A life was taken for this. And taken cruelly. How does that make you feel?
Just a question.
How does it make you feel to think about another life being painfully snuffed out so that you can enjoy the flavor of its flesh?
It makes me feel bad.
Just a question.
How does it make you feel to think about another life being painfully snuffed out so that you can enjoy the flavor of its flesh?
It makes me feel bad.
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Well, it was raised, fed, and treated better than most humans. It had no idea that it’s death was coming and was less pain when it happened than a person dying of cancer. In all honesty, their life was lived and treated more humanely and respectfully than a human.
It isn’t a glamorous industry by any means, but it also isn’t the heartless, cruelty that many make it out to be.
It isn’t a glamorous industry by any means, but it also isn’t the heartless, cruelty that many make it out to be.
@Pinkstarburst
[quote]
Pinkstarburst
Well, it was raised, fed, and treated better than most humans[/quote]
Umm...probably not. The vast majority of meat production today is out of factory farms and those animals are not well treated nor living happy animal lives.
[quote]It had no idea that it’s death was coming and was less pain when it happened than a person dying of cancer[/quote]
Did it existentially know death was coming? No. Was it panicked and scared leading up to its death? Yes, very probably.
As for dying in pain....it's pretty horrifying to see a cow get a bolt to the head and then keep staggering around while they try to shoot it again and again.
Don't kid yourself.
Most of our meat is not from animals living in a pasture and peacefully and humanely being culled when their time comes.
I know there are a lot of people suffering out there but i think your characterization that these food animals live better lives than most humans is...not well considered.
[quote]
Pinkstarburst
Well, it was raised, fed, and treated better than most humans[/quote]
Umm...probably not. The vast majority of meat production today is out of factory farms and those animals are not well treated nor living happy animal lives.
[quote]It had no idea that it’s death was coming and was less pain when it happened than a person dying of cancer[/quote]
Did it existentially know death was coming? No. Was it panicked and scared leading up to its death? Yes, very probably.
As for dying in pain....it's pretty horrifying to see a cow get a bolt to the head and then keep staggering around while they try to shoot it again and again.
Don't kid yourself.
Most of our meat is not from animals living in a pasture and peacefully and humanely being culled when their time comes.
I know there are a lot of people suffering out there but i think your characterization that these food animals live better lives than most humans is...not well considered.
@Pikachu I suppose you have a point. The fact that I know people who raise beef, who work factory farms, and have seen the farm to table process first hand makes me ill-informed. And I stand by my statement that food animals are cared for more humanely and live better lives than most humans.
@Pinkstarburst
I don't deny your experience. It's just that it's a very narrow view of the larger picture.
I'm glad you know people who treated animals well but that doesn't mean that, that is the general condition.
I too know people who have worked in the industry. They don't tend to last long. I think the guy who lasted longest spent 6 months in a slaghterhouse before he just had to get out.
[quote]And I stand by my statement that food animals are cared for more humanely and live better lives than most humans.
[/quote]
Honestly, that's an absurd statement.
Some humans? Sure. Many humans, even? Yeah.
MOST humans? lol no. Come on.
Even on small scale farms i've seen the way some of these animals live, much less the millions of animals living on concrete, up to their knees in mud and excrement or packed into cages barely big enough for their bodies or kept in lightless mega barns and pumped so full of hormones that their bones break because they're growing too fast. Beaks cut off so they don't peck, tails cut off so they don't get bitten off in a fight, horns torn out and burned so they don't damage other animals jammed in around them.
No. This not better than "most humans" are treated.
If you want to pretend that actually these animals are treated pretty well then that's your business but it's not reality.
I don't deny your experience. It's just that it's a very narrow view of the larger picture.
I'm glad you know people who treated animals well but that doesn't mean that, that is the general condition.
I too know people who have worked in the industry. They don't tend to last long. I think the guy who lasted longest spent 6 months in a slaghterhouse before he just had to get out.
[quote]And I stand by my statement that food animals are cared for more humanely and live better lives than most humans.
[/quote]
Honestly, that's an absurd statement.
Some humans? Sure. Many humans, even? Yeah.
MOST humans? lol no. Come on.
Even on small scale farms i've seen the way some of these animals live, much less the millions of animals living on concrete, up to their knees in mud and excrement or packed into cages barely big enough for their bodies or kept in lightless mega barns and pumped so full of hormones that their bones break because they're growing too fast. Beaks cut off so they don't peck, tails cut off so they don't get bitten off in a fight, horns torn out and burned so they don't damage other animals jammed in around them.
No. This not better than "most humans" are treated.
If you want to pretend that actually these animals are treated pretty well then that's your business but it's not reality.
