Canada to become the first "associate" EU member
So what will this mean for Canada? Why didn't the UK become an associate member when they left if it was so great?
46-50, M
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ArishMell · 70-79, M
@ArtieKat They'd need establish their own versions. Actually there'd be no real reason to move the Royal Mint because it already makes coins and notes for other countries; although this would create a supremely ironical situation.
DVLA goes beyond simply moving offices of course. They'd need create all their own driver and vehicle registration and licensing systems, at their own expense; plus paying for maintaining all their own roads including some 200 miles of motorway in Scotland. Would their Mots be valid in England, and vice-versa, as they are now?
Railways too. I doubt those beyond Glasgow, Edinburgh and Dundee would survive, nor any in Wales apart from Cardiff and Swansea to Bristol and Gloucester, and Liverpool to Holyhead.
The far bigger and thornier question would be that of the Royal Air Force and Royal Navy bases in Wales and Scotland, and various defence research establishments once all part of the MoD. These create a lot of employment in their areas, too. Perhaps they'd need be run as "overseas" facilities. Maybe sharing them with those new nations' own, newly-created defence forces.
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Oh, and on a personal note as this affects members of my own family....
Brother English, sister-in-law Scots; living and working in Scotland; children and now grandchildren born and living there.
Neither wants independence; neither has time for the SNP- which officially despises England - but if it happened, would they need dual nationality? Would I and other relatives need a passport to visit them?
How would they manage if they lived close to the border and had to cross it every day for their work? Like all the commuters back and forth across the R. Severn?
DVLA goes beyond simply moving offices of course. They'd need create all their own driver and vehicle registration and licensing systems, at their own expense; plus paying for maintaining all their own roads including some 200 miles of motorway in Scotland. Would their Mots be valid in England, and vice-versa, as they are now?
Railways too. I doubt those beyond Glasgow, Edinburgh and Dundee would survive, nor any in Wales apart from Cardiff and Swansea to Bristol and Gloucester, and Liverpool to Holyhead.
The far bigger and thornier question would be that of the Royal Air Force and Royal Navy bases in Wales and Scotland, and various defence research establishments once all part of the MoD. These create a lot of employment in their areas, too. Perhaps they'd need be run as "overseas" facilities. Maybe sharing them with those new nations' own, newly-created defence forces.
=====
Oh, and on a personal note as this affects members of my own family....
Brother English, sister-in-law Scots; living and working in Scotland; children and now grandchildren born and living there.
Neither wants independence; neither has time for the SNP- which officially despises England - but if it happened, would they need dual nationality? Would I and other relatives need a passport to visit them?
How would they manage if they lived close to the border and had to cross it every day for their work? Like all the commuters back and forth across the R. Severn?
swirlie · 31-35, F
"Associate Member" of the EU is only a technical business term that acknowledges to both Canada and the EU Membership that Canada has entered into a Free-Trade arrangement with the EU.
I should point out that PM Mark Carney did not want Canada to become an actually "Member" of the European Union in the first place. This is because what becomes the EU's problem is suddenly Canada's problem as well.
This is especially true when it comes to sharing economic issues similar to what UK went through prior to Brexit when Greece suddenly declared bankruptcy and all members of the EU had to bail out Greece financially, including the UK.
This is precisely why the UK wanted out of the EU following this debacle, because of countries like Greece who are not fiscally responsible to themselves, let alone responsible to other EU member Nations.
Canada cannot afford to find itself in a position of having to bail out a member-country of the EU, just because Canada might hold Member-status within the EU community.
To be granted Member-status, Canada would then be expected to fund any bankruptcy 'pot' that suddenly emerged somewhere among the EU Nations, a major expense to Canadians that would not necessarily be foreseen by Canada due to Canada's geographical disadvantage compared to the EU itself.
The last thing Canada needs right now is dealing with problems not of Canada's making. What Mark Carney wanted from the EU was a Free-Trade relationship which Canada actually received from all this at the end of the day, which is the most exciting news for Canada!
