DogMan · 61-69, M
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AthrillatheHunt · 56-60, M
@samueltyler2 agree to disagree about our 1 party form of govt playing good cop bad cop
wildbill83 · 41-45, M
@Kypro free market/privatization allows competition for market share (lower prices); government control doesn't allow for competition, it's their way or the highway
DogMan · 61-69, M
LegalClarity Team
Published Apr 1, 2026
Scandinavian countries are capitalist. Denmark, Finland, Iceland, Norway, and Sweden all run market economies built on private ownership, free trade, and profit-driven business. What makes them unusual is the size of their welfare states, funded by tax rates that would make most American voters flinch. The combination gets mislabeled as socialism so often that Denmark’s own prime minister once pushed back publicly, telling an audience at Harvard that Denmark is “a market economy” and very much not a socialist planned economy. The real answer is more interesting than either label suggests.
Published Apr 1, 2026
Scandinavian countries are capitalist. Denmark, Finland, Iceland, Norway, and Sweden all run market economies built on private ownership, free trade, and profit-driven business. What makes them unusual is the size of their welfare states, funded by tax rates that would make most American voters flinch. The combination gets mislabeled as socialism so often that Denmark’s own prime minister once pushed back publicly, telling an audience at Harvard that Denmark is “a market economy” and very much not a socialist planned economy. The real answer is more interesting than either label suggests.
ViciDraco · 41-45, M
@DogMan You can cite wikipedia all you like. But that doesn't change the fact that state provided Healthcare, child care, education, and income support have been decried as socialism by US political pundits and the media for decades. People have been told the things they want are socialist things as a way to scare them away from wanting those things. So now they believe the only way to get them is to support socialists.
ViciDraco · 41-45, M
@DogMan That's because it is their only frame of reference. Their current lived experience is that capitalism is failing them. The things they want are called socialist. So capitalism gets viewed as the enemy. (I don't think capitalism is evil. I think it was a valuable tool to get us this far but it's time to reach for the next tool to continue forward.)
FDR's New Deal basically saved capitalism in the US by instituting policies most would decry as socialist today (whether they are or not). Socialists were rising in the US back then, not unlike today.
In order to prevent Democrats from going socialist, a Democrat had to create and fund those social programs.
Today, the core of the Democratic party refuses to do such things. They are stuck in failing neoliberal corporatism. Their refusal to pursue popular social programs is why people are looking to socialists. The "right wing" sure as hell isn't going to. If the "left wing" isn't left enough to do so either, you have to find another bird.
FDR's New Deal basically saved capitalism in the US by instituting policies most would decry as socialist today (whether they are or not). Socialists were rising in the US back then, not unlike today.
In order to prevent Democrats from going socialist, a Democrat had to create and fund those social programs.
Today, the core of the Democratic party refuses to do such things. They are stuck in failing neoliberal corporatism. Their refusal to pursue popular social programs is why people are looking to socialists. The "right wing" sure as hell isn't going to. If the "left wing" isn't left enough to do so either, you have to find another bird.
MoveAlong · 70-79, M
The middle class is shrinking and the wealth is being funneled more and more into the hands of the wealthiest Americans and corporations. This is just a fact. The scales have been tipped so heavily against working families they see the only way out is through government subsidies to even afford the bare necessities.
And it's not just the "welfare queens" with their hands out. The wealthiest man in the world, a man who is wealthier than 176 countries receives billions of dollars every year in government subsidies. He is wealthy enough to completely fund NASA for the next ten years. Yet the government pays him billions every year above contract value to launch rockets.
God forbid we waste hundreds of dollars a year on a hungry child.
And it's not just the "welfare queens" with their hands out. The wealthiest man in the world, a man who is wealthier than 176 countries receives billions of dollars every year in government subsidies. He is wealthy enough to completely fund NASA for the next ten years. Yet the government pays him billions every year above contract value to launch rockets.
God forbid we waste hundreds of dollars a year on a hungry child.
DogMan · 61-69, M
OK, I think you guys have changed my mind about universal healthcare.
I guess I just do not trust our government to do a good job with it.
It will be a massive undertaking and I believe we will have massive fraud.
If our healthcare costs go down 50% to be in line with other countries, and we work
hard at combatting fraud like the Nordic states, and healthcare gets BETTER, I will
vote for it.
