly what you said", and none of what you're spewing here is connected to any real data that holds up. In fact you've flipped so many times between "America is doomed by foreign debt, no I mean domestic creditors ...but Australia will be fine, except until the US wrecks us ... and I honestly only care about the numbers, but really think you deserve to be screwed by Trump" - that at this point I wouldn't trust you to predict sunrise tomorrow, or explain how a hammer works.

But thanks for the funhouse tour.
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@GuiltyBiStander It isnt polite to tell you what I think of you, so I wont.. Thanks for the misquotes and misdirection. My arguments are clear. You are just being difficult, which I can now assume is doliberate. If you want to last word now would be the time. I can wait for time to prove me right. I'm done with you..🖕😷🖕
Kygirl · FVIP
Some of us are in fine shape because we have Jesus with us. You could too if you would ask him to show you the way..
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dancingtongue · 80-89, M
I wouldn't put it totally on the voters. The non-voters who are too busy being compulsive, conspicuous consumers -- buying all those cheap Chinese products they can't really afford; burning up that Arab oil in SUVs/trucks with low mpg for no reason other than vanity -- to pay attention to politics or economics share a bit of the blame, imho.
GeniUs · 56-60, M
5 more years then:
Lisa Simpson
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@GeniUs Lisa migrated to Canada in 2016...You will be lucky to get Bart...😷
Americans refused to tax their oligarchs and run their country. Let them be the apocalypse.
Dino11 · M
Trump (45,47) by a Landslide Mandate.
@Dino11 A mandate doesn't magically make something moral.
Dino11 · M
@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow 52% of the people,
The Senate and the SCOTUS say Yes.
Soon, the House Too.
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ron122 · 41-45, M
You people are awesome.🤣🍿
kodiac · 22-25, M
Trump won😂
swirlie · 31-35, F
America sold its place in the future of the world and it is the fault of American voters...

I disagree. I don't think it was the fault of the American voters at all. I think the election was rigged and I think Trump stole the election from Harris. I mean, it's been done before and Trump could only agree.

Because the election was stolen from Trump by Joe Biden in 2020, that means that Trump was actually the legitimate President from 2020 to 2024.

This also means that Trump has already served not 1, but 2 full terms as POTUS which means Kamala wins the 2024 election by default because Trump wasn't qualified to run for a third time anyway.
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whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@GuiltyBiStander Not for the whole country. Just the nation as you know it. The bills are going to come due real soon and neither side can prevent that.😷
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whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@TrashCat That sounds a rather American attitude. I dont think I can support it on principle..Although I grant you a few Americans I am aware of will make great mulch..😷
TrashCat · M
@whowasthatmaskedman Feces makes great mulch
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@TrashCat Maybe the White House will become known as the Brown House?😷
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