Now, Canada will be Trading with 3 Billion Europeans instead of 300 Million Americans.
What the Head of the EU granted to Canada in the EU's recognition of Canada as a Free-Trade trading partner, was the status of "Associate Member" to validate the Free-Trade arrangement which both communities had established between themselves, Canada and the EU, without the USA.
Canada did not actually want a title at all, be it "Associate Member" or "Full Member" because club membership is not what Canada's PM Mark Carney was after in the first place.
The subsequent title of "Associate Member" is to acknowledge Canada as the EU's primary trading partner from the west. 🇨🇦
I should point out that PM Mark Carney did not want Canada to become an actually "Member" of the European Union in the first place. This is because what becomes the EU's problem is suddenly Canada's problem as well.
This is especially true when it comes to sharing economic issues similar to what UK went through prior to Brexit when Greece suddenly declared bankruptcy and all members of the EU had to bail out Greece financially, including the UK.
This is precisely why the UK wanted out of the EU following this debacle, because of countries like Greece who are not fiscally responsible to themselves, let alone responsible to other EU member Nations.
Canada cannot afford to find itself in a position of having to bail out a member-country of the EU, just because Canada might hold Member-status within the EU community.
To be granted Member-status, Canada would then be expected to fund any bankruptcy 'pot' that suddenly emerged somewhere among the EU Nations, a major expense to Canadians that would not necessarily be foreseen by Canada due to Canada's geographical disadvantage compared to the EU itself.
The last thing Canada needs right now is dealing with problems not of Canada's making. What Mark Carney wanted from the EU was a Free-Trade relationship which Canada actually received from all this at the end of the day, which is the most exciting news for Canada!
Now, Canada will be Trading with 3 Billion Europeans instead of 300 Million Americans.
What the Head of the EU granted to Canada in the EU's recognition of Canada as a Free-Trade trading partner, was the status of "Associate Member" to validate the Free-Trade arrangement which both communities had established between themselves, Canada and the EU, without the USA.
Canada did not actually want a title at all, be it "Associate Member" or "Full Member" because club membership is not what Canada's PM Mark Carney was after in the first place.
The subsequent title of "Associate Member" is to acknowledge Canada as the EU's primary trading partner from the west. 🇨🇦
Khenpal1 · M
@swirlie you should sent Trump a thank you basket. The EU had absolutely no appetite to offer the UK a special "Associate" partnership after having been a duplicitous "thorn in the side" of EU for decades.
The past decade has been a rather humbling affair for "Great" Britain. They no longer have any say in the EU and on the world stage the UK has had little impact as it cycles through PM after PM.
Some have argued the UK aggressively supported growth in the EU membership to dilute the powers of France and Germany.
Sadly, the UK still has a large constituency of Farage exceptionalists, the "Americans" of Europe. I would argue that Canada is more European than the UK. Canada is NOT looking to "cherry pick" the EU.
The past decade has been a rather humbling affair for "Great" Britain. They no longer have any say in the EU and on the world stage the UK has had little impact as it cycles through PM after PM.
Some have argued the UK aggressively supported growth in the EU membership to dilute the powers of France and Germany.
Sadly, the UK still has a large constituency of Farage exceptionalists, the "Americans" of Europe. I would argue that Canada is more European than the UK. Canada is NOT looking to "cherry pick" the EU.
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ArishMell · 70-79, M
@MarkPaul On the continent geologically, yes, but very different politically and socially.
I wonder if arrangements similar to those with non-EU nations Iceland, Switzerland and Norway might work. As it is our industries still have to comply with EU rules if they want to trade with it.
Unfortunately the problem was that the EU (which no-one joined*) does not want anyone to leave, made it very difficult for Britain to leave and has made us pay for it; and our own government did not handle the whole process very well either.
The "Associate Member" status is a totally new concept for the EU and it has not been defined. About all we can say is,don't be surprised if the EU makes it as clumsy, complicated and expensive as it can!
