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Yeah, so here is the problem with the whole "no collusion/collusion isn't against the law" canard...

[quote]Stepping back, it is telling that those defending the president are resorting to the narrowest of defenses—that even if the president obstructed justice, holding him accountable would be unconstitutional. In what is perhaps a reflection of the strength of the evidence that can now be marshaled against the president, his defenders have shifted the fight in large measure away from the merits of the obstruction case to a series of questionable defenses based upon the possible consequences of even a meritorious case. In many ways, the question has become less about whether there is a case that Donald J. Trump obstructed justice, and more about whether and in what form the rule of law will be followed.[/quote]

https://www.brookings.edu/research/presidential-obstruction-of-justice-the-case-of-donald-j-trump-2nd-edition/
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windinhishair · 61-69, M
It is becoming clearer that Trump has committed multiple crimes. The question is how long with Republicans stand united behind him at the expense of the nation.
WoodyAq · M
@windinhishair I think they might be willing to blow the whole thing up. Unless there is a recession...
redredred · M
what crimes?@windinhishair
WoodyAq · M
@redredred Obstruction of justice. Then there is the accepting illegal campaign contributions, conspiracy, tax evasion, and money laundering. That's just the stuff that is public knowledge.
redredred · M
i havent heard a creditable claim for any if those. if you have specific events and not just democrat talking points, id like to hear them.@WoodyAq
WoodyAq · M
@redredred Okay ... the tax evasion and money laundering suspicions go back decades, and have been raised by journalists and biographers. The case of the Trump Charity currently before the courts is part of that whole thing. There will be more charges to come, based on NYT reporting.

The money laundering of Russian mob money has been around since the 1990s, but now that Trump has lied about his business interests in Russia (he lied, got caught in the lie, and then admitted it and said it was no big deal) it'll be further investigated by law enforcement.

Accepting illegal campaign contributions is a no-brainer: everybody has stipulated (even Trump, sometimes but not others) that Russian intelligence services intervened on Trump's behalf. We know definitely that the Trump campaign knew about these efforts, and didn't notify anyone about them. We know that Don Jr., Manafort and Kushner sought to conspire with the Russian government, and that Russia followed through on its half of the conspiracy (that's sufficient for a conspiracy charge against both parties).

Obstruction is amply detailed in the link with this post above.
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@WoodyAq You lost. Get over it.
WoodyAq · M
@sunsporter1649 I'm not surrendering to the Russians, sorry.

You might want to wave a white flag, but I still believe in the constitution and the nation.
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@WoodyAq Make up your mind. You fully supported the previous administrations attempt to influence the elections in Israel, yet condemn the Russians attempting to influence our elections. And you see no conflict?
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@sunsporter1649 What? No "But Hillary's emails"? That you backed a person who is not only sub par as president, but as a human being on many levels is unfortunate, regrettable, and frankly, thoughtless of you. That you continue to support him with stupid trite statements like that marks you as sub par yourself. If all Americans felt as you do, no one would give a damn about America sinking into the slime Trump is taking you down into.
WoodyAq · M
@sunsporter1649 I don't support any election interference. But what I really don't support are people who refuse to defend their own elections against interference.

Meddling is inevitable. Not defending your country against meddling is a choice made by weak and corrupt people.
windinhishair · 61-69, M
@sunsporter1649 Got it. As long as we have meddled in other's affairs in the past, it is fine and right for it to happen to us. We instigated a coup in 1953 to depose the Prime Minister of Iran. So you would have no problem at all if Iran removed Trump from office, right? After all, we do it--why can't they?
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@windinhishair Iran does not have to, the goddamndemocrats are instigating a coup on their own, with the cooperation of some media and supposed public servants.
windinhishair · 61-69, M
@sunsporter1649 But you support that, because we've removed other leaders of their countries, so ours can be removed too. Nice to know.
WoodyAq · M
@sunsporter1649 There is a difference between a coup and a revolt. It's the number of people involved. A coup involves a small number of insiders, whereas what you're are talking about is a whole lot of outsiders.

Also, insisting the president obey the constitution is not a coup. Although it may still be a revolt ....🤔
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@WoodyAq Having the NY Slimes and the democrat party tell the President who he can hire and fire I am sure is somewhere in the Constitution. Please direct me to the relevant passages.
WoodyAq · M
@sunsporter1649 Pretty sure it's in Article II, Section 3 of the Constitution You know, where it admonishes the President to “take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed.”
lorne13 · 61-69, M
@sunsporter1649 the whole country lost
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@WoodyAq You mean comey faithfully executed the orders of the president? Whoda thunk it!
WoodyAq · M
@sunsporter1649 Yeah, that statement is wrong on so many levels. It actually reveals you to be anti-constitution, whereas I take it as the starting point for any discussion.

So, go back to Moscow.
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@WoodyAq Oh, I get it now, since the President cannot hire and fire whoever he pleases, for whatever reason, the NY Slimes and the democrat party shall determine who is to be in the Presidents cabinet. Thank you for clearing that up.
WoodyAq · M
@sunsporter1649 Sorry, the President can hire and fire anyone one he wants for any reason except the one he chose: corruption.
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@WoodyAq You mean comey is as pure as the wind driven snow! Whouda thunk it!
WoodyAq · M
@sunsporter1649 Doesn't matter what he is or isn't. Doesn't excuse corruption.
sunsporter1649 · 70-79, M
@WoodyAq Ah, then comey deserved to be fired. So happy you agree.
WoodyAq · M
@sunsporter1649 Maybe he did. Just not for the reason Trump fired him. Two wrongs don't make a right