Why the lessons of 9/11 are wasted

And who, dummy, do you know says that? You really are a major plonker! @ElwoodBlues

@Grvstu Can't quite recall. Maybe an image will jog my memory.

Thanks for proving my point! @ElwoodBlues

@Strictgram Wow. Nice ignorant right wing cliche. How does it feel to be a walking stereotype.

You do realize the USSR doesn't exist anymore and hasn't for almost 30 years. And Venezuela is not and never has been communist. Talk about ignorant.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow Pack your bags you America hating fool.

@Strictgram Lol. Yet more cliches. Again, I am not the one who supports a coup attempt and domestic terrorists. That is all you. So when is your court date? Which one is you?

@Grvstu The withdrawal from Afghanistan was messy and horrible, but it was always gonna be that way. You can't just prop up a puppet government for 20 years and expect shit to be all sunshine and rainbows when you finally leave. Regardless of how we did it, withdrawing was always gonna cause a crisis of confidence within the Afghan government and a government that no longer believes in its ability to survive is a clusterfuck 100% of the time.

Unfortunately, the idea of getting everyone out all at once -- soldiers, civilians, allies -- just isn't technologically feasible. And failing that, we have to choose which to evacuate first, all of which have their own unique problems. We could've chosen to evacuate our civilians & allies first, but that probably would've caused the Afghan army to collapse with our soldiers still inside. The CIA wrongly predicted that the Afghans could buy us a few months and really, no one predicted that it'd be as few as ten days, so we went with withdrawing troops first.

The same kind of thing happened in Vietnam, by the way. Thousands of Vietnamese civilians were captured by the NVA and brutalized. If we don't want this kinda shit to happen, we oughta stop starting land wars in countries that don't like us.

@Strictgram There was no need to invade Afghanistan and waste 20 years trying to change their form of government. All that needed to happen was to beef up airport security (which did happen), and send in a team of special forces unannounced to capture bin Laden. Instead, we announced a full-on invasion, giving bin Laden ample warning to escape. Bin Laden was eventually killed a decade later in just such a covert operation.

9/11 was a fluke, that happened because of incompetent leadership that ignored clear warnings, and the inability of intelligence agencies to communicate with each other. Both of those have been remedied.

I think it’s very simplistic to call 9/11 a fluke. @LeopoldBloom

@Grvstu 😐

@Grvstu 🤡

@Grvstu exactly

@Oberon1 That's why people measure, you just dismiss the measurements if they don't suit you and categorize them as "spin". There is a reason for that, you are a biased piece of shit Puck.

@Kwek00 I have reality on my side, and you are an extremist nut bar! 😆

@Oberon1 Reality at your side? Is that what they teach you in church? Or did you get that from the traditionalist literature? But no worries... it's not that uncommon. It's pretty normal that every human being believes they have reality at their side. It's almost a nescessity if you want to function in your life. The issue is however, that this idea blinds everyone from the delussional bagage that they carry around. In your case, the bagage is the reality at your side.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow [quote] More projections.[/quote]
😆
You're killing me George!

@Oberon1 And speaking of copraphagics. I am not the one with his head so far up Trump's ass you are larping the human centipede.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow 😆 You are just too much fun!

@Grvstu it's always amusing watching you interact with people here

There are some people you know it is just not worth making any effort with !@tindrummer

@Grvstu 😅

@mikeylyksit Nobody ever asked you to be the world police. That was a self imposed title to justify an empire. And if most Americans are against the empire where is the responsibility to vote these people out?

And blaming brown people in the border areas is not going to change anything either, And where are you getting these inflated numbers from?


Oh and Clinton tried that in the 90s. The deport everyone approach failed miserably.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow We can't vote our way out of the mess. The problem is, we don't have anybody to vote for who will take a strong stand for enforcing immigration laws. So we always have a choice to vote (if we choose to) for somebody who we already know won't get the job done. Sigh...

Oh, and American's are not into building empires. American politicians are into that, but American politicians seem to revel in doing the exact opposite of what most of the voters want them to do...

Who said anything about brown people in border areas? No matter the color of their skin or how they get in the country, they spread everywhere. EVERYWHERE. My numbers aren't inflated. They are probably low. The last official count was about 12 million, increasing by about 1 mill a year for 14 years at this point. But that's the OFFICIAL estimate. So the actual figure is probably two or three times that. I'd be shocked if there are less than 50,000,000 undocumented migrants in the United States right now. And in 2021? In 2021 alone, the border is wide open. In 2021 ALONE the figure might increase by another 10 mill or so...