I guess I just do not trust our government to do a good job with it.
It will be a massive undertaking and I believe we will have massive fraud.
If our healthcare costs go down 50% to be in line with other countries, and we work
hard at combatting fraud like the Nordic states, and healthcare gets BETTER, I will
vote for it.
SunshineGirl · 36-40, F
Why do you get so hung up on labels? You've pre-determined that "socialism" is something akin to devil-worship and you use it to divide the sheep from the cattle. Isn't everyone looking for essentially the same thing? How to reform capitalism after the free market-driven s**tshow of 2007-8 and make it work better for everyone. Trump thinks the answer is centrally-planned protectionism and public subsidy for areas of the economy favoured by the state. That to my mind is far more reminiscent of 20th century socialism than a general aspiration for universal healthcare. Times change, successful economies innovate and adapt. Those who remain anchored to rhe past will shrivel into irrelevance.
DogMan · 61-69, M
@SunshineGirl You think Socialism is a label? Lol, that is what they are calling themselves,
but I'M labeling them? That's hilarious. These self-labeled Socialist are trying to stop capitalism
and replace it with Socialism.
Who in their right mind thinks that would be a good idea? That is not how Scandinavian countries
work.
but I'M labeling them? That's hilarious. These self-labeled Socialist are trying to stop capitalism
and replace it with Socialism.
Who in their right mind thinks that would be a good idea? That is not how Scandinavian countries
work.
SumKindaMunster · 56-60, M
@SunshineGirl Well I will stick with Leftist then. You are certainly left of center so it fits.
SunshineGirl · 36-40, F
@DogMan You identified correctly that Scandinavian countries (like most European countries) operate mixed economies. That is one aspect of their success, especially in Norway which successfully exploited its North Sea resources to elevate the economy from virtual bankruptcy after WW2. What you have overlooked, however, is the central role of the state in redistributing wealth (these states also have the highest marginal tax rates in the world) and reducing inequality (per capita, you will find fewer millionaires than in say Germany, UK and USA). Policies that make the mayor of New York look pretty conservative by comparison. Greater evonomic equality is shown to lead to greater social cohesion, trust in government, and stronger communities.
So some things you approve of, some you probably don't. But socialism is not a helpful label.
So some things you approve of, some you probably don't. But socialism is not a helpful label.
Kypro · 46-50, M
It works better?
DogMan · 61-69, M
@samueltyler2 I hear ya. I have no love for the super rich. Sure, you and I would give away millions
if we were billionaires. But we aren't. But they do spend a lot of money, and people profit from that
money they spend. As long as they do it legally more power to them
if we were billionaires. But we aren't. But they do spend a lot of money, and people profit from that
money they spend. As long as they do it legally more power to them
DogMan · 61-69, M
@samueltyler2 which point?
samueltyler2 · 80-89, M
@DogMan that is my question to you? You talked about the cars and motorcycles you own.
DogMan · 61-69, M
Evidence from multiple sources suggests that Nordic countries generally have lower overall fraud rates and are ranked higher in global fraud protection than the United States.
Global Fraud Index rankings
The Sumsub Global Fraud Index 2024 lists the Nordic countries — Norway, Denmark, Finland, Sweden, and Iceland — among the top 15 most protected countries against fraud, with Norway, Denmark, Finland, and Sweden in the top 5 Sumsub. The U.S. ranks much lower, at #55 with a fraud index score of 3.16, compared to the global average of 3.12 Sumsub. In the 2025 update, the U.S. fraud score rose to 3.81, still well above the global average of 2.79 Sumsub.
Why do socialists not talk about fighting fraud?
Global Fraud Index rankings
The Sumsub Global Fraud Index 2024 lists the Nordic countries — Norway, Denmark, Finland, Sweden, and Iceland — among the top 15 most protected countries against fraud, with Norway, Denmark, Finland, and Sweden in the top 5 Sumsub. The U.S. ranks much lower, at #55 with a fraud index score of 3.16, compared to the global average of 3.12 Sumsub. In the 2025 update, the U.S. fraud score rose to 3.81, still well above the global average of 2.79 Sumsub.
Why do socialists not talk about fighting fraud?
MoveAlong · 70-79, M
@DogMan
Do you really think Socialists don't own businesses or work for a living? What is happening in New York and elsewhere is that these people are working hard and are still being priced out of, housing, healthcare and food. It's a real problem and they're ready to try something else. Why wouldn't they?
