Gaza is at a point of no return

@Straylight it isn't meant as a gotcha moment. It is reality though. Please look up what genocide really is before throwing around that word.

@Straylight Under 50% meaning they had to align with the party that had the other half of the votes (Fatah) as a coalition. Hamas didn't do that, they took over by force.
This wasn't inevitable because Bush was warned about this happening several times before pushing an election. Yes, Bush helped hamas come into power.

It's still disingenuous to use Hamas as a reason when Israel has been illegally occupying land and attacking Gaza since 1947. Hamas was not in power then. Hamas didn't even exist then.
It's all smoke and mirrors and lacks deliberate nuance because people are way too comfortable dehumanising people like Palestinians.
Would anyone ever be comfortable justifying the US being attacked to the point of no return, simply because they voted trump in?
What about Bush? Considering his lies about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq? He killed thousands and commited war crimes alongside Blair. Surely there was more than enough reason to retaliate there?? Or do we only discern between a population and it's government when it benefits us?

These are real lives people are talking about. Dumbing it down to "they're all terrorists who support terrorists" is so lazy and intellectually flawed. Even actual terrorist organisations fight amongst each other, the Taliban and Isis for example? Turns out they're not besties. It's not merely a bunch of cave men with fundamentalist idealogy. It's carefully structured people who know how to exploit power in a place where instability seeks stability.

@HijabaDabbaDoo I give up, you are unable to compromise your view that Israel should not exist! Start by saying that Israel has a legal, moral and ethical right to exist. Then you can stare the other hand that Israel has done. I never said Israel was faultless, but i also never said that Gazans don't have the right to exist. bIG Difference.

@samueltyler2 I'm not answering that because every conversation starts with either condemning hamas or asking if Israel has a right to exist. Both questions are premising an argument I haven't brought up or argued against. A tactic used every time Palestine is brought up. I'm talking about genocide. A word you refuse to use.

@samueltyler2 Humanitarian groups are arguing that it is genocide.
But wether or not it fits into exact 1948 UN conventions definition is immaterial to the reality of it being an international and calculated attempt to destroy a population of human beings.

@samueltyler2 Two million people are being murdered for crimes 1% of the population committed, and committed under the most dire and desperate circumstances in the first place. Most of the people who have died and will die are children.

Why on -earth- are you concerned with "does Israel have a right to exist" that's not being argued here. It's a bizarre redirection that implies if someone says "no" they have lost their right to life. I don't think Canada has a right to exist, and I'm Canadian. Is my life forfeit? Are you going to shoot me?

@samueltyler2 it is a Genocide:
https://www.lemkininstitute.com/statements-new-page/four-facts-about-israel%E2%80%99s-genocide

This is the opinion of Genocide Scholars, Historians and Sociologists.
I don't care what Israeli propaganda says.
I don't care what the hasbara says.

@CountScrofula you have been brainwashed. The terrorist have won the PR battle. Look at any war. What about Russia now, and wars in Africa. War is hell and "innocent citizens" suffer. Look at the devastation of Europe during the world wars!

You cannot discuss the middle east without discussing the legality of the existence of the state of Israel!

@samueltyler2
I think you have.
Because if you think every scholar, research body, NGO and other nation is lying and Israel is the sole source of truth, you're being brainwashed.

@samueltyler2 It's settled news. Israel exists. Whether or not it has a "right" is a nonsense argument. It does exist.

I am baffled and concerned that you and so many others just don't seem to place any value on human life and instead need to focus on abstract points of principle.

@CountScrofula You are so totally off base with your comment. I have never condoned the loss of life. I simply said that death is part of war. I am NOT focusing on abstract points or principle, i am bringing every one back to the root cause of the conflict. The war must end, period.

@samueltyler2 Nothing in this conversation has indicated you care about human life. Going "tsk well that's war" when a million children are being starved to death is insane. Our governments are directly funding this.

Calling this a war is like calling Oct 7th a battle.

@samueltyler2 you somd like the Turks who deny the Armenian Genocide:

"It wasn't Genocide, it was a war"

Not a war when most of the people dying are civilians who are predominantly women, children, the sick, and the elderly.

@basilfawlty89 did you really read what I wrote? Maybe my history is wrong, but did the Armenians attack the Turks?

@basilfawlty89 no, of course not, but that is twisted history, like Russia claiming Ukraine threatened it. Ti be genocide, it must be an attempt to eliminate an entire religion, ethnic, etc. I am not, nor have I ever claimed to be an expert, this post is not about that, it is about our opinions, and those should be based on what has been happening. AGAIN, THE POINT IS THAT THE WAR MUST STOP, as is the case in Ukraine and in other hotspots.