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I have my radio on... Just as I typed the above, the News stated Canada's welcoming of the proposal from the EU; but Mark Carney also warning against forming over-large, over-powerful blocs.
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*They joined the European Economic Community, and that changed itself institutionally to the European Union. Nor did Britain ever join "The Common Market". There was no such thing. Prime Minister Edward Heath, an arch-federalist EEC proponent, coined the term as propaganda.)
I wonder if arrangements similar to those with non-EU nations Iceland, Switzerland and Norway might work. As it is our industries still have to comply with EU rules if they want to trade with it.
Unfortunately the problem was that the EU (which no-one joined*) does not want anyone to leave, made it very difficult for Britain to leave and has made us pay for it; and our own government did not handle the whole process very well either.
The "Associate Member" status is a totally new concept for the EU and it has not been defined. About all we can say is,don't be surprised if the EU makes it as clumsy, complicated and expensive as it can!
+++++
I have my radio on... Just as I typed the above, the News stated Canada's welcoming of the proposal from the EU; but Mark Carney also warning against forming over-large, over-powerful blocs.
+++++
*They joined the European Economic Community, and that changed itself institutionally to the European Union. Nor did Britain ever join "The Common Market". There was no such thing. Prime Minister Edward Heath, an arch-federalist EEC proponent, coined the term as propaganda.)
MarkPaul · 26-30, M
@ArishMell We could say the same thing about Germany and France. Or Italy and Greece. The EU creates the image and some claim fantasy of unity, but all the nation states combined are hardly a single block. That's by design, by the way. It was never intended to wipe away individual cultures. Brexit was an overreaction-mistake. And still is.
As far as Canada, the affiliate program is mostly a PR stunt but that doesn't dismiss its value or punch to Cry-Baby-trump. He can post all the feel-good and ego-satisfying memes he and his handlers desire showing him fit and puffed up pushing other sovereign nations within and outside the EU around, but the reality of the situation is, he's weak, demented, can barely stay awake, and is a laughingstock around the entire (ENTIRE) world. The power of calling him out with reality instead of with memes is the true (and real) winning move.
As far as Canada, the affiliate program is mostly a PR stunt but that doesn't dismiss its value or punch to Cry-Baby-trump. He can post all the feel-good and ego-satisfying memes he and his handlers desire showing him fit and puffed up pushing other sovereign nations within and outside the EU around, but the reality of the situation is, he's weak, demented, can barely stay awake, and is a laughingstock around the entire (ENTIRE) world. The power of calling him out with reality instead of with memes is the true (and real) winning move.
emiliya · 26-30, F
@ArishMell No one cares about strategy in peacetime. They care about strategy in wartime. Europe and Canada have each other, and they mean it.
What have I not been told about? I am just calling you old. Are you not old? I don't get upset when they call me young.
As for "old" that only means we have long memories including for international matters you'd probably not been told about.
What have I not been told about? I am just calling you old. Are you not old? I don't get upset when they call me young.
JimboSaturn · 56-60, M
@emiliya We most certainly are not.
swirlie · 31-35, F
@Yulianna
Not me for sure! I could see that one coming a mile away before it even happened. We have to remember that Canada has been paying the USA the equivalent of 2% of Canada's Gross Domestic Product every year for the past 50 years for what the US calls "protection against foreign adversaries".
The only foreign adversary that has ever invaded Canada was the USA which occurred 7 times during the War of 1812 when they tried 7 times to annex Canada and which failed 7 times, thanks to the Brits who just happened to be here when it all happened.
What Canada has been paying the USA for 50 years is extortion payments, not protection payments from any adversary, other than the Americans themselves.
Not me for sure! I could see that one coming a mile away before it even happened. We have to remember that Canada has been paying the USA the equivalent of 2% of Canada's Gross Domestic Product every year for the past 50 years for what the US calls "protection against foreign adversaries".
