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ElwoodBlues · M
@BohemianBoo says [quote]In red states, yes.[/quote]
Sad but true.
Some books banned in Florida schools
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[b]https://www.theledger.com/story/news/state/2022/04/26/florida-school-book-bans-these-library-titles-being-reviewed-school-boards/9542938002/[/b]
"From July 2021 to June 2022, PEN America’s Index of School Book Bans lists 2,532 instances of individual books being banned, affecting 1,648 unique book titles."
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[b]https://pen.org/report/banned-usa-growing-movement-to-censor-books-in-schools/[/b]
Also see https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/book-bans-florida-public-schools/
I don't know WHY Florida banned so many math books, but they did.
[quote] May 6, 2022 — A Florida Department of Education review of 132 math books has led to the banning of more than 40% of them.[/quote]
[b]https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/news/2022/05/06/florida-bans-more-than-40--oif-math-books-after-review[/b]
Florida passed a law in 2022 that said educators could be prosecuted for 3rd degree felony if they display any unapproved books.
And nobody knows what's been approved.
So the only safe way for educators to stay out of jail is to HIDE ALL THE BOOKS!!!
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Sad but true.
Some books banned in Florida schools
[b]https://www.theledger.com/story/news/state/2022/04/26/florida-school-book-bans-these-library-titles-being-reviewed-school-boards/9542938002/[/b]"From July 2021 to June 2022, PEN America’s Index of School Book Bans lists 2,532 instances of individual books being banned, affecting 1,648 unique book titles."
[b]https://pen.org/report/banned-usa-growing-movement-to-censor-books-in-schools/[/b]Also see https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/book-bans-florida-public-schools/
I don't know WHY Florida banned so many math books, but they did.
[quote] May 6, 2022 — A Florida Department of Education review of 132 math books has led to the banning of more than 40% of them.[/quote]
[b]https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/news/2022/05/06/florida-bans-more-than-40--oif-math-books-after-review[/b]
Florida passed a law in 2022 that said educators could be prosecuted for 3rd degree felony if they display any unapproved books.
And nobody knows what's been approved.
So the only safe way for educators to stay out of jail is to HIDE ALL THE BOOKS!!!
BohemianBoo · M
@ElwoodBlues This is why the "Enlightened Centrism" bullshit pisses me off. We have this open fascist movement that we should be destroying any way we can, and we have morons equating this with people boycotting J.K. Rowling.
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@ElwoodBlues Uncle Sam still dare tell the rest of the world that is the "Land Of The Free" when even something as neutral and universal as Mathematics is subject to censorship?
The Taliban would be impressed!
That map shows more than half of the USA by area affected, but I don't know how that equates to population. It's curious that the number of proscribed titles is either under-50 or over 250. I wonder what is behind that? ]
I can imagine these states sharing lists to produce a coherent policy across as much of the USA as possible, but perhaps, luckily, that's not occurred to them.
If it is now a serious criminal offence for Florida teachers to display (i.e. even simply admit the existence) of certain books; what of public libraries and book-shops?
What of private ownership? What if a school were to discover that some student's family had read and enjoyed one of the banned ones; or found a student reading a physical or on-line copy? What would it do if other pupils asked that individual what these books are about?
What of someone circumventing the ban by buying copies by mail-order, or physically when on holiday in a free state or abroad?
Have the censors also thought that banning a book on some spurious grounds might actually increase its sales on the "Forbidden Fruits" principle?
.....
[i]As far as I know[/i], the last attempt in Britain to ban a serious work of fiction by a noted author was against D.H. Lawrence's [i]Lady Chatterley's Lover[/i].
Its publication in unexpurgated form complete with four-letter words and explicit scenes, resulted in an obscenity charge against its publishers, Penguin Books.
At the High Court hearing it was stoutly if rather pretentiously defended for its literary merit by a string of literati. Years later they did admit it not one of Lawrence's better works, but they were defending the right not the story. The prosecution case collapsed in ridicule thanks to its own barrister's well-meaning but socially-ignorant, overweeningly-pompous summing-up to the jury. It was though banned for a time at least, in some other nations, including the USA that has no qualms about gratuitous swearing and violence in films.