@mikeylyksit This has nothing to do with immigration. This has to do with playing at empire. And sorry but democracy is not a spectator sport. And it is also a bullshit cop out to pretend red and blue are the only options.



And again, if you vote them in and don't do anything that is consent to build empire.


Who said that? You did! You were the one who decided to change the subject to scapegoating immigrants and refugees on the southern border.

12 and 50 million? 😂 And I see you have zero sources for your fear mongering and scapegoating. But change the subject to make it about blaming other poor brown people. That is the right wing way.


I noticed you also completely ignored the fact that your immigration policy prescription has already been done and failed miserably.

@SW-User Also the Taliban offered to hand over Bin Laden. They later in the same year 0ffered a surrender. But in both cases Bush wanted to be a war president because in the US even being a war criminal is good for your political career. And even if you ignore all that Bin Laden has been dead for 10 years. What is the excuse for the other decade?

Yes but you obviously do not read between the lines like I do. Most of us with any sense know where the threat comes from. We also know he has to be politically correct to avoid upsetting certain elements. @ArishMell

@Grvstu In what respect?

And you have not yet defined what you see as the "main terrorist threat" that is "obvious" to "we all"; nor where.

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The extremist threats to the [i]UK and European [/i]countries are from both Islamicists and far-Right political ideologists.

The extremists themselves are generally native residents of those countries; some groups, some individually (the "lone wolf" types).

The Islamic extremists tend to sympathise with ISIS' dream of its own version of the Third Reich; with somewhat similar attitudes to the original Nazis, Stalin's USSR and Pol Pot's Khmer Rouge.

The political ones tend to exploit fears raised by the ISIS types and by continuing, large flows of immigrants escaping wars, droughts and poverty in Africa and the Middle East. Some do admire Adolf Hitler's regime.

[i]These have been known for a long time[/i].

The warning from MI5 is of the Afghanistan situation encouraging such extremists in Western Europe.

Within Afghanistan, the Taliban may face problems from its rivals, ISIS, as well as domestic resistance; but if ISIS really causes trouble there I wonder if and how China will become involved. After all, the hard-line atheist Beijing government has announced its support for the hard-line theocratic Taliban. Just don't mention the tragic (Muslim) Uyghurs...

+++=

America has her own internal threats from her own versions of both far-Left and far-Right, arising from deep social and political divisions and problems within American life. Nevertheless, the 20th anniversary of the World Trade Center atrocity by Al Quaeda, being commemorated in the UK as well as the USA, will warn us all that she need still be well aware of external threats.

Meanwhile over here, our thoughts are with you on this memorial day.

It does not alter the fact of where the main threat comes from. @ArishMell

@windinhishair Delusional marxist.

@Strictgram Are you talking about Trump and his national security agencies who concluded domestic white supremacist violence is the biggest threat we face right now? George W. Bush made reference to the current risk this weekend when speaking about 9/11. Are you a domestic white supremacist?

So no problem? @SunshineGirl

@Grvstu Massive problem, but the immediate existential threat is overwhelmingly domestic terrorism rather than an external enemy.

Nearly 3000 killed in 8/11 which may very well hapoen again?@SunshineGirl

@LordShadowfire I would say more like blowback from about 40 years of CIA games.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow We know for a fact Osama bin Laden was trained by the CIA. I legitimately think Dick Cheney orchestrated it to get us more deeply involved in the Middle East.

@CopperCicada That is pretty much the only way you could bring in a fission device and miniaturization makes it exponentially more difficult. There is a reason that even the first bombs were massive.

I am not disputing that. Just the narrative that a nuke is a likely threat. And my original post was that I think someone did cost/benefit analysis and decided slowing a port to a crawl for a 1 in a million risk was not profitable.

@CopperCicada I mean the mushroom cloud thing was literally what Bush used to scare the US into a pointless war.

@CopperCicada Trump tried. Biden Inc has us spending millions to leave it alone. They are literally paying millions a day in tax payer dollars to NOT build the wall. They are trying to destroy ICE, and all protective laws. The wall was very effective where it was built, and combined with electronic surveillance, and common sense leadership, it would have been an effective deterrent.