Biden reportedly set to announce student loan forgiveness plan that would cost taxpayers billions.
I wonder what my middle class auto mechanic who worked his way up to start his own business thinks about $300,000,000,000 of tax going to this program?
What about my house and car loan? Students who havnt contributed a dollar to society.. : dept forgiveness. Ppl who paid their own college, and worked their whole life.: 87k armed IRS agents to squeeze you for it..
Yet I don't recall you being so concerned about the $2,200,000,000,000 (yep, twelve zeros; 7x as much) gone to corporations under Trump's bailout program?
How is it, if it's students/people it's bad but if it's for-profit corporations it's good? Socialism for me but not for thee?
* My bad, it was morning, 7x(!) and not 4x as much
@irishmolly72 I checked it out and in the article it says that there is a lack of doctors and healthcare workers who left their jobs due to exhaustion from their hard work during covid.
I checked it out and in the article it says that there is a lack of doctors and healthcare workers who left their jobs due to exhaustion from their hard work during covid.
That's just it. This is a GLOBAL problem, related to the pandemic, not an indictment of the healthcare system.
That's just it. This is a GLOBAL problem, related to the pandemic, not an indictment of the healthcare system.
I agree with this. The one caveat is that French healthcare has suffered budget cuts over recent years. Macron supports this and he is economically centre-right (at least by historic French standards).
As the article I posted mentioned, the UK has had the same issue. Here, there have also been moves to slowly privatise different parts of the service. Our model is slowly becoming more like the American one. This is not because people here want that (they don't) but because of the free-market ideology of our Conservative party and the priority of corporate profits over care.
These underfunding problems have had a greater impact because of the pandemic but they would be issues anyway. So, for someone to imply that European healthcare systems have problems because of 'socialism' (meaning govt spending) is a bit much. The opposite is true: Market reforms and underfunding are damaging our healthcare.
Totally wrong and another way of buying votes. I feel sorry for the hard working people who battle to survive working two three jobs but never complain but let’s forgive the educated people as they are doing it hard earning 6 figure salary
Why is college education that expensive in the US?
Because state Universities are operated by the state.
Don't you just LOVE socialism??
Once again I urge everybody to check out the definition of Socialism. Having high costs for education is not a Socialist policy anymore than having high healthcare costs is a Capitalist policy. It is a policy of the greedy. However if you wish to remain ignorant and uneducated carry on talking your rubbish.
@GeniUs Simply charging someone with ignorance and lack of education doesn't win any arguments. There are no facts there, just your ad hominem attacks. These attacks reveal your failure to win the argument.
I will agree that "Having high costs for education is not a Socialist policy" , but they are a consequence of that policy. They are a consequence in the same sense that "Defund the Police" doesn't have high crime as its policy goal. Nevertheless high crime is what we get as a result. So who really cares more about black people? They are the primary victims of the Defund movement.
Simply charging someone with ignorance and lack of education doesn't win any arguments. There are no facts there, just your ad hominem attacks.
In that case you failed to follow the link a requisite of the argument, at this point I will follow up your lack of education with an inability to follow a basic instruction.
These attacks reveal your failure to win the argument.
I am not attempting to win an argument just presenting a fact (which you failed to look at) in an attempt to make sure that people willing to discuss this point understand the position before arguing on it.
@Elessar you mean like skid loads of bills loaded onto aircraft and shipped to Iran or do you mean reductions in taxes? My personal philosophy says no company should ever be taxed at all. Commercial taxes are just baked into the prices consumers pay for goods and services so, in the final analysis, no company pays taxes, they just collect it from their customers for the government
Well, to be honest I'm not really in favour of these kind of handouts that negate a contract, that don't really address the high cost of tuition, and that somehow rewards people for getting in over their heads knowing they are doing something they can't afford.
Pretty simple really, Biden’s approval rating is at an all time low and he needs to attract young voters. The one thing that is on any college students mind, aside from getting a job is how do I pay off my $100,000 student loan? Any contribution to paying that off would be appreciated. The deal will win favour with students and probably loose favor with older voters.