More recently [i]LCL[/i] appeared in some GCE Advanced-Level (ages 16 - 18) English Literature syllabi, in British schools; but I don't know if they use editions with the language and explicitness toned down a bit without spoiling the sense and nature of the text.
The footnotes in my school copy of Shakespeare's [i]A Midsummer Night's Dream,[/i] explained that in the "Rude Mechanicals' " earthy humour, "French Crowns" was V.D.; while in Macbeth, "drab" mentioned by the Three Witches means "prostitute". Shock horror: children aged only 14-15 learning 16-17C sexual slang from their set school texts.
When was that infamous trial?
1960. [/i]Sixty-three years ago![/i]
The Taliban would be impressed!
That map shows more than half of the USA by area affected, but I don't know how that equates to population. It's curious that the number of proscribed titles is either under-50 or over 250. I wonder what is behind that? ]
I can imagine these states sharing lists to produce a coherent policy across as much of the USA as possible, but perhaps, luckily, that's not occurred to them.
If it is now a serious criminal offence for Florida teachers to display (i.e. even simply admit the existence) of certain books; what of public libraries and book-shops?
What of private ownership? What if a school were to discover that some student's family had read and enjoyed one of the banned ones; or found a student reading a physical or on-line copy? What would it do if other pupils asked that individual what these books are about?
What of someone circumventing the ban by buying copies by mail-order, or physically when on holiday in a free state or abroad?
Have the censors also thought that banning a book on some spurious grounds might actually increase its sales on the "Forbidden Fruits" principle?
.....
[i]As far as I know[/i], the last attempt in Britain to ban a serious work of fiction by a noted author was against D.H. Lawrence's [i]Lady Chatterley's Lover[/i].
Its publication in unexpurgated form complete with four-letter words and explicit scenes, resulted in an obscenity charge against its publishers, Penguin Books.
At the High Court hearing it was stoutly if rather pretentiously defended for its literary merit by a string of literati. Years later they did admit it not one of Lawrence's better works, but they were defending the right not the story. The prosecution case collapsed in ridicule thanks to its own barrister's well-meaning but socially-ignorant, overweeningly-pompous summing-up to the jury. It was though banned for a time at least, in some other nations, including the USA that has no qualms about gratuitous swearing and violence in films.
More recently [i]LCL[/i] appeared in some GCE Advanced-Level (ages 16 - 18) English Literature syllabi, in British schools; but I don't know if they use editions with the language and explicitness toned down a bit without spoiling the sense and nature of the text.
The footnotes in my school copy of Shakespeare's [i]A Midsummer Night's Dream,[/i] explained that in the "Rude Mechanicals' " earthy humour, "French Crowns" was V.D.; while in Macbeth, "drab" mentioned by the Three Witches means "prostitute". Shock horror: children aged only 14-15 learning 16-17C sexual slang from their set school texts.
When was that infamous trial?
1960. [/i]Sixty-three years ago![/i]
gol979 · 41-45, M
@ElwoodBlues @BohemianBoo you are against all censorship? (I think you will know where this is going)
Radicals, right and left, are attacking our freedom of speech.
*Right-wing radicals want to suppress any mention of trans people.
*LGBTQ/Trans activists attack Harry Potter author J.K. Rowling for her opinions.
Suppressing freedom of speech encourages a precedent which may be turned around and used against the very people suppressing others Freedom of Speech.
"The right to free speech is more important than the content of the speech."
Voltaire
*Right-wing radicals want to suppress any mention of trans people.
*LGBTQ/Trans activists attack Harry Potter author J.K. Rowling for her opinions.
Suppressing freedom of speech encourages a precedent which may be turned around and used against the very people suppressing others Freedom of Speech.
"The right to free speech is more important than the content of the speech."
Voltaire
View 4 more replies »
Roundandroundwego · 61-69
@badminton corporate radicals? Twitter and the Dems are radical?
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@badminton No, it is not "hate" to be truthful, but the problem she ran into was that certain groups do not want anyone to know facts they find personally uncomfortable.
Hatred is an emotion, an opinion. Truth is simple fact even if you don't like the fact personally.
But refusing to enjoy the works by any writer, composer or other artist merely for he or she expressing opinions or facts you dislike, outside of those works, is negative, even childish, and achieves absolutely nothing at all useful or helpful.
