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Facts about billionaires. They don't have bank accounts like we do...

They have art collections, yachts, mansions and stocks.

None of it is taxed until they sell it. So they don't sell it; they borrow against it instead. They then live off the loans and pay almost nothing.

Then when they die, their children inherit it, all tax-free.

Their wealth never gets taxed. It just gets passed down.

For the rest of us:

We're taxed when we earn money.
We're taxed when we spend money.
We're taxed when we save money.
And we're taxed when we're dead and our children inherit our money.

Billionaires borrow against their wealth, and skip all four.

Same country, different rules.

And Americans wonder why the inequality gap keeps getting wider.
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Ynotisay · M
Accurate. There's a multitude of ways they hide their wealth. The game changed with Reagan and the writing was on the wall then. And that it coincided with the Christian Conservative movement, and co-opting "patriotism," wasn't an accident. They manufactured culture wars to divide because they knew that a unified populous would put an end to the strategy.

If there was ONE issue in this country that should bring Americans together, irrespective of party, it's wealth disparity. But nope. The hooks are in too deep. It's "Us vs. Them" but the "us" is fighting the wrong enemy.People have been systematically brainwashed to kiss the hand that beats them.

It's when I'm most reminded that more than 50% of Americans read below a 6th grade level.
The loans have to be paid back.
You left that out.
Most placesa also have inheirtance/estate taxes. Yo left that out too.
Oh, yes, and their income was taxed in the first place.
Waveney · MNew
@Ynotisay I just don't understand how people slavishly defend the billionaire class.. I really don't.
Ynotisay · M
@Waveney I used to think that they thought that maybe, jusssst maybe, they'd see real wealth too. It's clearly a fools game but now I think it's just a reflexive action.

Trickle down economics, at its core, is dependent on the very rich moving the money down so it reaches the "regular" people. But that's not what happens. Yet that's what fed to them.

Those who beat their chests about being strong are purposefully putting themselves in a position to be dependent on others. But it's so easy to feed them "data" that supports trickle down and that's all it takes.

But the big one is "enemy." ANYTHING the comes from outside their bubble is to be discounted, dismissed and beaten back. It truly is a systematic brainwashing and it's led us to Trump.

It's the bastion of the weakest and most malleable. Those who want authoritarian rule and want to be dependent on others. And they will always explain it away as evidenced by some of the comments here.

Elon Musk sees revenue roughly around $20 to $30 million an HOUR. And the richest man in the world has killed the poorest children in the world through DOGE. But they stand up to defend him with ferocity. The SAME man they used to hate. Just like how they used to hate the big money New Yorkers like Trump. But now they are like "them." I just can't wrap my head around it.
@Waveney What I don't understand is how some people slavishly trust the government class more than they trust their rich neignbors.
Picklebobble2 · 56-60, M
Oh the wealthier you are the more loopholes there are to bury your tax burden.

For example why own a business with your name on the company register ?
You simply create a figment of your imagination. Ensure they have 'responsibility', list yourself as a 'Consultant' who, as it happens, receives no 'salary' as such but magically has an endless line of credit everywhere as you can prove to creditors you own the assets of it.

Then you just rob 'Peter to pay Paul' each month, ensuring you pay the interest accrued without touching the assets until you can right them off without attracting attention from the tax office.
Bank deposits for an individual are only insured by the FDIC to $250,000 total per bank. A low end billionaire wanting to protect his/her wealth would then need such max deposits in 4,000 different banks. High end billionaires would need such deposits in 400,000 bank,

Once much beyond just being a millionaire you are pretty much on your own with protecting your wealth.
MaryJo1996 · 26-30, F
Might be better off attacking governments that allow these loopholes to exist.

Some people have earned their money and paid their taxes.
SunshineGirl · 36-40, F
@MaryJo1996 These "loopholes", as you call them, are to enable businesses to create wealth and jobs which benefit the whole of society. They are not for extremely wealthy individuals to shield their personal fortunes and pay an actual tax rate percentage less than that of a shop assistant.
MaryJo1996 · 26-30, F
@SunshineGirl Indeed. And that's the fault of governents for not closing said loopholes.
@SunshineGirl That's not how it works though. Tax laws force corporations to bury their earnings in expenses and force them to distribute retained earnings in dividends so those dividends can be taxed when received by stockholders.

Do the math:

$100 earned by a corporation
-$36 corporate income tax
$64 remaining to either be retained or distributed to stockholders
-$20 personal income taxes paid by stockholders
-----
$44 what's left from $100 corporate profits after JUST income taxes. And what can be done with that $44? It can be used to pay sales taxes, real estate taxes, excise taxes and a hundred other taxes.

Understandable that some corporations rarely show a profit but instead cancel would be profits by more expenses and growth.

The greatest loophole is for corporations that run negative shareholder equity, and pay those same stockholders consulting and management fees. The corporation never earns a profit and thus pays no corporate income tax. Instead they expense would-be profits to the owners as consultant and management fees. Congress could easily close that loophole but they don't.
justbob · 61-69, M
This is half true. But they buy all those assets with earnings that they have already paid tax on once, the art and the boats and the real estate do not fall from the sky.
justbob · 61-69, M
@Waveney

Nope. You are not getting it.

