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Why are there millions of poor people in America?

When you begin to ask that question, you are raising a question about the economic system, about a broader distribution of wealth. When you being to ask that question, you begin to question the capitalistic economy.

We’ve got to begin to ask questions about our whole society.

One day we must come to see the edifice which produces beggars needs restructuring.
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ArishMell · 70-79, M
Looking down that lot, aspects emerge that can never help anyone:

- Abuse, including attacks based on childish slang of people not holding the attacker's views.

- Dogma based on ignorance: an idea that most of those who are out of work, chose their situation. Most did not, and very likely any State benefits only just cover a meagre existence. Also political dogma - some Americans seem to imagine that if a country tries to help its citizens, it must be "Communist"; almost as if the ironically-title House UnAmerican Activities Committee is still operating.

- Competition & Snobbery: The idea that, "I have a decent, well-paid career therefore am a winner worth something; anyone in mundane work is beneath my dignity; anyone unemployed is a worthless scrounger."

- Rug-pulling. If you live in a city based almost entirely on one or two major commercial or State employers and they close, even the highest-paid staff are suddenly redundant. Those people may have more savings than the "shop-floor" staff, or own surplus luxuries they might be able to sell at well below purchase-price (perhaps above if the luxury is a bucolic second-home); but they are all in the same boat, and it is important to realise people tend to live up to their earnings. The difference between the earnings-bands is that higher ones do allow better savings or higher extravagance: we all need food but no-one needs a top-range car, yacht or membership of an exclusive golf-club. It also affects local businesses like shops and taxi firms, as losing a major employer usually results in the whole town languishing. The last paragraph's "worthless scrounger" might have been last month's precision-engineering company middle-manager, government scientist or the High Street grocer the engineer and scientist had bought their food from.

- Lack of opportunity: If there is no work in your area, except perhaps cleaning toilets for a pittance, how can you earn anything? You certainly cannot afford to move to somewhere offering lots of employment. The cost-of-living there is likely higher than back home, and there are few vacancies anyway. Even people who do earn good salaries can find it impossible to buy a home in such places, but rents there are high too, so many are unable to save the deposit on buying their own home - home-ownership being another mark of personal success.

- Party-politics. You will find that in any multi-party nation, but really, sorting out national problems in society at large should be a cross-party matter. Merely calling each names or always blaming the other lot, never really solves anything in the long run. I do NOT advocate one-party systems, NOR rather wooly coalitions; but serious problems must be met with serious cross-floor discussion and agreement on long-term strategies rather than mere point-scoring between elections only four or five years apart. The partisanship will slant the general approach by majority, but the whole matter still needs a lot of constructive consensus.

........

If there is a disproportionately higher rate of poverty within the USA compared to similarly rich nations; then really, only America itself can put that right; but it will need a serious, consensual approach to determine what is going worng and how to put it right.
PalteseMalconFunch · 36-40, T
@ArishMell That’s mostly the long and short of it
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@FreddieUK Thankyou!
ArishMell · 70-79, M
Carazaa · F
Social research about values around the world have discovered differences in American values. As far as I understand the research it seems most countries have concern and empathy about other people in other classes, lower classes, etc, except Americans for some reason. In the research I read Americans are very concerned about their own economy and are less concerned about other people.

I have actually heard many people say, I don't really want to spend money on taxes, or homeless, or the poor. You don't hear that kind of response in most other countries. In most countries parents read fairy tales to promote empathy and teach children values of caring, manners, and sharing. It appears that some Americans teach their children values that other countries don't share. to compete, win, defend yourself, get ahead, etc.

Love has to be taught. Read the little Match girl. It is often read in Scandinavia to teach children about empathy.

Here is a summary of that story.

[b]It is a beautiful story about a little girl who has an abusive father who in the cold of winter has to go out in the snow and sell matches for the family. But it is so cold that the little girl is freezing to death and lights one match after another to feel some warmth. She lights the last match, and she starts to hallucinate, and she sees a Christmas ham and food and closes her eyes and pretends she is inside at a Christmas party. She lights another match, and then another to keep the happy feeling.
But sadly, on Christmas day when the children are out playing with their toys and people are taking a walk they see a dead little girl in the snow, with shoes with holes in them. She passed away lighting all the matches.
[/b]
FreddieUK · 70-79, M
There are countries where the rich/poor divide is far less marked. They are rich countries, too. They often have good natural resources, but they also have a humanitarian view of other people.