Even worse when used as a political weapon, for that is nakedly dictatorial whether by Left or Right, and that left or right is by US or European definition.
Hatred is an emotion, an opinion. Truth is simple fact even if you don't like the fact personally.
But refusing to enjoy the works by any writer, composer or other artist merely for he or she expressing opinions or facts you dislike, outside of those works, is negative, even childish, and achieves absolutely nothing at all useful or helpful.
Even worse when used as a political weapon, for that is nakedly dictatorial whether by Left or Right, and that left or right is by US or European definition.
therighttothink50 · 56-60, M
Are We the Byzantines?
The Byzantines never woke up in time to understand what they had become. Will Americans?
https://amgreatness.com/2023/03/16/are-we-the-byzantines/
The 7 Signs Of An Empire In Decline
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CmOn3AuVVE&t=4s&pp=2AEEkAIB
_________
The American empire is within an accelerating stage of its demise. Corruption, complacence and an obsession with idiotic/irrelevant nonsense have brought America to its knees. The US has become Ancient Rome on steroids, rotting to its very core from within. With most of the population oblivious to reality, America has sunk deep into a hole which has now become impossible to climb out of.
A citizenry and a country obsessed with consumerism but with no real ability to produce anything will soon face the grim reality of a world which will now shun/isolate the US. Corrupt leaders who have abused power for decades and have used their positions of power for the gain of their own personal wealth will soon realize that even they won't be immune to the extreme hardship which is coming to this country.
When people show no regard for future generations and become obsessive virtue signaling parasites, empires crumble. When a citizenry fails to take the actions necessary to defend freedom and liberty, anarchy and tyranny ensue.
A nation which debases its own currency and accumulates massive amounts of debt which it has no intention of ever paying back, these reckless and irresponsible actions usher in financial armageddon. We as a people and our government have lost all respect and credibility throughout the world. No longer are we the shining beacon on the hill, but rather we have become like a deadbeat dad on drugs. A country which leaves its borders wide open, vulnerable to foreign invasion and the excessive flow of illegal drugs and human trafficking eventually self-destructs.
A majority of American people who forget their history and who don't take the time to reflect upon and contemplate with extreme gratitude those who paid the ultimate sacrifice to preserve their way of life, these ungrateful people deserve the misery which awaits them all.
When a majority of citizens casually accept the results of numerous rigged elections and who ignore the weaponization of their own government against their own fellow citizens, the collective soul of a nation rots. When a government and private corporations become one, fascism ensues. When individuals have no regard for freedom of speech and the opinions of others we are no longer a republic. Mob rule reigns, when the stifling of speech/critical thinking is lauded and when the use of logic is frowned upon, this type of widely accepted radical behavior destroys free societies.
Empires do not last when citizens tolerate the satanic actions/words, immorality and anarchy of a fringe bunch of radical leftists. Every single time we choose to ignore the evil and corruption surrounding our society we fall deeper into a dark abyss. A society with no moral clarity or conviction which becomes obsessed with immediate gratification, vanity and convenience becomes stagnant.
The tube of "toothpaste"prosperity is now empty, no matter how many times this spoiled majority of low IQ social "woke" misfits stomp on it, nothing else will flow from it. A citizenry which sits idly by and watches a bloated maniacal and demonic overreaching government destroy its own energy and food sectors, their nation's very lifeblood for survival deserve the fate which awaits them all.
God will not bless a nation of cowards who don't have the courage to battle evil and who refuse to fight for their own survival. The price of ignoring all this madness and evil which now totally envelops our land like a plague will be the end of the American empire.
The Byzantines never woke up in time to understand what they had become. Will Americans?
https://amgreatness.com/2023/03/16/are-we-the-byzantines/
The 7 Signs Of An Empire In Decline
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CmOn3AuVVE&t=4s&pp=2AEEkAIB
_________
The American empire is within an accelerating stage of its demise. Corruption, complacence and an obsession with idiotic/irrelevant nonsense have brought America to its knees. The US has become Ancient Rome on steroids, rotting to its very core from within. With most of the population oblivious to reality, America has sunk deep into a hole which has now become impossible to climb out of.
