Will Ukraine win ?
Do you think despite high losses Russia will send other tanks and other more not caring about casualties, till victory or will ring retreat?
26-30, F
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hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
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@hippyjoe1955 So you can't even tell me one thing Putin has achieved, hahaha. Thought so..
InstructHer · 56-60, M
@hippyjoe1955 the lights are burning very brightly here thank you very much.
ididntknow · 51-55, M
@Nexus sorry to tell you this, but that’s propaganda I’m afraid, von de Lyon said that Ukraine had lost a hundred thousand soldiers and 20 thousand civilians, Russia has lost nothing near to that, a good source of truthful information is colonel McGregor
Elessar · 26-30, M
Russia is literally drafting the homeless right now..
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/10/12/russias-military-mobilization-targets-the-homeless-poor-reports-a79065
My guess is that at some point Russia will claim they have reached their objectives and declare their operation concluded. Regardless of reality, from which they've been disconnected for a while now
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/10/12/russias-military-mobilization-targets-the-homeless-poor-reports-a79065
My guess is that at some point Russia will claim they have reached their objectives and declare their operation concluded. Regardless of reality, from which they've been disconnected for a while now
Elessar · 26-30, M
@MarmeeMarch Yeah, and Jesus will return and begin the rapture. Feel free to join the endless list of those who died off waiting for something that never happens. If Russia had anything, short of taking the world down with itself by dropping a nuke, it would've been played long before becoming the world's pariah, and long before drafting the homeless.
Also, 15k in July is per the U.S., I'm quite convinced the CIA is a reliable party. That'd be 3k/mo, considering we were at month 5 back then. Assuming a constant rate (which is never the case, because once you've lost the spearhead units, the troops behind will die off at a faster rate, especially when said units are f*cking civilians with a bare minimum training and *maybe* a gun). That'd put us at a bare minimum of 24k losses, without considering the counteroffensive and assuming a constant rate. Ukrainian numbers seem quite realistic, all considered.
Also, 15k in July is per the U.S., I'm quite convinced the CIA is a reliable party. That'd be 3k/mo, considering we were at month 5 back then. Assuming a constant rate (which is never the case, because once you've lost the spearhead units, the troops behind will die off at a faster rate, especially when said units are f*cking civilians with a bare minimum training and *maybe* a gun). That'd put us at a bare minimum of 24k losses, without considering the counteroffensive and assuming a constant rate. Ukrainian numbers seem quite realistic, all considered.
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Elessar · 26-30, M
@MarmeeMarch Russia liberated who? 🤣 You really chug on their propaganda like a little baby
No, over here we were liberated by Allies forces, not soviets - along with internal partisan resistance movements. Among them, Americans - that weren't whiny b*tches easy prey of authoritarianism, especially Russian authoritarianism and nazi/fascist authoritarianism, gave their life for liberating us.
But feel free to ask any east European, in particular Poles, Baltics or Finns how much they feel like they were "liberated" by Russia. Hint: they're the countries most determined into sending aids to Ukraine and taking the strongest stance against Russia right now, to give you an idea.
No, over here we were liberated by Allies forces, not soviets - along with internal partisan resistance movements. Among them, Americans - that weren't whiny b*tches easy prey of authoritarianism, especially Russian authoritarianism and nazi/fascist authoritarianism, gave their life for liberating us.
But feel free to ask any east European, in particular Poles, Baltics or Finns how much they feel like they were "liberated" by Russia. Hint: they're the countries most determined into sending aids to Ukraine and taking the strongest stance against Russia right now, to give you an idea.