I see the usual tropes: 'poor people are responsible for being poor', 'they're all drug addicts', 'I worked hard, I deserve it'.

No-one chooses to be poor. If your parents were poor, you had an abusive childhood, you come from a group who has traditionally been discriminated against or couldn't afford to get out of a ghetto, then you have massive disadvantages without outside help such as a scholarship, a benefactor or...wait for it...a few pennies from a billionaire in taxes.

I have no problem with people telling me that their view is that poor people deserve it and they can get out of it if they choose: I think they are wrong, but that's what they think. But if any of them even suggest that this is a moral, or worse, Christian attitude I will have a major and robust debate with them.
Somewhere along the line people have to take responsibility for their own future. It takes an education or skills to get a good job. There is a ton of demand in skilled trades .. plummers, electicians, welders, etc and a pretty good job market for STEM type college degrees. There are a lot of ways to get tuition support .. National Guard is one, scholarships, apprenticeships in the trades after technical training. I can see America needs to fix its support for jobs training, control of college costs etc . People also have to take advantage of the earlier public education provided to them to even graduate high school first. This includes parents making it a priority for their kids.

Excuses are rampant, but the hard truth is too many want to blame the system when they didn't do a damn thing to prepare themselves orbtheir kids for a good job. Its not too late to fix that for many, instead of sitting back expecting everyone else to take care of them . they need to step up and help themselves.

I said what I said and I stand by it.
@ArishMell I'm in the US and borrowed over 60% of my college costs. It took me 13 yrs to repay it at an accelerated pace .. in part because I took on extra jobs for part of that time. My degree was also in a higher paying field. My employer paid my masters degree earned part-time while working.
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@BrandNewMan Well, congratulations for it!

One of my work colleagues was working for a Degree via the Open University. I don't know if he able to claim the fees via our employers' training-budget, as the Degree he wanted would have been for their benefit as well as his.

The OU is for people unable or not wanting to attend full university courses, and is mainly by correspondence, Internet and occasional tutorials that might be held in a college more local for groups of students.

It used to use late-night tutorial programmes on BBC TV, and these attracted a sizeable side audience of people not actually taking a course. When still living with my parents my mother and I often enjoyed these!

Although my colleague wanted his Degree for professional purposes the OU does also have many students studying purely for pleasure, including as retirement hobbies.
@ArishMell That OU sounds more like our online prograns or even community college system.
The folks in a position to change things are not asking these questions.
And ironically, some of those affected also aren’t asking because they don’t get that they are.
PalteseMalconFunch · 36-40, T
@bijouxbroussard This is a paraphrasing of MLK. He asked these questions 60 years ago.

And the same people on this thread that are attacking these words will quote him when it’s convenient to them. Same with politicians quoting him. It’s disgusting.
@PalteseMalconFunch Indeed they will (do).
There are many means to get an education, including in the trades, to prepare yourself for more gainful employment. Those of us who took advantage of those opportunities live a better life as a result.

Why should we accept "redistribution" of our earnings to help the people who chose to sit on their ass on a couch in their grandma's basement playing video games ??
@JPWhoo That is part of the challenge though .. fast food jobs are not skilled positions and we have too many in our society only qualified for that kind of work. Are fast food only workers in other countries sustaining their lives without public assistance? I doubt that. If you have evidence otherwise please share.
@BrandNewMan I get that it would be an entirely different approach for Americans, but some countries provide an education for their citizens targeting work in specific industries, schooling that doesn’t engulf them in debt.

Those countries are basically investing in them, with two results: their people have the foundation for earning a livable wage that no one can take away.

