Is the teaching of Jesus the teaching of Judaism?
All the disciples of Jesus were Jews. The Old Testament is taken from the Hebrew Bible. The New Testament is based mainly on Paul's writings, and Paul was a Jew. Is Christianity a Jewish sect?
LordShadowfire · 46-50, M
It's a little more complicated than that.
Yeshua bar-Youssef, more popularly known as Jesus, was an itinerant rabbi, raised by members of a now-extinct feminist sect of Judaism. That's why he took personal offense at the idea that they would execute a woman for adultery, but not the man with whom she adulterated. He was also raised with a healthy skepticism toward the idea that authority was to be automatically trusted. All of this, plus the fact that he apparently didn't get along with his siblings, led to his ministry being what it was. An anti-authority message of peace and love and not getting so hung up on all the damn rules. That's why the scribes and Pharisees turned him over to the Roman government. He didn't care for the way they ran things.
As for Paul, he made things even more complicated. He may or may not have been jewish, but he was a Roman first, and he was on a mission from the Roman government to derail this new movement, because the Romans had mistakenly pegged the movement Jesus started as a threat to Roman rule. So he faked his whole conversion on the road to Damascus, just so that he could take over the church. And Paul accomplished his mission beautifully, turning Yeshua's movement into just another sect that oppressed women and sexual minorities, and didn't make way of. As an added bonus, the movement was pretty damn anti-Semitic for being Jewish.
Yeshua bar-Youssef, more popularly known as Jesus, was an itinerant rabbi, raised by members of a now-extinct feminist sect of Judaism. That's why he took personal offense at the idea that they would execute a woman for adultery, but not the man with whom she adulterated. He was also raised with a healthy skepticism toward the idea that authority was to be automatically trusted. All of this, plus the fact that he apparently didn't get along with his siblings, led to his ministry being what it was. An anti-authority message of peace and love and not getting so hung up on all the damn rules. That's why the scribes and Pharisees turned him over to the Roman government. He didn't care for the way they ran things.
As for Paul, he made things even more complicated. He may or may not have been jewish, but he was a Roman first, and he was on a mission from the Roman government to derail this new movement, because the Romans had mistakenly pegged the movement Jesus started as a threat to Roman rule. So he faked his whole conversion on the road to Damascus, just so that he could take over the church. And Paul accomplished his mission beautifully, turning Yeshua's movement into just another sect that oppressed women and sexual minorities, and didn't make way of. As an added bonus, the movement was pretty damn anti-Semitic for being Jewish.
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LordShadowfire · 46-50, M
@sree251
I maintain that Jesus neither started nor had a movement. Christianity evolved from a movement started by Jews: those who wrote the Gospels, and Paul's writings that provided the framework for the belief system of what evolved into the Nicene creed of Christianity.
Well, you're certainly entitled to your own hypothesis. That's the fun part. What is the basis of your claim that Christianity is anti-semitic?
They literally blame the Jews for him dying.
sree251 · 41-45, M
@LordShadowfire
A hypothesis is an assumption, an idea that is proposed for the sake of argument so that it can be tested to see if it might be true. I am presenting the idea that Christianity is a Jewish theology invented by Jews for non-Jews. This particular Jewish theology, that has entrapped the gentiles, was spun by Pharisees. Is this true or not?
The focus of the Jesus story was not the assigning of blame, which stems from Judaism, and the exacting of vengeance (an eye for an eye).
Well, you're certainly entitled to your own hypothesis. That's the fun part.
A hypothesis is an assumption, an idea that is proposed for the sake of argument so that it can be tested to see if it might be true. I am presenting the idea that Christianity is a Jewish theology invented by Jews for non-Jews. This particular Jewish theology, that has entrapped the gentiles, was spun by Pharisees. Is this true or not?
They literally blame the Jews for him dying.
The focus of the Jesus story was not the assigning of blame, which stems from Judaism, and the exacting of vengeance (an eye for an eye).