BlueVeins · 22-25
You can't just send more and more soldiers into the meat grinder w/o caring about casualties and expect it to do you well long-term. One shitty, unexperienced soldier with no training requires as much logistical support as a well-trained one, is infinitely less effective in combat, and is way more likely to have crappy morale. Victory is basically off the table for Russia; the most they can reasonably hope for is stalemate in the country's far east.
smiler2012 · 56-60
@BlueVeins yes makes sense what you say do not get me wrong i am no fan of putin and this unneccessary military operation / come illegal invasion. but russia have been here before during the second world war fair enough technology they have today was not existent .they had too send men to war with the hitlers nazi war machine on there doorstep who had never probably never fired or handled a rifle before
Tracos · 51-55, M
Ukraine has nothing to win and everything to lose...
they are being mugged by a brute force bully, and the best they can hope to reach is survival. survival at a horrible cost in loss of life and incredible material costs.
history teaches that even if Russia is defeated on the Ukrainian battle field reparations wont help much in restoring civic relations with their eastern neighbors
what I expect to happen now is a consistent rain of drone, cruise missiles, shelling and rocket artillery attacks at random civil locations to grind wear public moral into pulp over winter (which is pretty cold in Ukraine in a typical winter, especially when electricity infrastructure is down, and all window panes are shattered.)
at the same time russia will reinforce their material and personnel as well as they can. and build up the annexed provinces, preferably with a lot of soft targets. Every time Ukraine will fire into these targets, the russian media will screech how the evil Ukrainians are killing off innocent and unarmed people, and will forget to mention those people were put there as cannon fodder in the first place. The Kremline has an interest in an angry population that sees Ukrainians as evil people, and hates the west as a corrupt and perverted system.
They will pull Belarus deeper into their fold, with more an permanent military installations to improve their reach into Ukraine. At the same time they will suppress potential belarussian uprisings (which are simmering unrneath the surface). Lukachenko already seems to bend over, and the Putin needs to show some gain from all his efforts to minimize loss of face...
We can expect further economic warfare into Europe through energy scarcity and a further amplification of the political extremes through their troll farms to destabilize opposing forces like the US.
Russia at this moment has an interest in a destabilized west, with high inflations in the UK, Mainland Europe and the US.
and then... spring next year the misery continues.... there is no winning in this kind of conflict.
they are being mugged by a brute force bully, and the best they can hope to reach is survival. survival at a horrible cost in loss of life and incredible material costs.
history teaches that even if Russia is defeated on the Ukrainian battle field reparations wont help much in restoring civic relations with their eastern neighbors
what I expect to happen now is a consistent rain of drone, cruise missiles, shelling and rocket artillery attacks at random civil locations to grind wear public moral into pulp over winter (which is pretty cold in Ukraine in a typical winter, especially when electricity infrastructure is down, and all window panes are shattered.)
at the same time russia will reinforce their material and personnel as well as they can. and build up the annexed provinces, preferably with a lot of soft targets. Every time Ukraine will fire into these targets, the russian media will screech how the evil Ukrainians are killing off innocent and unarmed people, and will forget to mention those people were put there as cannon fodder in the first place. The Kremline has an interest in an angry population that sees Ukrainians as evil people, and hates the west as a corrupt and perverted system.
They will pull Belarus deeper into their fold, with more an permanent military installations to improve their reach into Ukraine. At the same time they will suppress potential belarussian uprisings (which are simmering unrneath the surface). Lukachenko already seems to bend over, and the Putin needs to show some gain from all his efforts to minimize loss of face...
We can expect further economic warfare into Europe through energy scarcity and a further amplification of the political extremes through their troll farms to destabilize opposing forces like the US.
Russia at this moment has an interest in a destabilized west, with high inflations in the UK, Mainland Europe and the US.
and then... spring next year the misery continues.... there is no winning in this kind of conflict.
Convivial · 26-30, F
I think you need to separate out the three components of this war... The Ukrainians, Russia and putin.
The Ukrainians won't give up, neither will Putin.
That leaves Russia and Russians and his far down Putin's rabbit hole thank follow him.
Currently, for Putin, the signs aren't good!
The Ukrainians won't give up, neither will Putin.
That leaves Russia and Russians and his far down Putin's rabbit hole thank follow him.
Currently, for Putin, the signs aren't good!
Convivial · 26-30, F
@Elessar what you say is so true, in the past at least... Maybe still now, i don't really know.