And the country has less need to import skilled workers from outside their shores.
@bijouxbroussard I would far rather see that kind of education/skills training programs here than what our higher education system has become.
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zonavar68 · 56-60, M
Trump and musk intend to destroy the us middle class creating a very large poor lower class. That's how Trump intends to get manufacturing etc back by forcing labour costs to the bottom of the barrel.
PalteseMalconFunch · 36-40, T
@Reason10 You’re more than welcome to keep yelling on all my posts

But my New Year’s resolution was to stop playing chess with pigeons
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zonavar68 · 56-60, M
Trump is attempting to force the US labour market to mirror China where there is a narrow ruling class and everyone else is lower class, with nothing in the middle. He is trying to forces wages to the bottom so the US can 'compete' with China as tariff's are going to artificially raise prices of imported goods and services and that is a very short-term 'bump'
markinkansas · 61-69, M
[media=https://youtu.be/79KDKWEOJ1s]he says it better than i do
markinkansas · 61-69, M
@Patriot96 Sanders, 77, has, in fact, amassed an estimated $2.5 million fortune from real estate, investments, government pensions—and earnings from three books, including the 2016 hit Our Revolution: A Future to Believe In. “I wrote a best-selling book. If you write a best-selling book, you can be a millionaire, too,” he recently told the New York Times, striking a downright Trumpian note.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/chasewithorn/2019/04/12/how-bernie-sanders-the-socialist-senator-amassed-a-25-million-fortune/
Patriot96 · 56-60, C
@markinkansas you missed the payoff from the dnc when they replaced him on dnc ticket with kilary
markinkansas · 61-69, M
@Patriot96 sorry he is and has been a independent
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PalteseMalconFunch · 36-40, T
@jshm2 They call it the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it.
We create poverty, then punish people for it.
PalteseMalconFunch · 36-40, T
@MarbleMarvel “When I ask why they are poor, they call me a communist”
Reason10 · 70-79, M
@MarbleMarvel DemoNazi governments create poverty. The Great Society DESTROYED the black family unit, and today 75 percent of all black children are born into single family households.

DemoNazi governments RAISE TAXES ON THE MIDDLE CLASS. (the poor do not pay taxes.)

In the end, poverty in America is a CHOICE.

Poor people drop out of high school, quit their jobs, have children out of wedlock. You can't blame a government OR THE TAXPAYER for those CHOICES.
Patriot96 · 56-60, C
Chitcago mayor wants 380 million for deficit. They spent 141 million on illegals for housing and food
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@whowasthatmaskedman Should have let them stay on the other side of our southern border
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@BrandNewMan First point: Many of those people are not "illegals" They are homeless and damaged Americans. Many Veterans of military service the system already failed.
Second Point. No matter where they came from, they are still human beings, desperate enough to leave their country to look for a safe life for themselves and their families.
I try to be a humanitarian. So I will work on forgiving you for your completely self centred lack of compassion. I know where you got the idea it was OK to express opinions like that..😷
oldguy73 · 70-79, M
you can't have rich people unless you have poor people, same both ways
PalteseMalconFunch · 36-40, T
@oldguy73 Very true. Someone has to be exploited.
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The same people in gov't pounding their fists about "distribution of wealth" are some of the biggest thieves.

Wonder where all that money went?
@JPWhoo I'm sure your brain is in there somewhere 🙄

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Simple. Healthcare.
Because falsified misinformation in controlled media says so? That would be the cause of everything negative
@bijouxbroussard my conscience is clear, that having a good day is offensive to anyone is quite telling, not hiding that to appease anyone, that is the result of much work on my own part and not the result of anything else
@pentagrammom It’s not offensive at all; it just doesn’t mean anything. Like I said, I misjudged; I overestimated its sincerity. No problem.
[@bijouxbroussard if social media chat bots had to be identified there would not be an issue, then sincerity would not be in question, as for misjudgements, not fitting stereotypical human behavior gets me misjudged by chat bots always
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
Because there are a thousand or so really rich people in America who like it that way..😷
markinkansas · 61-69, M
money .. excess company's profit . tax cuts for the rich . ect..
Patriot96 · 56-60, C
@markinkansas i have never been offered a job by a poor person
markinkansas · 61-69, M
@Patriot96 I could use help . just labor 10 a hour .. ya live in kansas
now ya been offered a job by a poor person
Cause America takes care of foreigners before taking care of its own citizens
KingofBones1 · 46-50, M
It's not the economic system.It is the oligarchy that controls it
And maybe choose candidates without dementia to stand for election...
nobodyishome · 31-35, F
yes, that's why America is hiring more and more indians every year, so they can be their racist best there also.
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Capitalism out of control.
PalteseMalconFunch · 36-40, T
@NativePortlander1970 Aye. And the wonder are like 70 years old

 
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