Capitalism makes money, Socialism takes money.
Do you really think Socialists don't own businesses or work for a living? What is happening in New York and elsewhere is that these people are working hard and are still being priced out of, housing, healthcare and food. It's a real problem and they're ready to try something else. Why wouldn't they?
MoveAlong · 70-79, M
@DogMan
As I understand it Democratic Socialists in America aren't trying to end Capitalism. They are wanting more revenue to be spent on programs that help provide healthcare, housing, food and other necessities that are becoming less affordable for more and more people.
I'm not arguing for extreme Socialism but I believe there is enough wealth in America to expand the safety net that IMO is good for America. That means higher taxes and much higher taxes on corporations and the wealthiest Americans. That I am OK with.
Edit: The right should spend more time explaining how they can improve the lives of Americans and just stop trying to scare people.
A true Socialist would not have capital, unless he believed in capitalism, right? You can't run a
successful company without capital.
successful company without capital.
As I understand it Democratic Socialists in America aren't trying to end Capitalism. They are wanting more revenue to be spent on programs that help provide healthcare, housing, food and other necessities that are becoming less affordable for more and more people.
I'm not arguing for extreme Socialism but I believe there is enough wealth in America to expand the safety net that IMO is good for America. That means higher taxes and much higher taxes on corporations and the wealthiest Americans. That I am OK with.
Edit: The right should spend more time explaining how they can improve the lives of Americans and just stop trying to scare people.
Kypro · 46-50, M
30% approve Trump
We need something different. Dems don’t have all the answers but reps only help the wealthy.
We need something different. Dems don’t have all the answers but reps only help the wealthy.
DogMan · 61-69, M
@Kypro Pennsylvania Democrat Sen. John Fetterman told CNN on Wednesday that, based on his experience, the radical haters on the political left are meaner and more vicious than those on the right.
"The difference is the right will say really rough things and call me names - some I won't repeat on TV - but on the left, it was like they want me to die," he said.
"The difference is the right will say really rough things and call me names - some I won't repeat on TV - but on the left, it was like they want me to die," he said.
ViciDraco · 41-45, M
Because people are learning that reaganomics has been slowly killing the economic prosperity of the majority while elevating the wealth of a small minority to insane proportions. Despite being the wealthiest nation we are also ranked highly as one of the most miserable. People are tired of both political parties being captured by corporate interests.
There is a lot of room between where we are and Socialism though. We also want to make sure we aim for a more libertarian form closer to what the scandinavian nations practice.
There is a lot of room between where we are and Socialism though. We also want to make sure we aim for a more libertarian form closer to what the scandinavian nations practice.
PatKirby · M
Because they want free 💩?
SatanBurger · 36-40, F
Because more and more with Trump removing safety and welfare programs it's exposing deficits in our economy between the super rich and poor. Elon Musk has become the first trillionaire, meanwhile they keep saying they don't have money for decent child care or affordable health.
Also the same ppl against socialism typically are right wingers who support the billionaire class and say out loud how people don't work hard enough in a world where people have to work 2 or 3 jobs to survive.
Over time people see the illusion and want alternatives. Nobody is really proposing anything else and people are less likely to believe republicans since they been screwing up. It's about trust, not socialism that is the heart.
Also the same ppl against socialism typically are right wingers who support the billionaire class and say out loud how people don't work hard enough in a world where people have to work 2 or 3 jobs to survive.
Over time people see the illusion and want alternatives. Nobody is really proposing anything else and people are less likely to believe republicans since they been screwing up. It's about trust, not socialism that is the heart.
JPWhoo · 36-40, M
@DogMan I’ll admit I haven’t read enough to be able to give a very detailed answer to that question; however, costs were going up anyway. Without Obamacare they would have gone up more. Might also have to do with forcing insurance companies to cover people with pre-existing conditions. The only way insurance companies were going to start doing that was if they raised their prices.
Anyone want to help me out?
Anyone want to help me out?
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SumKindaMunster · 56-60, M
AthrillatheHunt · 56-60, M
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@Waveney Yeah, importing 25,000,000 illegal alien murderers, rapists, child traffickers, fraudsters, and drug runners sure is a boost to American citizens, eh
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sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
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