In the US we actually once had a very successful and popular public housing system. So popular that even many middle class families were taking part in it. What happened?
Realtors and landlords. They wanted people with money to buying and renting houses in the private market so they could make their profits. So they lobbied to put income limits on public housing availability.
The result was that it took healthy mixed income communities and changed them into places of focused poverty. That focused poverty reduced tax revenues of certain areas and led to a downturn in social services. The concentrated desperation led to an increase in crime. And basically it turned mid and high rise public housing neighborhoods into very bad places to live.
I bring this up, because revisiting public housing in the manner you propose has to be understood on a deeper level. Otherwise people are just going to point to failures like The Projects and say it won't work while ignoring all the reasons it actually failed.
@ViciDraco The market needs to be reined in before more public housing is built. The problem stems from a substantial group of people who view real estate first and foremost as a financial asset rather than a necessity of life.
@ViciDraco the earlier approach to public housing resulted in high density housing which ended up as a breeding ground for crime, the country learned to avoid such housing. no one has the perfect solution, which would have to include putting affordable housing near where workers could be employed, where there is adequate services, such as food, health, etc., exercise, clean air and water. It is not an easy problem to solve.
@samueltyler2 The design and use of public spaces has a far more significant affect on crime than density or income levels. Density does not cause crime this myth has long been debunked by social scientists.
@Gloomy I have not seen any such debunking, but, you are correct in that it isn't just density, it is everything that comes with the density. The lack of green spaces, food deserts, public transportation, all add to it. Public housing is most often located in highly polluted areas, with poor infrastructure.
@samueltyler2 Poverty and inequality push people to commit crimes. It has nothing to do with density.
You also have to look at a total number of crimes instead of percentage or going by per capita. As a hypothetical a city might have twice as much crime as another city but have four times the population. Your risk of being affected by crime would be lower in the city with a higher population but their overall number of crimes would obviously be higher because there's more people.
@Gloomy certainly poverty and inequality lead to crime, but they also tend to lead to living in substandard housing, and in areas with increased density. But, there are also white color crimes, which are different.
there areas some good studies showing the effect of population density and crime, as you move from multifamily high dense living to lower level, aka single family dwellings, the rate of crime changes;
@samueltyler2 The issue is not density it is how public housing is being segregated and stigmatized and how lack of infrastructure and poverty messed with people.
Always have to be aware that people in suits don't necessarily are better or trustworthy in any way. Money doesn't make a person
@nedkelly [quote]Culture and playing the victim can lead to crime - BLM was a prime example[/quote]
No people just point at poverty and societal problems and frame it as a cultural difference in order to avoid dealing with it and so it can fit their racial biases. BLM was a reaction to police brutality and inequality and the people standing up for themselves protesting is the exact opposite of playing victim.
@Gloomy i added something to my previous post, a GIS study showing the effect od population density. we are arguing the same thing, that crime has multifaceted origin, but, we know from experience in the US with prior attempts at urban redevelopment, that building high rise, high density buildings for the lower socio-economic classes, only breeds more poverty and crime.
@ViciDraco I know of at least one housing project of that nature that is still going strong in Oregon City. The houses are all depressingly identical, but they are houses. Not apartments, not a single monolithic building. Actual houses, with yards. Near a school, no less. There is hope for the projects.