@irishmolly72 When I was 18 I thought my old man was the dumbest sob in the world. By the time I turned 23 I was amazed at how much the old boy had picked up in the past few years
@irishmolly72 I understand what you are saying, I think. Yes, I do agree that people often mature and realize that what they believed at 22 was bullshit. Can we afford that though? Look at history. Every major communist / socialist takeover was spearheaded by people in their 20s and even younger.
@Riverman2 The great illusion is that people can project their high minded motives on government. Many of the founders of Russian communism had no idea what would turn into, and in fact, were ultimately victims of their own creation.
well it would allow those people TRICKED into these huge loans, the chance to own a car and have your friend service it. a more wealthy nation, serves all business
@Dshhh Doctors, computer science students, engineers, pilots, accountants, lawyers all need college degrees which cost upwards of $100,000 by the time you are finished.
@Dshhh So it's the government's job to save everyone who is tricked? Tyrants always appear under the guise of trying to help the victims of society. Let's have Uncle Sam "help" everyone who has a misfortune and see how free we are as a result.
If that mechanic has half a brain he can figure out if Republicans had no problem whatsoever with trump cutting taxes on the rich and corporations...helping the richest of the rich billionaires in America get richer yet at the expense of the rest of us...... "The Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) analyzed just on the tax cuts alone, independent of the FY 2018 budget, would increase the U.S. deficit by $1 trillion over the next 10 years."
But Trumpers say helping the average struggling American help on repayment of their college loans is just too much. Crazy how that works, huh?
Plus EVERY FORGIVEN STUDENT COLLEGE LOAN IS FULLY TAXABLE AS EARNED INCOME"...for all of the 99% who get a break. So.........what they get "forgiven" is being partially paid back by taxing the loan forgiveness as ordinary income. But if you listen to a radical.....the tax breaks trump handed to the ultra rich was apparently just something they must have deserved....as a totally free gift...forever.....so no complaints all. Now that IS crazy.
@irishmolly72 It is kind of like an unrelated thing - when some dying chain of stores reports that they are closing umpteen more locations. It's like, "Where exactly even are these stores?" 🤨
college should be a free resource, everyone deserves a right to education. plenty of ways to pay for it. get those rich people to pay on their taxes & it would not be such a strain for the working class.
@irishmolly72 That is a totally irrelevant non sequitur.
And I see you followed that up with more conspiracy theories.
You are right life is not one dimensional. But you seem determined to move the goalpost and change the subject whenever you are called out on this nonsense.
Life happens within the bonds of reality, not in internet conspiracy theories.
See the top green line in the chart below? It shows where most of the Biden money will go... to the group of people who will be among the richest people who ever lived.
@GeniUs So the massive gap between college educated and all the others simply doesn't matter? Haha. Tell that to my car mechanic (who pays off all his loans himself).
I repeat. We are subsidizing the richest people who will have ever lived.
This is also a giant subsidy to the woke Higher Ed lobby to keep them in line too.
@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow Vague, blanket statements are a dead giveaway that there is no counter-argument you have. ".... all had their debts paid off or forgiven on the public dime....". That just fails the LOL test. :)
@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow "Fuck the poor" must be Biden's motto since his plan to cancel student debt will benefit the group of people who will be among the richest people ever to live in all human history.
Conservatives view education as a way for an individual to make more money. Liberals view education as benefitting society. So we want to invest in it.
I've heard the weenie left is already complaining that their debt is more than $10K. The rest of actual working people, left AND right are pissed over another blatant attempt to buy votes with OUR money!
It’s a sham to try and get students who owe and can vote to see it as the break they’ve been seeking and in return they’ll vote for democrats in the mid term.
President Biden's move to cancel $10,000 in student debt for some Americans will wipe away any deficit savings from the $739 billion Manchin-Schumer climate and tax hike legislation recently passed.
@irishmolly72 “$10,000 in student debt for some…” Ok let’s say those falling under the “some” category who receive $10,000, then will that amount ( not much in today’s economy) really even put a dent in what “some” owe? Yearly expenses are in the tens of thousands! It’d be great if students could attend college/university for $10,000. Or e en 10k per year. The reality is giving $10k to people is a political gimmick with no true intent to aid students or impact on student loans. So, what applies to the “others” who are not the “some”?