The whatever reason, Russians love a strong lead, even if it is too the detriment personally... Maybe enough freedom and benefits of free elections have been tasted that change will come.. Time will tell
The whatever reason, Russians love a strong lead, even if it is too the detriment personally... Maybe enough freedom and benefits of free elections have been tasted that change will come.. Time will tell
Elessar · 26-30, M
@Convivial It's a country subjected to brain drain, pretty much everyone sane of mind has left, is leaving, or is unable to leave and therefore rendered harmless (drafted, arrested, intimidated, etc.); the residual is people indoctrinated by the regime
I hope you're right. But it feels like democracy is decaying in the west as well, let alone in a dictatorship where for centuries people associated authoritarianism/brutality with strength and good leadership
I hope you're right. But it feels like democracy is decaying in the west as well, let alone in a dictatorship where for centuries people associated authoritarianism/brutality with strength and good leadership
smileylovesgaming · 31-35, F
@smileylovesgaming very good point. And he is recruiting the homeless, prisoners, and the general rejects of society too
@smileylovesgaming yes. I think that will have negative effects overall
yes , i think winter will bring its end , if it doesnt happen sooner that is. What worries me the most is that after losing Putin will be perceived as weak and untrustworthy and he is aware and for a man who has attempted and threatened the things he has this is a scary position to imagine him being in
DunningKruger · 61-69, M
I think that, at some point, there may well be people in the Russian government and military who will ultimately give Putin a come-to-Jesus talk that he will actually listen to. The trick will be to find a way to pull out of Ukraine but be able to claim some sort of victory.
BlueVeins · 22-25
@DunningKruger a part of me truly believes that the reason Zelinsky stayed in Ukraine so long was because he was hoping the Russians would kill him, declare victory, and leave.
smiler2012 · 56-60
[motherwifenurseandnanny] putin is losing this war on the military side and i think is going through an afghanistan of the 1980s .with help from nato putin has been given a bloody nose. he is rather in a difficult position of his doing rather dug himself a rather deep hole. he knows he cannot withdraw his troops because of personal pride and arrogance . if doing so this would make him look weak in his own country with those pro invasion and on the world stage
ExperienceDLT · M
Fairydust · F
@ExperienceDLT
Only the ones laundering the money win.
Only the ones laundering the money win.
Khenpal1 · M
Russia is out with weapons and logistics . Best weapons are sanctions as long as one close loop holes. Geopolitically Germany and France armed Russia for this war. German and French arms company should be punished for breaking sanctions in 2014.
SW-User
Ukraine has been turned into a wasteland. But no worries, with climate change and the 6th mass extinction the rest of the world is not far behind.
DeWayfarer · 61-69, M
Winter is very harsh in that portion of the world. Why the Germans lost their fight with Russia as well as Napoleon.
No one can say what the outcome will be.
No one can say what the outcome will be.
Boleuskas · M
No army has ever won a war against ordinary people, It didnt happened in Bosnian war, and didnt happened in Afghanistan. So Ukraine will.prevail. Slava Ukrajini
Motherwifenurseandnanny · 26-30, F
How can you say it win if probably even Belarus and former soviet countries will enter war ??
Khenpal1 · M
@Motherwifenurseandnanny Belarus has nothing to offer and probably there will be mutiny in population if there was a war. So , no. No other countries will add Russia at this war.
nevergiveup · M
I think he has gone to far now and to back down would make him look weak. Its all or nothing for him now
Rolexeo · 26-30, M
Allegedly things wll be ramped up in the winter, so we'll see
Yes. And Russia will never be the same again.
Tracos · 51-55, M
Whoever may be winning, humanity is losing
Chattermanuk · 46-50, M
Sasly will be a stalemate for years
Alex51 · 61-69, M
Ukraine will win
Strictgram · 70-79, C
Mother drop a line. Gram
SW-User
yes
Motherwifenurseandnanny · 26-30, F
SW-User
@Motherwifenurseandnanny exactly
ATripToNowhere · 46-50, M
I hope it loses.
Justenjoyit · 61-69, M
I seriously cant not see the Russian military doing much other than moving out of Ukraine.
DDonde · 31-35, M
I hope so.
caesar7 · 61-69, M
It's like asking if the Leafs are going to win the Stanley Cup...lol