A citizenry and a country obsessed with consumerism but with no real ability to produce anything will soon face the grim reality of a world which will now shun/isolate the US. Corrupt leaders who have abused power for decades and have used their positions of power for the gain of their own personal wealth will soon realize that even they won't be immune to the extreme hardship which is coming to this country.
When people show no regard for future generations and become obsessive virtue signaling parasites, empires crumble. When a citizenry fails to take the actions necessary to defend freedom and liberty, anarchy and tyranny ensue.
A nation which debases its own currency and accumulates massive amounts of debt which it has no intention of ever paying back, these reckless and irresponsible actions usher in financial armageddon. We as a people and our government have lost all respect and credibility throughout the world. No longer are we the shining beacon on the hill, but rather we have become like a deadbeat dad on drugs. A country which leaves its borders wide open, vulnerable to foreign invasion and the excessive flow of illegal drugs and human trafficking eventually self-destructs.
A majority of American people who forget their history and who don't take the time to reflect upon and contemplate with extreme gratitude those who paid the ultimate sacrifice to preserve their way of life, these ungrateful people deserve the misery which awaits them all.
When a majority of citizens casually accept the results of numerous rigged elections and who ignore the weaponization of their own government against their own fellow citizens, the collective soul of a nation rots. When a government and private corporations become one, fascism ensues. When individuals have no regard for freedom of speech and the opinions of others we are no longer a republic. Mob rule reigns, when the stifling of speech/critical thinking is lauded and when the use of logic is frowned upon, this type of widely accepted radical behavior destroys free societies.
Empires do not last when citizens tolerate the satanic actions/words, immorality and anarchy of a fringe bunch of radical leftists. Every single time we choose to ignore the evil and corruption surrounding our society we fall deeper into a dark abyss. A society with no moral clarity or conviction which becomes obsessed with immediate gratification, vanity and convenience becomes stagnant.
The tube of "toothpaste"prosperity is now empty, no matter how many times this spoiled majority of low IQ social "woke" misfits stomp on it, nothing else will flow from it. A citizenry which sits idly by and watches a bloated maniacal and demonic overreaching government destroy its own energy and food sectors, their nation's very lifeblood for survival deserve the fate which awaits them all.
God will not bless a nation of cowards who don't have the courage to battle evil and who refuse to fight for their own survival. The price of ignoring all this madness and evil which now totally envelops our land like a plague will be the end of the American empire.
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@therighttothink50 Terrifying thoughts but at least you still may express them, on an American-owned, American-based forum..... So far.
wonkywinky · 51-55, M
@therighttothink50 Brilliant..It is like we are seeing the last days of Rome.People who are obviously sick and psychotic,are now treated like war heroes.Men are now "brave"because they admit to like wearing lacy panties at the supermarket,while military people often suffer scorn in some quarters,for their patriotism.In future years,if there is any future,it will be known as "the Gay age".
Im glad i wont probably here to see it.
Im glad i wont probably here to see it.
BohemianBoo · M
ProfessorPlum77 · 70-79, MVIP
This is a picture of a "mainly peaceful protest" after the arrest of George Floyd.
BohemianBoo · M
@ProfessorPlum77 Nope, you can google it, this is a photo of the Fascist Party burning books.
wonkywinky · 51-55, M
Gloomy · F
In western countries? No but due to polarisation and a heated online culture and protest culture some people assume they are being "silenced" but in reality it is just two expressions of freedom of speech colliding.
An action follows a reaction. When someone expresses an opinion that seems problematic to many they will react to it with their own freedom of speech. Also in many countries defined hate speech laws are in place to prevent the spread of Nazi ideology or to prevent harrassment.
An action follows a reaction. When someone expresses an opinion that seems problematic to many they will react to it with their own freedom of speech. Also in many countries defined hate speech laws are in place to prevent the spread of Nazi ideology or to prevent harrassment.
originnone · 61-69, M
@Gloomy I'd give up guns for legal lethal injection....
originnone · 61-69, M
@Gloomy Thank you....
ArishMell · 70-79, M
It certainly looks under threat, and not from any Governmental agency, not in democratic (small 'd' !) lands at least.
