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To vax or not to vax - that is the Cult-of-Vid question!

We're Covid-vax decliners but each of us has different reasons.

We get *very* cold receptions from a bunch of our shared friends who are so pro-vax that it's offensive.

But most people are warmed to the idea of a person being able to legally make their own decision about whether or not to accept being vaxed for Covid and the 'you are the enemy' view is pretty much gone away.
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@Northerner says [quote] Evidence is already being produced that the anti vaxers were the wise ones amongst us. Time will tell![/quote]

Here's what the evidence from 2021 says. It says the vaccines saved over 1 million American lives in 2021.

In 2021, the 75% of Americans fully vaccinated produced under 20% of the Covid deaths, while the 25% unvaccinated Americans produced over 80% of the Covid deaths.

In 2021, the 75% of Americans fully vaccinated produced under 31% of Covid cases; while the 25% unvaccinated Americans produced nearly 70% of Covid cases.

This means the US unvaccinated had a 5X higher chance of contracting Covid compared to the vaccinated per capita, and that overall the unvaccinated had about a 15X higher probability of Covid death per capita.

Note: since 'Long Covid' occurs in 15% to 25% of Covid cases, that means there is also a 5X higher prevalence of Long Covid per capita among the unvaccinated.

Sources and details at https://similarworlds.com/disease-illness/vaccines/4268857-Covid-Vaccine-effectiveness-data-from-the-US-2021

[sep][sep][sep]

Here's the math behind the ONE MILLION SAVED number.

US Unvaxxed population = 83 million; vaxxed = 249 million. CDC estimate for US Covid deaths in 2021 is 460,000, so 368,000 deaths among the unvaxxed and 92,000 among the vaxxed - your basic pandemic of the unvaccinated.

That works out to a 0.44% death rate among unvaxxed, and a 0.037% death rate among the vaccinated. Please, get out your calculator and check my work!

If the death rate among vaxxed were equal to the death rate among the unvaxxed, that would have resulted in 1.1 million deaths instead of 92 thousand in 2021. Thus the vaccines have ALREADY saved OVER ONE MILLION lives in 2021 alone. That's a YUGE vaccine benefit!!!

And that's just deaths. In 2021, the vaccinated also benefit from a 5X lower infection rate, at least a 5X lower hospitalization rate, and a 5X lower 'long Covid' rate.
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues Your sources are so suspect your post became a joke. You lost this round and you continuing to defend the indefensible is simply making you look all the more foolish. The vaxes don't work and are causing more deaths than covid ever did. Move on.
@hippyjoe1955 Are you the same guy who claimed

Didn't you say
but were unable to provide any links to the alleged studies???

It's kinda funny for YOU to be talking about "suspect sources," [b]LOL!!![/b]
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues I guess you haven't been keeping up with the news. Sucks to be you. Everything I have said is now being shown to be true. Everything you post has been shown to be a lie.
@hippyjoe1955 If that's true you should have no trouble
substantiating this

and substantiating this

Go ahead, post your evidence.

Oh, wait, you don't have any evidence! Instead all you'll do is throw insults and otherwise try to distract from your demonstrably false claims, [b]LOL!!![/b]
CBarson · 51-55
@hippyjoe1955 what ever happened to the microchips in the syringe?
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@CBarson you tell me you are much more informed than me. I never mentioned them but you did
CBarson · 51-55
@hippyjoe1955 with heavy sarcasm
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues dailysceptic.org/2023/01/13/japans-experts-baffled-by-high-covid-deaths-from-heart-problems-despite-high-vaccination-rate/

https://petersweden.substack.com/p/australia-pandemic
@hippyjoe1955 What you forgot to mention is that Japan STILL has very few pandemic deaths - Japan is STILL very close to baseline. It's right in this figure that DailySkeptic forgot to suppress.


Japan isn't seeing anything CLOSE to the 20% rise in deaths the US & UK saw. And why such a small rise in deaths?? VACCINE SUCCESS!!!!
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues So you fail to realize that those who are dying are fully vaxed. If the vax worked.... Try to use your head for more than an ear spacer for once in your life.
@hippyjoe1955 The vaccine SAVED OVER ONE MILLION AMERICAN LIVES in 2021. The numbers prove this. Try to use your head for more than an ear spacer for once in your life.

P.S. it's good you finally caught on to the value of supplying links. I take FULL CREDIT for this improvement in your skills!!!
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues Nice fake numbers. There were no lives saved by the vax. NONE ZERO ZILCH NADA. The vax is NOT what you wish it was. It is a complete failure and already has killed more people than you claim it has saved. BTW your numbers are a joke. You can not prove lives saved any more than you can prove lessened symptoms.
@hippyjoe1955 All you have is denial. SAD!! Dude, your sources are depending on the official information. You accept the official information when it appears to support your chosen narrative, but you reject the official information when it goes counter to your chosen narrative. Sorry dude, can't have it both ways!!!

What your sources are doing is IGNORING the first two years of the pandemic - the years when distancing and masking and vaccines saved so many lives. Let's look at accumulated deaths per million:

[u]Deaths per 1 million population so far[/u]
Japan 501
Australia 679
Canada 1299
USA 3362
source: [b]https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/[/b]
See that? USA has 6X as many Covid deaths as Japan, 5X as many as Australia. More anti-vaxxers == more Covid deaths. The truth is inescapable!!!
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues So tell me why are all the experts going from pro vax to anti vax and none of the experts going from anti vax to pro vax?
@hippyjoe1955 Actually, "all" the experts are not saying that.

A few are because NOW, three years into the pandemic, Covid has evolved to avoid the vaccines. The reason you and your sources try so hard to ignore 2021 is because THAT is when the vaccines saved so many lives.

2021 was the pandemic of the unvaccinated. That's why the highly vaccinated countries have so few accumulated deaths.

[u]Deaths per 1 million population so far[/u]
Japan 501
Australia 679
Canada 1299
USA 3362
[b]source: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/[/b]
See that? USA has 6X as many Covid deaths as Japan, 5X as many as Australia. More anti-vaxxers == more Covid deaths. The truth is inescapable!!!
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues Name one anti vax expert who became pro vax.
@hippyjoe1955
Arkansas mom Angela Morris shares regret; 13 year old on ventilator

Hollie Rivers regrets

Missouri man, 26 after battle in hospital
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues I didn't ask for a sob story. I asked for an expert who was anti vax and is now pro vax. BTW the sob story is nonsense since it can not be shown that the vax would have prevented anything.
@hippyjoe1955 "I have an immune system"

"99 probs vax ain't 1"

"Officer Jack Nyce was a 17-year veteran of the force, the police department said in a statement on its Facebook page announcing his death. Sadly, he refused to be vaxxed and died of Covid."
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues And my brother in law was killed by the vax according to his doctor. My neighbor was killed by the vax according to his doctor. My fellow churchman died from the vax according to his doctor. My son has myocarditis from the vax according to his doctor. Do we want to spend all night exchanging sob stories? Name an expert who went from anti vax to pro vax.
@hippyjoe1955 Talk is cheap.
Show us the death certificates on these people.

Pardon me for not trusting the guy who said
but just can't show us these alleged studies, LOL!!!
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues So you can't name one expert who went from anti vax to pro vax? Why not?
@hippyjoe1955 I named three
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@ElwoodBlues BS. They were always pro vax.
@hippyjoe1955 Read it again, dude

Missouri man, 26 after battle in hospital

"Get it if you can"

Pandemic denier Ted Nugent: "I thought I was dying"
[media=https://youtu.be/tTEP09d8Lqg]