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The Odyssey & the decline of historical epics in Hollywood

I’m not a classicist, nor am I a historical purist. I’m an avid enthusiast of historical epics done right. I’m particularly intrigued by those historical epics that manage to convey grandeur, are inspired by actual historical events, and focus on war between men, high politics, the clash of civilizations, and the virtues of courage, patriotism, heroism, leadership, and honor. Themes such as darkness versus light should be deeply ingrained in any historical epic.

Most of all, I expect unabashedly pro-Western, Eurocentric narratives that embrace liberty or righteous vengeance without recourse to superfluous and inauthentic diversity hires. I prefer CGI only from afar, at night, or in the rain—especially when used to depict large-scale armies or crowds—not to conjure up highly sophisticated devices or creatures in close-up, broad daylight shots. A historical epic isn’t meant to be James Cameron’s Avatar.

Visually, movies of the 2020s are, to me, plainly repulsive. The camera movements, the color palette, and the overuse of close-up CGI all undermine the experience. It doesn’t feel real and obstructs the essential immersion into the era in which the story takes place. Make the effort to hire legions of extras, create armor that looks authentic while remaining aesthetically appealing, call the King of Morocco so he may lend your production his nation’s cavalry for a monumental charge scene, and by no means animate ships in close-up. It’s atrocious. Build your own ships. Use practical effects and miniatures instead of computer-animated nonsense.

To make matters worse, the quality of actors has deteriorated rapidly. Actors aren’t what they used to be in the 1990s, 2000s, and early 2010s. Who today could replace a young Leonardo DiCaprio, Russell Crowe, Daniel Day-Lewis, Mel Gibson, Liam Neeson, Brad Pitt, or Christian Bale as the leading man in a fascinating historical epic or a gritty thriller? Rami Malek? Tom Holland? Andrew Garfield? Timothée Chalamet? Joaquin Phoenix? They neither look nor speak like leading men. They’re effete, boyish, somber, cynical, or simply awkward.

And as for the supporting cast, who could replace Richard Harris, Anthony Hopkins, Brian Cox, or Ben Kingsley? Actors like Malek, Phoenix, Adam Driver, and Eddie Redmayne are products of an altogether different era: morally relativistic, ambiguous, diffident, effeminate, insecure, eccentric, awkward, and, in the classical sense, physically less attractive. They can’t embody healthy masculinity in the way Viggo Mortensen did as Aragorn, Jason Patric as Lt. Charles Gatewood in Geronimo: An American Legend, Russell Crowe as Maximus, or Eric Bana as Hector in Troy. More male actors need to occupy the space between the caricature of testosterone-driven masculinity embodied by Sylvester Stallone or Pete Hegseth on the one hand and the meek, sullen, introverted characteristics of most 2020s leading men on the other.

As for The Odyssey, Matt Damon was a predictable dud. He can’t carry movies. He’s an awkward, average-looking know-it-all who revels in the obsessively curated self-image of a perpetually politically “enlightened,” pseudo-intellectual golden boy that he clearly is not. So, if you’re going to cast someone as an ancient hero, choose an older Eric Bana, Chris Pine, Chris Evans, Jim Caviezel, Bradley Cooper, or Henry Cavill—but certainly not an aging, unattractive, and disheveled Matt Damon, whose unfortunate Bourne movies, in my view, helped eclipse the far superior Bond franchise.

These concerning Hollywood trends become particularly evident when one compares Gladiator with Gladiator II, the 2002 Napoleon miniseries with Napoleon (2023), The Lord of the Rings with The Rings of Power, the 2002 version of The Count of Monte Cristo with the 2024 adaptation, or Troy with The Odyssey.

It’s high time for Hollywood to produce epics on a par with The Patriot, Braveheart, Troy, The Last of the Mohicans, Lincoln, Robin Hood, Julius Caesar, Gladiator, Kingdom of Heaven, Exodus, Gangs of New York, Schindler’s List, Cromwell, and Waterloo. The King, Outlaw King, and The Last Duel were adequate by those standards.
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AthrillatheHunt · 56-60, M Best Comment
Troy , Gladiator , kingdom of heaven , and Alexander got it right
CedricH · 22-25, M
@AthrillatheHunt Exactly, as far as antiquity is concerned. Julius Caesar (2002) is another hidden gem, in case you‘re interested. Starring Christopher Walken, Jeremy Sisto, Richard Harris and Chris Noth. Slightly more historical than the others and a bit less mystical.
As for Alexander, the movie got somewhat tedious after the Battle of Gaugamela and his stay in Babylon.

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AthrillatheHunt · 56-60, M
@CedricH great movie but didn’t dig Collin as Alex. Orlando seemed gay in KOH.
CedricH · 22-25, M
@AthrillatheHunt Unlike Crowe, he didn’t shed his native accent. And Alexander with a slight Irish accent is odd. But he looked good.

MarkPaul · 26-30, M
What??? Christopher Nolan didn't use CGI for any (ANY) of the major scenes in the Odyssey. It's why the set has been described as unusually grueling and the outcome as colossally amazing and life-like. As far as your armchair casting, I suspect your "real" preoccupation is something other than what you present as actors who you deem not manly enough to carry the load.

There is certainly much to enjoy about the movies of yesteryear. It's interesting to watch the new style of moviemaker with critics who only wish things would never change.
MarkPaul · 26-30, M
@CedricH Seriously... you have no clue? Please... you're in the centre of the stage now. What do you think it means? I'm genuinely curious after stripping away your superficial rant this is the only (one) issue left.
CedricH · 22-25, M
@MarkPaul You‘re flattering yourself if you think you‘ve stripped away anything.

But it’s a rant for sure and most of it is subjective.

And I‘ve got no glue to what you’re referring, you‘re pretty cryptic. So tell me, what’s on your mind?
MarkPaul · 26-30, M
@CedricH I've been crystal clear, but let me break it down for you in finer simplification:

1. In dispute of your subjectivity, the Odyssey movie is a stunning example of NOT using CGI.
2. In dispute of your armchair casting I am casting doubt you really know what a "real man" is.
3. I am questioning the genuine motivation behind your fact-free rant and giving you an opportunity to embrace and favour honesty over masking what your real hang-up is.
Braveheart ? Historical ? 😂
CedricH · 22-25, M
@Carysoflife Ey 😂 it’s one of my all-time favorites. I can look past the inaccuracies. So they were wearing kilts and the chronology was slightly off. It wasn’t an in-depth documentary of the Anglo-Scottish wars, that’s for sure, but it was a phenomenal historical epic inspired by those events.
voidkitty · 22-25, F
I didn't like the Odyssey for some of the reasons you list but it is definitely not a CGI heavy film and if there's a single thing that makes me not loathe Nolan as a director is he'd always much rather use practical effects. The end result was 1/10 what it could have been but it's not because of that.
CedricH · 22-25, M
@voidkitty Ya, that was my mistake. I took a look at these giant mythical creatures in their ridiculous armor and thought I saw CGI.

So to specify, I simply didn’t like the visuals of the movie but not because of an overuse of CGI (which is a real problem in many other modern historical epics).

Nolan is a phenomenal director. But some of his movies were duds, like Dunkirk and The Odyssey.
ViciDraco · 41-45, M
Is this a satire post or an honest assessment? It's at the level that I feel it's sarcastically absurd but I can't be positive...

 
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