Religion & Spirituality

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I have a question…

One of my cousins on my father’s side is Jewish. She converted 45 years ago when she married a Jewish man, and they’ve raised their son and daughter as Jewish, including Bar and Bat Mitzvah. She keeps a kosher home still, even after her husband passed away, and was going to the synagogue regularly (before Covid). She keeps a mezuzah on her door. She recently told me that a kid (twenty-something) told her "well, you’re not [b]really[/b] Jewish, and your kids aren’t really Jewish either. Their mother has to be Jewish, not just their father." My cousin told him, "My children [b]were[/b] born to a Jewish mother." She was very offended. Once you convert, don’t you become part of the community ? 🤔

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BitterSweetPotato · 31-35, F

From what I read before, yes it is really the mother that has to be Jewish. I am sure i read it somewhere, but I honestly don’t know how accurate it is.

Regardless, it is ridiculous what he said to her. If she chose to convert, and has followed their way of life, who the hell is he to tell her that she is otherwise. Not that I think it is brilliant what she did as I am sick of all religions, but it is her choice.

bijouxbroussard · F

@BitterSweetPotato I don’t know if she would’ve if she’d married someone else. But her husband was a real sweetheart, a bit older than she. And his siblings embraced her.

BitterSweetPotato · 31-35, F

@bijouxbroussard I find the concept of converting to partner’s religion a bit weird because I think believing in a religion has to do with one’s self, not with whom we marry. But people do it all the time anyway. I am curious though if in Jewish culture she HAD to convert?! For example, in Islam, a non Muslim man couldn’t marry a Muslim woman unless he converts… It is nice though that she had a happy life with him and his family.. maybe why she converted, because she loved him and his culture.

Harmonium1923 · 51-55, M

Jewish guy here. If you formally convert to Judaism you are 100% part of the community and from a religious perspective you are no different than anyone born into the religion. She is Jewish through that process and her children are Jewish because they were born to a Jewish mother.

bijouxbroussard · F

@Harmonium1923 Thank you, my friend. Liz converted before she married David in 1979. They were living in New Orleans until Katrina, and then the family fled to Atlanta. They were embraced in the new synagogue. David passed away in 2008, but she and their children were an active part of the community and never made to feel unwelcome until this fellow and his family arrived.

Mamapolo2016 · F

As a Baptist, I had to look it up. Tell her to tell that kid to talk to a Rabbi.

It's possible that not all Jewish factions believe the same.

But this one says not only SHE is 'really Jewish,' so are her children.,So THERE.

[quote]If a woman converts to Judaism does that make her future ...

Yes - anybody who accepts the woman as Jewish will automatically accept her children as well. To do otherwise would be to violate the law that says we treat converts as natural-born Jews and are not allowed to remind them of their convert status. 22 level 1 aggie1391 · 4y MO Machmir If she converted Orthodox, everyone will accept her kids as Jews.[/quote]

Northwest · M

Typically, you are Jewish only if you're born to a Jewish mother. At one point, conversion would have been impossible into Orthodox Judaism. Today, there are quite a few branches within Judaism, and conversion is usually possible, and accepted by the less stringent branches, but not the other way around.

For instance, I am an atheist, but one group insisted I was Jewish, because my mother is Jewish.

bijouxbroussard · F

@Northwest As others have said, "ethnically" Jewish, though not religious. I have a [b]lot[/b] of friends who fall into that category. 🙂

Persephone · 51-55, F

Absolutely you do! No Jew should question a convert's Jewish status.

DragonFruit · 61-69, M

“OJ Simpson is not a Jew.....but guess who is, Hall of Famer Rod Carew (he converted)”

-Adam Sandler, “The Chanukah Song”

People like Rod Carew, your cousin and my cousin, who converted to Judaism are Jews.
My cousin converted because she wanted to be a part of her husband’s family heritage and raise his children as Jewish. Her father sang opera, and at her son’s Bar Mitzvah/daughter’s Bat Mitzvah she sang the songs better than the Cantor.
Everyone among my family/friends knows that she’s Jewish, and she studied hard to learn the Jewish customs and Hebrew.
The young man probably assumed (and you know what that does) that because she didn’t “look” Jewish, she wasn’t Jewish (my cousin has it a bit easier in that regard, because she’s of Italian descent and does kind of “look” Jewish).
If she converted, that means that the Jewish community leaders in her area have accepted her as Jewish....this kid doesn’t have the right to tell her otherwise.

