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You think you have Free Will in a universe where God is real? No. You're a rat in a maze.

You can go left, you can go right but the end is the same and you have no choice.

MichaelDemiboy · 51-55, M
For anyone who finds the notion to be sacrilegious:

"For when they had not yet been born and had not practiced anything good or bad, so that God’s purpose respecting the choosing might continue dependent, not on works, but on the One who calls, it was said to her: 'The older will be the slave of the younger.' Just as it is written: 'I loved Jacob, but Eʹsau I hated.' What are we to say, then? Is there injustice with God? Certainly not! For he says to Moses: 'I will show mercy to whomever I will show mercy, and I will show compassion to whomever I will show compassion.' So, then, it depends, not on a person’s desire or on his effort, but on God, who has mercy. For the scripture says to Pharʹaoh: 'For this very reason I have let you remain: to show my power in connection with you and to have my name declared in all the earth.' So, then, he has mercy on whomever he wishes, but he lets whomever he wishes become obstinate. You will therefore say to me: 'Why does he still find fault? For who has withstood his will?' But who are you, O man, to be answering back to God? Does the thing molded say to its molder: 'Why did you make me this way?' What? Does not the potter have authority over the clay to make from the same lump one vessel for an honorable use, another for a dishonorable use? What, then, if God had the will to demonstrate his wrath and to make his power known, and he tolerated with much patience vessels of wrath made fit for destruction? And if this was done to make known the riches of his glory on vessels of mercy, which he prepared beforehand for glory, namely, us, whom he called not only from among Jews but also from among nations, what of it?"
-- Romans 9:11-24

The Bible clearly states that God had predetermined what we will do before we were even born and yet he still finds fault in us for it. That is literally exactly what the "good" book says.
LordShadowfire · 100+, M
@MichaelDemiboy inb4 "bUt ThAt WaS jUsT a MeTaPhOr!"
@MichaelDemiboy Saul-cum-Paul previously prided himself on keeping the law, but it seems he might really have been struggling with how to deal with the crazy view of "God" in the book of Job, where we see a Zeus, a pagan deity, a god based upon a man, not God and not worthy of worship.

The Roman church rejected Augustine's "predestined to hell" line of thought. I think that's right.
Carazaa · F
No the dice is not cast. you might change God's mind by repenting, humbling yourself, and following Jesus. He might save you.
If he saves you, then he will answer all your prayers, guaranteed, because then you will be his child, and be part of the family of God, and your future will be bright.
LordShadowfire · 100+, M
@Carazaa So then he chooses to fuck people over.
Carazaa · F
@LordShadowfire He wants the best for us!
LordShadowfire · 100+, M
@Carazaa
He wants the best for us!
I think you have not considered all possibilities.
ViciDraco · 36-40, M
An all knowing creator god and free will are mutually exclusive. An all knowing God requires determinism.


A God who knows what we'll do before we are made cannot morally cast judgement because we acted in the way we were made to act. A God that doesn't know what we'll do once we are made is not all knowing.
basilfawlty89 · 31-35, M
...
🎼 DESPITE ALL MY RAGE, I'M STILL JUST A RAT IN A CAGEEEEEE
LordShadowfire · 100+, M
Oh, this is going to be good.
Renaci · 36-40
The bible seems to be written in a way that makes God the master of all and thus no free will but still blames us anyway because fuck us or something.

 
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