Even Jesus went to hell. And the other destinations are death and the sea.
Revelation 20:11-15 (KJ21) = "11 And I saw a great white throne and Him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away, and there was found no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and the books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them; and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire."
Acts 2:30-32 (TLB) = "30 But he was a prophet, and knew God had promised with an unbreakable oath that one of David’s own descendants would be the Messiah and[a] sit on David’s throne. 31 David was looking far into the future and predicting the Messiah’s resurrection, and saying that the Messiah’s soul would not be left in hell and his body would not decay. 32 He was speaking of Jesus, and we all are witnesses that Jesus rose from the dead."
Yes i am very sure of what i believe because God revealed Himself to me.. I know God exists and He is the God of Abraham..
You need the atonement of the LORD Jesus because you have transgressed the will of God.. People need to be justly forgiven, if not then they have to pay the eternal penalty for their transgressions against the will of God..
Jesus atoned for transgressions by allowing Himself to be executed on a cross.. thereby baying the death penalty for all sinners who believe Him and trust that His death on the cross paid the penalty for their transgressions..
All those who reject the atonement of the LORD Jesus shall pay the penalty for their own sins in the eternal lake of fire..
Dance? No dance. You are telling me about what you believe and I'm reciprocating. Dalai Lama XIV wrote, In the Buddha's Words: An Anthology of Discourses from the Pali Canon: "The Buddha who stares back at us from the texts will be too much a reflection of ourselves, too little an image of the Enlightened One." I think that is true of religion as well as irreligion. After over a quarter of a century of these sorts of discussions I have learned that often, when you talk to religious or irreligious people it isn't about Jesus, God, Buddha, etc. ad infinitum, but rather, it is really about the person's manifestation of an ideological fixation. An emotional, sociopolitical and cultural knee jerk reaction to a personal world view. We make an idea a part of us and then must defend and propagate it as if it should be everyone's.
You appear to judge beyond the scope of your influence in Jesus' name.
Yes i am very sure of what i believe because God revealed Himself to me.
How so?
I know God exists and He is the God of Abraham.
That specific God told his people that for them, to call out his name was salvation. So, what was this God's name and salvation from what?
You need the atonement of the LORD Jesus because you have transgressed the will of God.
Seems extraordinarily ambiguous to me. Here's why:
You assume I or at least a collective "you" need the atonement in question. That isn't necessarily the case. For at least two reasons. Firstly, Jesus didn't come to convert unbelievers or save them. He originally came only for the believing Jews who were lost but when they rejected him the offer was extended to the gentile. That means the atonement you speak of isn't needed by anyone, and isn't wanted by many. Narrow is the gate. Most professed followers are disciples of a distorted idolatrous tradition based on ancient Greek philosophy and other extrabiblical pagan nonsense. The Cross from Constantine, trinity from Plato, immortal soul from Socrates, even lately evolution from Empedocles. Christmas from Saturnalia, Easter from Ishtar and the rapture from Darby. Hell from Milton and Dante.
Secondly, there is going to be a resurrection of the unrighteous as well as the righteous or wicked. (Acts 24:15; https://biblehub.com/acts/24-15.htm) Paul was referring to those people, all throughout time, who weren't introduced to God, his law and sin. Your self-righteous judgmental ideology doesn't encourage an accurate understanding of Jehovah God through the Bible. It only condemns "you."
You see that in your use of the term LORD. The term appears in Bible translations that allow for the scribal removal of God's name, Jehovah out of a superstitious fear the common man will profane it. The Generic Hebrew term adonay (https://biblehub.com/searchhebrew.php?q=adonay).
So, people who don't want God, the atonement, everlasting life don't need it and those who haven't been introduced to it don't need it either, demonstrably because they don't have it.
People need to be justly forgiven, if not then they have to pay the eternal penalty for their transgressions against the will of God.
Romans 6:7 (https://biblehub.com/romans/6-7.htm) reminds us that sin equals death. Not a literal eternal torment. The meek will inherit the earth and live forever upon it in peace. The others will suffer only eternal death or destruction.