Babylon

Remember that being an ethnic Jew differs to a religious Jew. You can convert religiously and follow Judaism and be a religious Jew but as an ethnoreligious identity, the ethnic part comes in, which undoubtedly incorporates Jewish culture which entails the progeny of the Jewish people. Meaning, you can assimilate but you would never be considered a full Jew if you were not born amongst them because your genetic features and blood are foreign to the ethnicity and you inherit different genetic features by default, typically

bijouxbroussard · F

@Babylon But havent there always been Jews of different ethnicities ? Sephardic, even Falashas, who go back thousands of years. A friend once told me "they’re the kids of Sol & Sheba". It’s one of the things I was sorry to hear about [b]Israel[/b]. When writer Alice Walker visited, she reported that it reminded her of the segregated American South of her childhood. She said that they only seemed to consider Caucasian Jewish people "real Jews", even if others came from traditionally Jewish communities.

Babylon

@bijouxbroussard yes. There have always been multiple clans and different heritage trees but you gotta descend from it right? I can move to China with my black kiester but I wouldn't have inherited the features the Chinese are known for just by moving there. That's a factor at play within culture. The people may have features

And Israel is a terrible, apartheid state that gets by with everything because it leeches off the U.S. taxpayers (by choice of the government). I wouldn't use it as a yardstick for Jewish heritage and culture because its decisions are politically motivated, hence why you probably heard those bad things. Real Jews don't support the evils od Israel. The Zionists are deporting black Jews there from the "Jewish Homeland."

If your heritage is Jewish, then you're a Jew. You may not have been born with the blood and genetic features in the gene pool shared by the Jewish bloodline but any of the Jewish progeny do have that. Judaism is arguably an ethnoreligion so there is the culture/ethnicity and then the religious aspect. That's all there is to it

bookerdana · M

My understanding is that they don't seek converts but accept them,like Sammy Davis,Jr

fernie2

Twenty something means his frontal lobe hasn't fully formed yet. She is NOW Jewish!

DunningKruger · 61-69, M

Some Jewish groups follow matrilineal descent, notably the Orthodox and Conservative branches. That said, as far as I know, every branch accepts converts as Jewish, so even the matrilineals would recognize her children as Jewish because she was Jewish, albeit a convert.

All this religious stuff is ridiculously complex.

LunadelobosIAMTHEDRAGON · F

Yes you do, absolutely.

There are only two ways a person is Jewish.
1- Born to a Jewish mother.
2- A Kosher Conversion.

And that is all there is to it.

bijouxbroussard · F

@LunadelobosIAMTHEDRAGON Thank you, my friend. 🤗

LunadelobosIAMTHEDRAGON · F

@bijouxbroussard 🤗🤗🤗❤️

HakunaMatata · 51-55, M

The fact that there is a discussion on this is giving importance to something/somebody that is irrelevant. Ask your cousin to ignore and move on...

bijouxbroussard · F

@HakunaMatata Well, she felt bad and I wondered. So I asked. 🤷🏽‍♀️

SubstantialKick · 31-35, M

I'm not Jewish, but I would assume so. I guess the keyword here is "kid". He may have a bit to learn.

ninjavu · 51-55, M

Bizarre. Even within groups there are people that want to look for and sow new divisions! 🙄

Nebula · 41-45, F

Yes, that's what I thought.

Human1000 · M

We natives have a prejudice towards those who convert.

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Mamapolo2016 · F

@bijouxbroussard What prompted him to say such a thing?

Mamapolo2016 · F

@bijouxbroussard Makes me think of Ruth. "Whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God: Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the Lord do so to me, and more also, if aught but death part thee and me."

Then some snotnose kid says, "You're not REALLY Jewish."

bijouxbroussard · F

@Mamapolo2016 Her presence in the synagogue, apparently. She didn’t know him from Adam. He’s new. She’s been attending services there since 2006 and everyone has been nice to her. Both her son and daughter are now married to members there.

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bijouxbroussard · F

@SW-User What ?

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