LordShadowfire · 46-50, M
@sree251
A hypothesis is an assumption, an idea that is proposed for the sake of argument so that it can be tested to see if it might be true.
Good. I was afraid I wasn't using it right. I am presenting the idea that Christianity is a Jewish theology invented by Jews for non-Jews.
I think you need to read the Bible again. Because the main point of the parts Paul wrote seems to be that everybody gets a reprieve from punishment because Jesus chose to be the whipping boy. But at the same time, it's pretty clear in the writings of Paul and the other apostles that the Jews are to blame for Jesus being put in that position in the first place. And again, in the gospels, Jesus speaks pretty harshly to the Jewish leaders of his day. So I really don't see how it could be a Jewish message. That's like saying a typical post of mine in the Religion section is a Christian message, because I address Christians.
BlueSkyKing · M
“The next time believers tell you that 'separation of church and state' does not appear in our founding document, tell them to stop using the word 'trinity.' The word 'trinity' appears nowhere in the bible. Neither does Rapture, or Second Coming, or Original Sin. If they are still unfazed (or unphrased), by this, then add Omniscience, Omnipresence, Supernatural, Transcendence, Afterlife, Deity, Divinity, Theology, Monotheism, Missionary, Immaculate Conception, Christmas, Christianity, Evangelical, Fundamentalist, Methodist, Catholic, Pope, Cardinal, Catechism, Purgatory, Penance, Transubstantiation, Excommunication, Dogma, Chastity, Unpardonable Sin, Infallibility, Inerrancy, Incarnation, Epiphany, Sermon, Eucharist, the Lord's Prayer, Good Friday, Doubting Thomas, Advent, Sunday School, Dead Sea, Golden Rule, Moral, Morality, Ethics, Patriotism, Education, Atheism, Apostasy, Conservative (Liberalism), Capital Punishment, Monogamy, Abortion, Pornography, Homosexual, Lesbian, Fairness, Logic, Republic, Democracy, Capitalism, Funeral, Decalogue, or Bible.”
― Dan Barker, Losing Faith in Faith: From Preacher to Atheist
― Dan Barker, Losing Faith in Faith: From Preacher to Atheist
BlueSkyKing · M
@hippyjoe1955 No, I think the Bible is fiction.
hippyjoe1955 · 70-79, M
@BlueSkyKing Which proves??????
sree251 · 41-45, M
@BlueSkyKing
Fiction is any narrative work, portraying individuals, events, or places that are imaginary. In this regard, history is imagined based on received accounts the accuracy of which is irrelevant.
No, I think the Bible is fiction.
Fiction is any narrative work, portraying individuals, events, or places that are imaginary. In this regard, history is imagined based on received accounts the accuracy of which is irrelevant.
RockinPop54 · M
sree251 · 41-45, M
@RockinPop54
Correct. To the Jew, Jesus was just another Jew whom they condemned to death for apostasy.
Correct again. Jesus teaching has nothing to do with Judaism. Christianity, a denomination of Judaism, written by Jews, is informed by Jewish beliefs meant for Jews and followers of Jewish moral beliefs.
Jews don't acknowledge the divinity of Jesus, they are still waiting for the Messiah.
Correct. To the Jew, Jesus was just another Jew whom they condemned to death for apostasy.
They totally ignored the part where it said he was coming as a peacemaker first, then as the warrior upon his return.
To them their Messiah is a warrior ONLY.
To them their Messiah is a warrior ONLY.
Correct again. Jesus teaching has nothing to do with Judaism. Christianity, a denomination of Judaism, written by Jews, is informed by Jewish beliefs meant for Jews and followers of Jewish moral beliefs.
Diotrephes · 70-79, M
@sree251=
Of course Christianity is a Jewish sect and so is Islam. They just have a few different rituals, per the Tenth Commandment =
Exodus 34:26 (ERV) ...“Never cook a young goat in its mother’s milk.”