Jesus atoned for transgressions by allowing Himself to be executed on a cross..thereby baying the death penalty for all sinners who believe Him and trust that His death on the cross paid the penalty for their transgressions..
Like I said. Dead. He can't have sacrificed himself temporarily. Jesus was a man. He died. Before he was born as a man in heaven he was, and remains, the archangel Michael. We remember his flesh, his blood.
AND
He didn't die on the cross. The Bible refers to the cross, first used by the pagan god Tammuz, aka, Nimrod, as a dungy idol. It's a phallic symbol detestable to Jews and Christians until introduced ~4 centuries after Christ by the sun worshipping Constantine.
All those who reject the atonement of the LORD Jesus shall pay the penalty for their own sins in the eternal lake of fire..
The lake of fire is symbolic of everlasting destruction. So, the second death. That of those aforementioned as the wicked resurrected. Having not been instructed or, as Paul said, mentored, by the law and sin, who then are judged by rejecting it after then being given that opportunity.
We believers and unbelievers have had that opportunity already so there is no "judgement day" for us. We've already judged ourselves. Believers by their actions [Eidt: AFTER] their having been introduced to it and unbelievers for having rejected it.
@PathwayMachine You have recieved a lot of false reports about the God of Abraham and you have loved these lies.. In the end the Message of the God of Abraham redeems those who embrace His truth and reject the lies..
Loving the truth saves Loving lies destroys
You are responsable for the message you have embraced...
(2 Thessalonians 2:8-12) "And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: {9} Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, {10} And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. {11} And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: {12} That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."
You asked:
Adstar Yes i am very sure of what i believe because God revealed Himself to me.
How so?
He repeatedly showed me the future in dreams and still does.. He repeatedly helped me understand truths in dreams.. All History is already known and everything that will happen down to the most simple human level is known.. We live in the here and now but God exists in His own time and can see all our times and space and can share knowledge with His creation when ever He wishes to do so..
You don't find a TRUE relationship with God in a Church... That's something that you have to do yourself you get in your Bible yourself and pray Trust me I've HAD a true relationship with God and never once stepped in a Church... But IF going to church makes you feel better that's ok... Glad your enjoyed it
Uhhh besides the ways God started trying to get my attention and I knew it... Uhhh I go to the park at a low point in my life and long story short I prayed and said "God if your real can you do something to prove it to me... Or at least prove to me that you hear me??" And I'm walking home from the park and find this laying on the sidewalk.... Bible says "Ask and you shall receive" 🤷🤷🤷🤷 How much more proof do you need?.. and No people hadn't don't those painted rocks in years in my town since it was first popular so I didnt just find a random one... And again my relationship with God even though we ain't like we used to be... Again I had a REAL relationship with him and he heard my prayers and showed me who he was when he done that ..
@sree251 the idea of God didn't come from Judaism. Judaism only came about when the authority of the Aaronic priest was taken over by the Pharisees after the 70 CE Roman destruction of Jerusalem. There were pagan gods before Moses began writing the Bible, so the idea of God can accurately said to have come from God himself or in the time of Adam, long before Israel, Jews, Jerusalem, or Christianity. The English word God itself was used by pagans in worship long before the Christian missionaries adopted it for their own.
Judaism may have adopted earlier Jewish texts including the God concept as did Christians, but that doesn't mean Judaism was a thing then, and besides, Jehovah told Abram/Abraham he would be the god of the nation Israel and it's people, the nations around them had gods before that happened. Of course, Jehovah God existed before any of that, he created Adam, and the scattering of Babel took place spreading people throughout the globe, and those people took the "god concept" from there where it grew into many variations of the "pagans" (outsiders) before and after Abraham's encounter.
Yes, and start by concentrating on the Gospels so that you take in the Christ's view of things, including Jewish Scripture (which He quite consistently misquotes...hmmmm).
Have you had "teachers" or pastors who suggested this?
Adding imaginary background info to the Bible is a too-common theme in some parts of "Christianity". Luther would rightly reject these attempts to satisfy one's curiosity by making up extra-Biblical stories.