@Pinkstarburst
Well i guess i was interested in people's feelings about taking a life so that you can enjoy a pleasant sensation and not so much in what is (in my opinion) a denial of reality.
I know things can get heated when we disagree but i hope i wasn't too disrespectful and i apologize if i was.
But i wonder if you could answer the above question for me.
Arguments about whether animal are treated well or treated better than most humans aside, how would you answer that question?
Well i guess i was interested in people's feelings about taking a life so that you can enjoy a pleasant sensation and not so much in what is (in my opinion) a denial of reality.
I know things can get heated when we disagree but i hope i wasn't too disrespectful and i apologize if i was.
But i wonder if you could answer the above question for me.
Arguments about whether animal are treated well or treated better than most humans aside, how would you answer that question?
@Pikachu A life was taken to provide for my sustenance. Since I know where it comes from, I know guidelines are followed to provide the most humane life (and death) for the animal. I am an omnivore by genetic and biological design. It’s a fact that there are nutrients that my body needs that can only be found in animals.
In honesty, I feel thankful for the process of the circle of life and for the men and women who bear the hate of others for putting food on my table…all the food.
And I feel no disrespect. You and I have always had the best heated discussions 😉
In honesty, I feel thankful for the process of the circle of life and for the men and women who bear the hate of others for putting food on my table…all the food.
And I feel no disrespect. You and I have always had the best heated discussions 😉
@Pikachu As a side note Pik, if you haven’t already, I would encourage you to check out Temple Grandin. She has done amazing things in the farm-animal welfare industry regarding beef. She’s a very interesting woman.
@Pinkstarburst
[quote] It’s a fact that there are nutrients that my body needs that can only be found in animals.[/quote]
Then how are vegetarians surviving?
[quote]I am an omnivore by genetic and biological design[/quote]
But that doesn't make it morally good, right? That it is natural for you to eat meat doesn't make it good to eat meat, yes?
[quote]I feel thankful for the process of the circle of life and for the men and women who bear the hate of others for putting food on my table[/quote]
Me too.
I feel thankful for many privileges that i enjoy even though they come at the expense of the suffering of other people and creatures.
But at the same time i don't feel guiltless about taking advantage of that suffering,
Glad i didn't insult you✌️ We need more people like you who can disagree without becoming hateful
[quote] It’s a fact that there are nutrients that my body needs that can only be found in animals.[/quote]
Then how are vegetarians surviving?
[quote]I am an omnivore by genetic and biological design[/quote]
But that doesn't make it morally good, right? That it is natural for you to eat meat doesn't make it good to eat meat, yes?
[quote]I feel thankful for the process of the circle of life and for the men and women who bear the hate of others for putting food on my table[/quote]
Me too.
I feel thankful for many privileges that i enjoy even though they come at the expense of the suffering of other people and creatures.
But at the same time i don't feel guiltless about taking advantage of that suffering,
Glad i didn't insult you✌️ We need more people like you who can disagree without becoming hateful
@Pinkstarburst
Yes i have heard of her. Very interesting how an autistic person can sort of identify with how animals like cows will react to things.
I like that she's made the gangplank less terrifying but i'm still not thrilled that it's there lol
Yes i have heard of her. Very interesting how an autistic person can sort of identify with how animals like cows will react to things.
I like that she's made the gangplank less terrifying but i'm still not thrilled that it's there lol
@Pikachu I tried to be a vegetarian and made it about nine months. My body just could not adjust. I also learned in that time that I was highly allergic to soy which made it difficult to get enough protein in my system.
Morally speaking, I’m a meat eater and accept that death has to happen for me to have it. I grew up among hunters and am married to one. I learned the importance of land management of preventing overpopulation and disease. I know that’s different from the large production industries, but that’s why I try to know where my meat is coming from. I want to make sure there is a humaneness to the process.
I was able to hear Ms. Grandin speak and attend a dinner for her a couple years ago. A highlight of my life. She is highly respected in the industry.
Morally speaking, I’m a meat eater and accept that death has to happen for me to have it. I grew up among hunters and am married to one. I learned the importance of land management of preventing overpopulation and disease. I know that’s different from the large production industries, but that’s why I try to know where my meat is coming from. I want to make sure there is a humaneness to the process.
I was able to hear Ms. Grandin speak and attend a dinner for her a couple years ago. A highlight of my life. She is highly respected in the industry.
@Pinkstarburst
And to be clear, i don't have anything against people who can't abstain from meat be that for health or economic reasons.
I just think it's important for people to think about their choice their making (when it is a choice) and the reality of what that choice means to another life.
And to be clear, i don't have anything against people who can't abstain from meat be that for health or economic reasons.
I just think it's important for people to think about their choice their making (when it is a choice) and the reality of what that choice means to another life.