Instead from people using the culture against itself, such as on-line, or by those self-appointed school governor bodies with too much local-political influence in some parts of America.
To a fortunately-lesser extent in the UK too, where we have not only seen one or two British authors put on that childish American school-censorship list, and J.K. Rowling condemned for pointing out the obvious difference between being genuinely of one sex and of having had a "sex-change" (I think she did call these physical states by the "approved" - by whom for whom, quite? - whatever they may have been at the time.)
For only today we learn Diane Abbot (Labour MP) has been censured by her own party for having made the obvious difference between racial and non-racial prejudice.
Diane is coloured.... and has previously been in bother herself from the Orwellites for her own use of the word "coloured" instead of, "of colour", the allegedly "correct" but grammatically clumsy phrase with exactly the same meaning!
Instead from people using the culture against itself, such as on-line, or by those self-appointed school governor bodies with too much local-political influence in some parts of America.
To a fortunately-lesser extent in the UK too, where we have not only seen one or two British authors put on that childish American school-censorship list, and J.K. Rowling condemned for pointing out the obvious difference between being genuinely of one sex and of having had a "sex-change" (I think she did call these physical states by the "approved" - by whom for whom, quite? - whatever they may have been at the time.)
For only today we learn Diane Abbot (Labour MP) has been censured by her own party for having made the obvious difference between racial and non-racial prejudice.
Diane is coloured.... and has previously been in bother herself from the Orwellites for her own use of the word "coloured" instead of, "of colour", the allegedly "correct" but grammatically clumsy phrase with exactly the same meaning!
therighttothink50 · 56-60, M
Rhode57 · 56-60, M
Yes in the uk we definitly are . You have to be very careful what you say in case you offend people without intentionally meaning to do so . People are far to sensitive about things nowadays . Even stupid things like jokes or threatening to kill someone although you know you never would can be held against you its become ridiculous .
Jeephikelove · 46-50, F
@canusernamebemyusername yes, you’re so right
Roundandroundwego · 61-69
@SW-User you can pretend China isn't the same nation as Taiwan and invade Europe and say it's defense.
Hate? No, because America. Because we can not t negotiate with your nukes and battle ships.
Hate? No, because America. Because we can not t negotiate with your nukes and battle ships.
checkoutanytime · M
checkoutanytime · M
@ElwoodBlues when you fossils win, it looks exactly like a huger ressecion than the previous of 08' 91' 83'77' excetra back to the left dis crediting Calvin Coolidge for historical prosperous mind, in the centralized new age of J.P. Morgan meter readers for EVERYTHING.
ElwoodBlues · M
@checkoutanytime So you agree that more economic growth indicates better leadership?
[quote]From 1952 through June 2020, annualized real stock market returns under Democrats have been 10.6% compared with 4.8% for Republicans.[/quote] [b]https://www.forbes.com/sites/sergeiklebnikov/2020/07/23/historical-stock-market-returns-under-every-us-president/#51469926faaf[/b]
The numbers don't lie. Our economy does FAR better under democratic leadership.
[sep][sep][center]UPDATE[/center][sep][sep]
@checkoutanytime 1952 through June 2020, "our poorest years"??
What you smokin, dude???
[quote]From 1952 through June 2020, annualized real stock market returns under Democrats have been 10.6% compared with 4.8% for Republicans.[/quote] [b]https://www.forbes.com/sites/sergeiklebnikov/2020/07/23/historical-stock-market-returns-under-every-us-president/#51469926faaf[/b]
The numbers don't lie. Our economy does FAR better under democratic leadership.
[sep][sep][center]UPDATE[/center][sep][sep]
@checkoutanytime 1952 through June 2020, "our poorest years"??
What you smokin, dude???
checkoutanytime · M
@ElwoodBlues those were the poorest years of our history, what kind of snake oil are you trying to sell today? All those investments benefited from the petrol market, stop the dishonesty.
justanothername · 51-55, M
Freedom of speech is actually designed to
be the freedom to speak out against a political regime that you disagree with without being killed or imprisoned.
Not having freedom
Of speech applies to Any Russians Speaking out against Putin about the Ukraine war will be imprisoned for treason and disappeared.