The CBO analysis examined how Biden’s loan forgiveness program would reduce revenue to the government and how much that would cost the government over the lifetime of the loans, which can stretch out over 30 years. It concluded the cost would be about $400 billion. This is a complicated, long range summation end possibility, not a toss-off sound bite.
With student loan forgiveness and more equitable policies going forward, your middle class mechanic text Might see his own or his children’s furthest personal goals. That’s the point - not to punish people (taxes are the fuel of this economy) but to enrich the most and play more equitably across the board. I don’t have any children but I pay school taxes, bus taxes, Public Safety taxes I don’t need. But I don’t complain because sometimes, I may need those kids. It’s not about the pain of the city - it’s about the healing of the body.
I'm not sure the auto mechanic will mind if it means those current and former students are now able to repair their cars at his shoppe or if they can now purchase a car that will need fixing at his shoppe.
As a matter of general policy though, I'm not sure letting people off the contractual hook is ever an entirely good idea.
I have mixed feelings about student loan forgiveness. Those who went to for-profit colleges like Phoenix, ITT tech etc I understand. But if you went to a legit university, that gave you an edge over the average joe. You’re probably enjoying the benefits now. Student loan forgiveness doesn’t make sense in that case.
@irishmolly72 Maybe because it takes time between when an economic/financial measure and the materialization of its effect on the market? Who would've ever expected that printing money like crazy and handing it out to the rich would've created inflation? Aside from literally anyone who completed elementary school lol (that now Republicans are so eager to sabotage, no wonder)
Can't blame the Wuhan virus on him either.
I can definitely blame the terrible management of the emergency on him. Besides, how is it, I shouldn't blame Trump for the economic repercussions of his disastrous COVID management, but it's perfectly fine to blame Biden for the supply-chain issues caused by the Chinese zero-covid policy and the Russian-Ukrainian conflict? 😆
What is that Biden did, aside from winning an election representing the party you don't like, that specifically caused inflation worldwide according to you?
@irishmolly72 Cognitive dissonance? You are the one who believes literally anything that matches your feelings. Including believing random memes are proof of anything.
I would bet money you also believe the bullshit meme being spreed around with a fake Saul Alinksy quote that has been proven to be a complete fabrication since it started as a random chain email in the 90s with the Nigerian prince scams.
How about instead of giving a bunch of 20 somethings that don't want to work free money for "school" that they will piss away anyway How about forgiving medical debts for those buried in it
If they have kids they'll be thankful that THEIR money is coming to help THEIR family. And maybe you're not aware but mechanics often get loans to go to school to be, you know, mechanics.
How about this though? The forecast is that the U.S. deficit will drop $1.7 TRILLION this year. Biggest drop in U.S. history.
So come on "Merican. Want to give Biden high five for that? Getting the country back on track? Or do you just LIVE for bullshit grievance?
@irishmolly72 Do you know how debt works? This is the first time in six years the debt is being paid down. Did you know that Trump increased the debt by 33%? About $7 TRILLION. Or that the deficit is projected to drop $1.7 trillion by the end of the year under Biden? Biggest drop in history. Sit down please. My take is that you don't give a shit about the debt or deficit. You want to whine. Like all the other America-haters out there.. You, and those like you, want failure. Well, shove it. No interest in those like you. You get your 'news' from those out to manipulate you and then you parrot as if you've "done your own research." It's nonsense. No self respect. I'll never understand it.
SW-User
He’s going to love it… not! He’s paying for adults who lived on the taxpayer’s dime… and now don’t have to pay any share!
People talk about how Biden is trying to buy votes with this move. Why does that matter? Does anyone truly believe he will make it through even THIS four years without keeling over one day?
Also they talk about the deficit. What does that even matter? Not like it is ever going to get paid off anyways.
@irishmolly72 well if we can help get qualified people to that level of income, this will help to promote the economy. They will pay back into the system with taxes, as well as feed the workforce with trained, smart people.
@BackyardShaman But the incomes themselves, without subsidies, provide a rate of return more than sufficient to justify the investment in tuition. Therefore we're simply screwing over everyone who chose not to go down that path. It's a misallocation of resources and an injustice to blue collar workers, small business owners and others.