That's why Christian men don't have to get circumcised.
Is Christianity a Jewish sect?
Of course Christianity is a Jewish sect and so is Islam. They just have a few different rituals, per the Tenth Commandment =
Exodus 34:26 (ERV) ...“Never cook a young goat in its mother’s milk.”
That's why Christian men don't have to get circumcised.
sree251 · 41-45, M
@Diotrephes
What does this mean?
Exodus 34:26 (ERV) ...“Never cook a young goat in its mother’s milk.”
What does this mean?
basilfawlty89 · 36-40, M
Not necessarily.
Judaism can be converted to, but it's quite difficult, especially Orthodox Judaism.
Traditionally it's an ethnoreligion.
Gentiles are allowed to practice Christianity.
Judaism can be converted to, but it's quite difficult, especially Orthodox Judaism.
Traditionally it's an ethnoreligion.
Gentiles are allowed to practice Christianity.
hippyjoe1955 · 70-79, M
Judaism is not Christianity and Christianity is not Judaism. In fact proper Judaism doesn't exist any more. They need a temple and a priesthood to offer animal sacrifices. They don't have that. Yes Christianity sprang from the base idea behind Judaism (faith in God) and corrected the many errors in Judaism (works of man).
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PatientlyWaiting25 · 46-50, F
Christianity is the fulfilment of the Jewish religion. Jesus fulfilled what was foretold would happen right down to where he would be born and how he would die and why.
sree251 · 41-45, M
@PatientlyWaiting25
This is what the Jews teach. By Jews, I mean those who contributed to the writing of the Christian Bible - made up of Jewish scriptural writings - that is the basis of Christianity. In other words, Christianity is a denomination of Judaism.
Christianity is the fulfilment of the Jewish religion.[/quote
Ok, You agree that Christianity is an integral part of Judaism.
[quote] Jesus fulfilled what was foretold would happen right down to where he would be born and how he would die and why.
Ok, You agree that Christianity is an integral part of Judaism.
[quote] Jesus fulfilled what was foretold would happen right down to where he would be born and how he would die and why.
This is what the Jews teach. By Jews, I mean those who contributed to the writing of the Christian Bible - made up of Jewish scriptural writings - that is the basis of Christianity. In other words, Christianity is a denomination of Judaism.
val70 · 51-55
Nope, remember the New Covenant? That's certainly not Jewish nor for only Jews
sree251 · 41-45, M
@val70
New Covenant was invented by Jews (see Wiki below.) Therefore, it is a Jewish creation not meant for Jews but for the indoctrination of Christians.
The New Covenant (Ancient Greek: διαθήκη καινή, romanized: diathḗkē kainḗ) is a biblical interpretation which was originally derived from a phrase in the Book of Jeremiah (Jeremiah 31:31–34), in the Hebrew Bible (or the Old Testament of the Christian Bible). Generally, Christians believe that the promised New Covenant—new relationship with God—was instituted at the Last Supper as part of the Eucharist,[1][2] which, in the Gospel of John, includes the New Commandment. (Wikipedia)
Nope, remember the New Covenant? That's certainly not Jewish nor for only Jews
New Covenant was invented by Jews (see Wiki below.) Therefore, it is a Jewish creation not meant for Jews but for the indoctrination of Christians.
The New Covenant (Ancient Greek: διαθήκη καινή, romanized: diathḗkē kainḗ) is a biblical interpretation which was originally derived from a phrase in the Book of Jeremiah (Jeremiah 31:31–34), in the Hebrew Bible (or the Old Testament of the Christian Bible). Generally, Christians believe that the promised New Covenant—new relationship with God—was instituted at the Last Supper as part of the Eucharist,[1][2] which, in the Gospel of John, includes the New Commandment. (Wikipedia)
Ferise1 · 46-50, M
Yes it’s all jewy