The only foreign adversary that has ever invaded Canada was the USA which occurred 7 times during the War of 1812 when they tried 7 times to annex Canada and which failed 7 times, thanks to the Brits who just happened to be here when it all happened.
What Canada has been paying the USA for 50 years is extortion payments, not protection payments from any adversary, other than the Americans themselves.
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ArishMell · 70-79, M
"Associate member" is a novel status not yet defined.
The UK did not become one because there was no such status and no-one had even mooted the idea.
The EU has special trading arrangements with non-members Switzerland, Norway and Iceland; and custom versions of those might be more workable for both Canada and the UK.
It's important to realise:
- There was never any easy way for a nation to leave the EU. Its principle is "once-in, always-in". It has another called au communitaire, which is essentially "What's mine is mine and what's yours is mine". It also makes the European Commission (intended as purely a civil-service body) supreme over the Council of Ministers, European Parliament and individual countries.
- None of the longer-term "members" ever "joined" the European Union. They joined the European Economic Commity, and that later transmogrified itself at institutional level to the EU with no reference to any nations' electorates.
These characteristics are among the many reasons a lot of Britons voted to leave the bloc.
The UK did not become one because there was no such status and no-one had even mooted the idea.
The EU has special trading arrangements with non-members Switzerland, Norway and Iceland; and custom versions of those might be more workable for both Canada and the UK.
It's important to realise:
- There was never any easy way for a nation to leave the EU. Its principle is "once-in, always-in". It has another called au communitaire, which is essentially "What's mine is mine and what's yours is mine". It also makes the European Commission (intended as purely a civil-service body) supreme over the Council of Ministers, European Parliament and individual countries.
- None of the longer-term "members" ever "joined" the European Union. They joined the European Economic Commity, and that later transmogrified itself at institutional level to the EU with no reference to any nations' electorates.
These characteristics are among the many reasons a lot of Britons voted to leave the bloc.
Yulianna · 26-30, F
@ArishMell i strongly suspect that the majority of English people who voted to leave the EU had no idea about any of what you so eloquently explain... the English anti European movement made a populist, nationalist appeal to people's emotions and greed - £350 million per week, i believe.
the myth that the vote was in any way rational is laughable.
the myth that the vote was in any way rational is laughable.
samueltyler2 · 80-89, M
tRump is successfully totally isolating the US. His war that he chose to enter has created a worldwide crisis, he really has not made the US great nor safe! The rest of the world is now truly a powder keg!
Energy Prices Incite Protests Around World:
https://www.nytimes.com/2026/09/15/world/asia/syria-fuel-price-protests-world.html?unlocked_article_code=1.BlE.4M5k.oYvTVdaC5Hw9&smid=url-share
Energy Prices Incite Protests Around World:
https://www.nytimes.com/2026/09/15/world/asia/syria-fuel-price-protests-world.html?unlocked_article_code=1.BlE.4M5k.oYvTVdaC5Hw9&smid=url-share
Mongoheadmonster · 46-50, M
@samueltyler2 sulfur prices are reportedly over a $1000US/ton now vs $170US for the 10 year avg. MAP rose 2.4% this past week. What tRump is doing really has the world in turmoil.....but I think it's not just him....it's Israel....it's Russia. They're all to blame
samueltyler2 · 80-89, M
@Mongoheadmonster Trump has enabled those countries to do what they are doing. The downstream effects will be major and may not felt for weeks or months.
AdmiralPrune · 46-50, M
Fukfacewillie · 56-60, M
Because Brexit, fool.
JimboSaturn · 56-60, M
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Mongoheadmonster · 46-50, M
@jshm2 lots of farmer protests throughout the EU. The government dictates expensive regulations, meanwhile they import commodities from places that have little regulations and lower standards. We have to be careful about what we get ourselves into.
Adstar · 56-60, M
It means virtually nothing.. It is a case of seeming to be doing something to obtain more support from the populace without actually doing anything of any substance..
Elessar · 31-35, M
