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My foreign history is hazy. In the American civil war who was the goodies and who were the baddies?

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Quimliqer · 70-79, M
It depends on your point of view regarding good and bad. The long and short of it is, confederates were fighting to leave the union And maintain slavery, the union fought to quell the separatist movement and remove slavery. The union won.
RedBaron · M
@Quimliqer The Confederate states actually did secede from the union just before the war.
Richard65 · M
@Quimliqer so regarding the maintaining of slavery as being bad simply depends on your point of view? Seriously?
Bumbles · 51-55, M
@Richard65 Many Republicans now reference the virtues of slavery and view the Confederacy with fondness. They also want to change how history is taught so white children don’t feel guilty.

The flag of the Confederacy is welcome in Republican circles, and Civil War generals are praised as being true American heroes as evinced by their names on streets, schools, and military bases.

Republicans also claim the Civil War had nothing to do with slavery.

So, to MAGA and Republicans “the South” were the good guys.
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MartinII · 70-79, M
@Quimliqer The removal of slavery wasn't a war aim of the union at the beginning of the civil war, but of course it became one.
Quimliqer · 70-79, M
@MartinII You’re right, it was to stop the southern states from seceding.
Bumbles · 51-55, M
@Richard65 Indeed, even when you cite the various Articles of Secession which all reference slavery as the reason each state is seceding!
RedBaron · M
@Quimliqer As I said above, the Confederate states had already seceded. The war was about bringing them back in.
MartinII · 70-79, M
@Quimliqer It's also true that although slavery was indeed abolished as a result of the war, the Yankees connived in and helped to implement racist policies in the former confederate states. It is, of course, impossible to know what would have happened had the confederacy won.
Quimliqer · 70-79, M
@RedBaron They had declared independence, but without accent!!
Bumbles · 51-55, M
@Quimliqer The US didn’t recognize the Confederacy so it’s inaccurate to say they were separate from the rest of the US.
Quimliqer · 70-79, M
@Bumbles As stated, they declared!! It wasn’t a consensual agree!!
Bumbles · 51-55, M
@MartinII The Confederacy would have had to something about de jure slavery because other countries would have stopped taking its cotton. Given how vile the Jim Crow South was, I think if they had won it would have been much different by 1900 than their having lost.
Richard65 · M
@Bumbles I'm from Lancashire, Northern England. We were known as Cottonopolis in the 19th Century, because our damp climate meant the cotton didn't snap. We were the centre of the European cotton industry. During the Civil War, Lincoln requested that Lancashire mills did not purchase cotton from the South. At the time, Lancashire industry relied heavily on those imports. Despite starvation conditions and huge family strife if they did this, Lancashire cotton weavers agreed, and boycotted American cotton. Though most all of them relied on that cotton to put food on the table and feed their children. The city of Manchester has a statue of Lincoln in Lincoln Square in the city centre to commemorate that. The good guys.

Bumbles · 51-55, M
@Richard65 I did not know this! Thank you for the information and to the good people of Lancashire and Manchester!
kodiac · 22-25, M
@Richard65 Democrats started the kkk
RedBaron · M
@kodiac That doesn’t mean the party supports the KKK.
kodiac · 22-25, M
@RedBaron i don't think anyone supports it now but during and for decades after the war the democrats did
RedBaron · M
@kodiac But not nationally. Only Democrats in the south.
SW-User
@kodiac In those days the parties were reversed in their policies. The evil old Democrats became the evil new Republicans.
sree251 · 41-45, M
@Quimliqer
The union won.

It had nothing to do with removal of slavery. It had to do with the subjugating of states and removal of their rights to self determination.
DavidT8899 · 22-25, M
@MartinII And keep in mind that realistically the South and very little chance of winning the war .The logistics were simply too stacked in favor of the North.The only reason that the South lasted as long as it did was that they had several brilliant commanders -most notably Robert E .Lee- where the North started out with some real dunderheads for Generals untill they realized they had to step up their game.Lee was actually wavering between fighting for the South or the North;I have always thought that Lee would have ultimately helped out his countrymen more by fighting for the Union.
RedBaron · M
@DavidT8899 Doesn’t matter now.
DavidT8899 · 22-25, M
@RedBaron Well,yeah,but we are talking about history.......
sree251 · 41-45, M
@Quimliqer
The long and short of it is, confederates were fighting to leave the union And maintain slavery, the union fought to quell the separatist movement and remove slavery. The union won.

This is the narrative taught in American schools. Slavery had nothing to do with the Civil War. The nation was split between the north and the south just as the nation is now split between the right and the left. Back then, the north won and subjugated the south. Now, the right won and the left is in retreat. There is no moral high ground.