If slavery was legal... would you keep a slave ?

@BlueVeins yeah i think some people arent honest or think this through

@BlueVeins how are they related?

@samueltyler2 They're both cases where the vast majority of people will do something which is clearly contrary to compassion if it's normalized and legitimized enough.

@BlueVeins yes, that is how do many were slaughtered during the Holocaust!

@BlueVeins @BlueVeins
Make up you mind. Are they eating meat 'just because it's legal' etc, or 'Just for sensory pleasure' - and maybe does hunger and the need for calorie-dense protein also have something to do with it?

Who are these people you speak about; do you know many of them; have you discussed this with them? C'mon, name names!

@Really This strikes me as deliberately obtuse. The core motive for eating meat is (for most of us here in the developed world), sensory pleasure. Yet there are lots of things which are pleasurable that we don't do because they're not socially and legally permitted.


Yeah babe the character limit would not allow me to name most of the population of the United States of America and European Union (among other places), and I don't think that exercise would have any value anyway. I'm talking about broad social trends here. You know what I'm talking about.

@Really
Is there a point you're trying to make with this? It's thought of as different when humans do that shit because we (at least should) know better.

@BlueVeins People say no but but products that are made in sweatshops.

@BlueVeins If lions had moral agency though, they'd still have to eat meat as they're obligate carnivores. They are instinctively driven to seek out animals for their nutrients. Just like we all have meat cravings because we're omnivores. To be vegan is to really ignore that but not saying you can't be vegan, just that you'll forever be seeking out things that look like meat as you're driven to find it as we're biological omnivores.

@BlueVeins Allergies, autoimmune conditions and many other things where being vegan is harder. That's why we're omnivores, if things don't work out health wise we can eat both.

Vegans operate under the assumption that everyone has your genetics, your body, your health problems and that people are herbivores.

We're the only race that doesn't eat a biologically appropriate diet. Regardless of what you say, some people can't be vegan, not everyone has one body type.

@BlueVeins That's the same reason I eat cauliflower, tomatoes, arugula, asparagus and chocolate cookies: Proves nothing except that we all enjoy sensory pleasure.

Wasn't the question a hypothetical one about slavery?

@SatanBurger The vast, vast majority of people don't have autoimmune conditions or allergies unlucky and severe enough to prevent them from eating meat. I'm sympathetic to people in those situations, of course, but it's not like the fucking surge of animal product consumption in the industrial era has come from a fucking autoimmunity epidemic.

@Really The difference is that those foods don't have to be cut out of a sentient creature's body.

@SatanBurger I realize I may be coming off kinda bad here. I don't mean to shit on you personally; you seem like a pretty chill lady and I don't think... this kind of thing is just a personal moral failing. I think people in general underestimate how much the time and place they live in impacts their values and how difficult it can be to show empathy when we're basically given a free pass to do otherwise. Citing animal product consumption as an analogue kinda puts that in perspective.

@BlueVeins True, but that's because eating meat and dairy is still normal. Most people living today would have answered yes to the slavery question if they lived back when it was still the norm.
So yeah, I believe most people who say they're against slavery today. And hopefully one day, veganism will be the norm.

@BohemianBabe When I read, "If slavery was legal," I assume that refers to a time where it's normalized by default, but I see how that's not necessarily the case. I agree with your analysis.

@BlueVeins The first animal that demands not to be eaten will be the last time I eat meat, of any kind.

@Vin53 I'm an animal. I demand not to be eaten.

@BlueVeins how do I know you're not one of those sneaky brussel sprouts

@BlueVeins I know you're not trying to come off as bad at all so I appreciate it. But from what I hear of ex vegans, they did face a lot of health issues because I can see some over exaggerating but I don't think they're all lying either. From what I know, it takes around 14 to 20 years of straight veganism to start having health issues and even then, some might ignore issues too.

This tells me we're biological omnivores for a reason and that when one diet doesn't work, we can maintain metabolic flexibility and switch.

@BlueVeins I don't.