@MoveAlong That's the Biblical answer. Heaven or Hell would have been the apostate or religiously nonsensical answer, although hell could be the grave which would also be Biblical. I don't know you well, but I recognize the Brian [Edit: that ain't Brian, that's King Arthur] avatar. You are atheist? Anyway, what about resurrection? Your answer is Biblical, but I take it you don't think you will be resurrected? Resurrection is what the Bible teaches. Not what we "think" of heaven and hell.
@JimboSaturn i will add you to the prayer list. I hope you realize youre loved..even if you dont believe, God still has a plan for you to know youre loved.
@HootyTheNightOwl nobody is ever " good enough " we just learn to adapt. We cant get it right 100 percent, i know faith and i understand trust. I fail daily too, so same boat difference is the paddle. Youre not worthless if you got less, my grandad ALWAYS told me that. God sees your heart. What good have we done? None, but you got a pure ❤..thats why i feel you are at a cross roads and you fear eternity, who doesnt? Even the Egyptian people had afterlife thoughts, curses, blessibgs, spells, etc. And to this day king tut is my fav study
@JimboSaturn no. No money exchanged. I went to an alter and i prayed with the pastors wife, then i cried and felt a burrden lift. Then i was told ill have persecution for my choices, but if i am not persecuted for my faith, then its not faith its works. I felt a change, a shift to be honest.
@CloudAngel80 May you find happiness in your beliefs and friends to share it with. Jimbo and I are more the rational type, expecting proof of claims made.
@JimboSaturn i didnt say you were vile..please re read. I said people who are those things..in general. Never put your name specific on it. As far as tears, everyone cries..even Jesus cried. Never said your life wasnt good, i wished for it to stay good. As for my beliefs...it is mine alone. I didnt throw them on you nor force u to accept it or reject it. I again, hope you have a heart felt knowledgeable experiences in life, and know you are awesome and ill bid you a good night. Just one more thought, the same sun wich melts butter, hardens clay. Hopefully someone in your life shows you the peace of mind i offered. Blessings 🙌
Theirs no hell no heaven all is what you do here ..we had come to this world empty handed shall go back the same ..empty..now it's upto you to listen to religious pandits n be fooled or tell them to go hopp
@romell Strictly speaking, specifically the Biblical word heaven means high, so if you raise your hand above your head, that's heaven. The birds fly and the clouds appear in heaven. The heavens is the universe. These things are real. Hell is the grave, the state of being dead for which there is no moral distinction or consciousness. The "grave" no matter what the form of burial. Pit, grave, sea, tomb, etc. Jonah, for example, called the belly of the large fish he was in "hell." Jesus went to hell, the tomb.
So, what we have to investigate when seriously contemplating these things is the religious nonsense as well as the irreligious nonsense. They are the same, only a different perspective. Not an accurate perspective.
@Vin53 I would say i cant answer the way youre asking...but i can say what i know: God created all things. This included people, animals, planets, etc right? And yes, God created Heaven, and Angels, and the devil, and hell...news flash , he created people for heaven, not for hell..hell was because the devil CHOSE to be used for greed, pride, envy, strife. And when the devil CHOSE this, he got kicked to earth. Those after Adam and Eve get decieved by the devil, they had a choice too of FREE WILL. God doesnt create things without a purpose. And he NEVER created us for hell. He is all knowledgeable, but, he will not mess with free will. We are free to CHOOSE, so its us that make a choice of heaven or hell. His ULTIMATE CREATION choice was create people he loves..not because they wont choose him, but because he chose us. Hell is a destination for those that walked away from the right choices, obedience. We can choose to live good and still have bad happen. Call it fate, but God only goes where you allow him to..
@Vin53 thank you! I hope whatever youre going through ends soon. Struggles are real, questions are needed, thank you for asking because many people also have questions about life, death, heaven, hell, eternity, etc. Thank you for chatting with me! Youre awesome!
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@Vin53 i didnt say i supported trump nor didnt support trump..u merly " ASSUMED" I did. Im not much of a political person. Im more open minded, love to listen, learn..im a deep thinker. As for support in political parties..i pass . Im more interested in how to cook gumbo and im alergic to shrimp. I just feel everything has a purpose..even him..