By the time they get done with the Earned Income Credit and the refundable part of the Child Tax Credit, low income families pay less than nothing. They file tax returns and walk away with a net profit.

The bottom 40% pay literally nothing. Especially when you look at all of the states that also have refundable credits.

As far as taxing unrealized growth, that idea is controversial at best. Most people who actually look at what the result would be agree it would be a bad idea. Bernie Sanders means well, I assume, but his policies would be disasterous if enacted.
Waveney · MNew
@justbob Dude you’re moving the goalposts. My point was about billionaires and unrealized gains like how they can borrow against Tesla shares, art, or real estate and defer capital gains tax. Now you’re talking about refundable credits and low-income households paying nothing?? That’s a totally different debate.

Yes, refundable credits exist and some households get more back than they paid in federal income tax. That’s policy design, not proof billionaires pay their fair share.

Now you're mentioning Bernie? You’re using him as a stand-in for all proposals onrealized wealth, instead of addressing how the current tax code actually treats ultra-rich asset growth??

I call deflection.
justbob · 61-69, M
@Waveney The way the current tax code teats unrealized growth is not a problem. The problem would be the absurdly heavy burden of tracking the increases and decreases in asset value from year to year.

It would not only be impractical it would create bizarre eddies in the income stream of the Treasury. If Mr. Musk's stock value goes down and he claims refunds of hundreds of millions of dollars what does that do to the budget?

Do people have to get each piece of real estate appraised each year? I hope hey don't hire the guy who valued Trump's place as worth less than a vacant lot back when they were accusing him of bank fraud!

It is just not workable. It is a very silly idea. I mention Bernie because he is almost the only serious politician who advocates it.
BrandNewMan · 61-69, M
They do have bank accounts .. do generate some taxable income .. but absolutely do use the tax code to save on taxes where ever they can.

Stop lying. The real truth ...



https://www.google.com/search?q=%25+of+taxes+in+us+paid+by+tax+bracket&client=ms-android-verizon-us-rvc3&hs=pU79&sca_esv=e0de6c95d35408ea&sxsrf=ANbL-n4XlHP3So6euHix4467OWDu-FvZQw%3A1772544709156&ei=xeKmaYiCCeTmwN4Pz-2nuQ8&biw=338&bih=603&oq=%25+of+taxes+in+us+paid+by+tax+bracket&gs_lp=EhNtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1zZXJwIiQlIG9mIHRheGVzIGluIHVzIHBhaWQgYnkgdGF4IGJyYWNrZXQyBRAhGKABMgUQIRigATIFECEYoAEyCBAAGIAEGKIEMgUQABjvBUilowFQrwpY95oBcAJ4AZABApgBwQGgAfwzqgEEMS40MrgBA8gBAPgBAZgCI6AC3iuoAi3CAgoQABiwAxjWBBhHwgINEAAYgAQYsAMYQxiKBcICExAuGIAEGLADGEMYyAMYigXYAQHCAhYQLhiABBiwAxhDGOUEGMgDGIoF2AEBwgILEC4YgAQYsQMYgwHCAhAQABiABBixAxhDGIMBGIoFwgIKEC4YgAQYQxiKBcICChAAGIAEGEMYigXCAgUQLhiABMICBxAuGCcY6gLCAgcQIxgnGOoCwgINECMY8AUYJxjJAhjqAsICFhAuGIIGGIMGGCcY-gUY6gIY7QUY3QXCAg0QLhjRAxjHARgnGOoCwgIKECMY8AUYJxjqAsICEBAAGAMYtAIY6gIYjwHYAQHCAhAQLhgDGLQCGOoCGI8B2AEBwgIKEC4YgAQYJxiKBcICBBAjGCfCAgsQABiABBiRAhiKBcICCxAuGIAEGJECGIoFwgIFEAAYgATCAg4QLhiABBixAxjRAxjHAcICERAuGIAEGJECGNEDGMcBGIoFwgILEAAYgAQYsQMYgwHCAggQLhiABBixA8ICCBAAGIAEGLEDwgIOEC4YgAQYsQMYgwEYigXCAggQABiABBjJA8ICBhAAGBYYHsICCBAAGBYYChgewgILEAAYgAQYhgMYigXCAgUQIRirApgDK_EFtUqYNRDPzVCIBgGQBg-6BgQIARgIkgcGMi4zMi4xoAenowKyBwYwLjMyLjG4B5crwgcIMi0yOC41LjLIB4sCgAgA&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-serp
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carpediem · M
@Waveney It looks to me you'll be stuck in complacency forever kid. Stop your whining and make something of yourself. Super weathly people don't magically become that way...they create value that earns them their wealth. So create something of value yourself and stop being the whiney little kid pouting in the corner. Have some self respect, rise up and be a man. 🙄
How do they pay the loans?
FloorGenAdm · 51-55, M
We're not picking on millionaires anymore...they gotta be billionaires nowadays?
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