Race related hate speech or any form
Of hate is not considered to be free speech which means the hate speaker should feel the consequences of their pathetic online rant.
be the freedom to speak out against a political regime that you disagree with without being killed or imprisoned.
Not having freedom
Of speech applies to Any Russians Speaking out against Putin about the Ukraine war will be imprisoned for treason and disappeared.
Race related hate speech or any form
Of hate is not considered to be free speech which means the hate speaker should feel the consequences of their pathetic online rant.
But not free stuff. Have you seen all those looters?
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@Pitchblue I don't know the background to that but wouldn't the insurers refuse to pay if they found the shops had not been protected adequately against thieves?
I can understand Walmart closing shops to sell only by Internet purchases, as the banks are doing in the UK, but that's a different point. It does not occur to the companies that we do not all live with a computer or "smart"-'phone at our sides; or if it does, they do not care.
I can understand Walmart closing shops to sell only by Internet purchases, as the banks are doing in the UK, but that's a different point. It does not occur to the companies that we do not all live with a computer or "smart"-'phone at our sides; or if it does, they do not care.
@ArishMell They don't care. If you are to old to understand the internet and how to buy things there, be gone, they don't need you. If you are poor and don't have a computer, tough luck, goodbye. If Walmart wanted to protect their goods they would have armed security at the doors. No one cares about the people stealing. If a few got shot would anyone care then?
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@Pitchblue I agree - most large firms are now run by people young enough to have been brought up so surrounded by Internet-y things that they cannot comprehend life without.
Age is no barrier to understanding the Internet - it is a myth that it is only older people who are not on-line - but poverty may well be, barring even many in their teens or 20s from Internet access and so-called "smart"-'phone.
The idea that shop security guards need be armed and no-one would care if they shoot anyone , presumably dead, is a chilling reminder of the sort of society they work in.
Age is no barrier to understanding the Internet - it is a myth that it is only older people who are not on-line - but poverty may well be, barring even many in their teens or 20s from Internet access and so-called "smart"-'phone.
The idea that shop security guards need be armed and no-one would care if they shoot anyone , presumably dead, is a chilling reminder of the sort of society they work in.
MrBrownstone · 46-50, M
oldercanuck1 · 70-79, M
Happening up herein Canada as well ,, only he has control of everything ,,, radio tv ,, internet ,,,music ,, film ,, ready material ,, just to name a few ,,
DeWayfarer · 61-69, M
Define free speech?
Is it ones sides free speech rights to disrupt the others rights to free speech?
I don't believe so!
Is it ones sides free speech rights to disrupt the others rights to free speech?
I don't believe so!
SW-User
Losing free speech = losing hate speech. Cry me a river.
gol979 · 41-45, M
@SW-User a strange one where you fill the void of no context in relation to the 2 words "free speech" to equate to "hate speech"
SW-User
@gol979 I'm only going by the past history of posting of people who talk about "free speech"...
graphite · 61-69, M
Yes. There are enough people who no longer even believe in free speech. 😥
Convivial · 26-30, F
No. Only as long as you agree with the loudest person in the room!
misterhat · M
no books no lectures no nothing we'll all be idiots now
JohnOinger · 41-45, M
@Laura7 So what do you think of Jason Momoa & would you do him
JohnOinger · 41-45, M
yes
BigGuy2 · 26-30, M
@JohnOinger man of few words
specman · 51-55, M
Simply put Yes!
Roundandroundwego · 61-69
That ship has sailed.
LandOfOz · 61-69, M
I think so
ExtremeNext · 31-35
On SW yes
radishjob · 18-21, F
Hi
BohemianBoo · M
@radishjob Hello.
Fairydust · F
Yes 🙌🏻
Human1000 · M
Yes, from both sides.
SW-User
Yes, DeSantis, Trump and Musk have been actively trying to censor people and ban books
BohemianBoo · M
@calicuz [quote]You're right. The Left is condoning rioting and looting,[/quote]
Name some mainstream Leftists who condone rioting and looting.
Name some mainstream Leftists who condone rioting and looting.
BigGuy2 · 26-30, M
The word 'Losing' implies that it's just not being used {free speech} ... i'm guessing you'll get more feedback if you use the word 'destroyed' ... sad state of affairs indeed