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I Want Your Opinion

My nephew is 14, and he is away at a residential program where he also attends school. Similar to a military academy, but not military.

In his last letter, he mentioned that in this program there is no positive attention or reward for good behavior, because good behavior is the accepted norm. Rather the only attention the boys receive is negative, when they make a mistake. For example, he just elected to run a 10 mile challenge and completed it, with a good time. At the finish line he was given his time, but no other input. He knew he was successful because he received no attention that morning!😵

Well I certainly love the idea of a land where good is the only accepted norm! I can't wait to visit! Geez.

I have spent my life working with children, and now dogs. I am constantly using positive reinforcement, and I'm programmed to ignore as much negative behavior as I can,
in the interest of not rewarding it.
This new concept is blowing my mind.

The nephew is doing great, his attitude is upbeat. What do you think of only acknowledging the negative? Does that even work?
acpguy · C
Yes and very well as I can attest to that. I went to a very rigid private school that required an entrance exam tougher than colleges gave at the time and the average IQ for all the students was 132. They had a policy if your grades slipped below an A (3.5 GPA) then you would not be asked back the following semester. Their PE class which was every other day for all four years was like military training for that time and you were expected to be on one type of sports team for the school. We were typically #1 in the state for football, basketball, baseball and swimming. If we were #2 then we would consider it not winning as it should be.

Today the candy ass liberal schools give awards for failure which only encourages kids turning out to be snowflakes like we see a lot of today along with children that are grossly overweight due to poor or non-existent phys ed in schools today.
acpguy · C
@b22065 Thanks
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@acpguy I totally agree. He has no game system, no internet, no hair😁. A uniform,only the books we send him to read, only gets mail from his Mom and myself. They denied him the ability to go to classes with the rest of the kids for his first six weeks until he proved he could manage himself . At that point, he was dying to go to school for the first time in his life! He just finished the first half of 8th grade in less than 3 months. He gets up every morning and apparently runs 3 miles before breakfast. He is reporting he has never been happier! I can't believe it. Maybe this is the right track
Wol62 · 51-55, M
@EmilyEdith Wow, sure sounds like it huh?
grayhalo · 41-45, M
It's a method. While it can work, to me that breeds resentment. If they don't give any kind of positive reinforcement, I hope that at least the students are allowed to encourage each other.
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@Wol62 well he's got a year, currently on month 4.
😑
I knew he had it in him. I just hope we can get him transitioned back into the real world I'm sure it will be a shock!
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@grayhalo yes. I think his mom saved his life sending him there.
Wol62 · 51-55, M
@EmilyEdith His mom sounds like quite a woman!
b22065 · 46-50, M
I object to the idea that "Even though you are lower than average, your still a superstar". The world is a tough and nasty place.

When I failed the Presidential Fitness test in school, it made me try harder. I someone had said, "it's okay, you're still a good person, and it's only a silly test" I might have quit trying.
@b22065 That does makes sense. But some people fail at one thing and are so demoralized they don’t attempt anything else. I don’t necessarily support “participation” medals, nor being ground into the dust for failing. Perhaps a happy medium. 🙂
SW-User
I think most studies have shown positive reinforcement to be more effective to change behaviors.
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@SW-User yep and I don't think that's really changed in like 30 years. You reinforce the behavior you want to see.
acpguy · C
@SW-User Those studies were produced by liberals trying to justify there own existence and to get a pay check for not doing much that is reality.
acpguy · C
@SW-User The "reinforcement" they get is doing a good job and winning this is far better than being a loser or less than first and being rewarded as our liberals do today.
That is just wrong. There should be praise for doing well and encouragement to keep trying. Guidance is the thing, not being hard.
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@NightTimeWolf I hear you, but he had plenty of guidance. There were many paths cleared for him by the his family, the school district, the law... which would have been much easier and lower impact.but he defied all of it.

No one wanted to send him away, but he would have ended up in jail until he was 18 any other way UGH
Hard choice. And not right for many probably.
Quetzalcoatlus · 46-50, M
Teens tend to exaggerate so I wouldn’t be so quick to react.
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@Quetzalcoatlus aAgree with you. They read all his mail before it is sent though, they allowed him to portray the program like this. He was not complaining! It seems to make perfect sense to him🤔
firefall · 61-69, M
I think it's an excellent way of breeding soulless & selfish people, who are very good at sticking to the letter of the law.

I'm glad it's working for him, and I can see for a certain class of children it would work well, but as a general rule it would be terribly damaging.
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@firefall That's why it's freaking me out😳
There is a lot of other work going on too, there is group counseling, private counseling drug but the alcohol treatment,etc. He issues aren't being ignored. I guess it is sort of reality-based, when was the last time somebody told you good job just because you clocked in And out, or paid your bills..🤔
firefall · 61-69, M
@EmilyEdith Im glad there's a lot more going on there, that's very reassuring.

As for reality based .. idk, it seems very binary approach to me, there's only good or bad. Noone would tell me good job just for getting to work on time and staying all day .. but I'd expect plaudits for staying late to attend to a problem.
FORMERLYbatovn · 61-69, M
I would think it would not be for everyone....but it certainly would be very effective with some people. Those who lack self esteem or self worth would struggle(at least for a while) with it. I certainly agree that good behavior should be the expected norm...
acpguy · C
@FORMERLYbatovn Self esteem is what you give to yourself for doing good deeds / work. No one else can substitute rewards for that, you give losers rewards like liberals want to do today and you end up with losers.
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@acpguy that appears to be this schools Theory. My nephew took a lot of pride in his time oh, he had a number in his head and he beat it. He did not need to win or hear what a good job he did or stand around and listen to anyone else's time. He met his personal goal, and took a lot of pride in it. So maybe for some kids less is more!
Wol62 · 51-55, M
They want to toughen him up right? I am not sure if it works, but it must get results or else the school would have shut down a long time ago. Is he enjoying it though?
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@Wol62 ironically, he says he has never been happier!
I'm really proud of him, but I wonder how this will translate in the real world.
Wol62 · 51-55, M
@EmilyEdith Yeah, that is so true, as school is a bit of a bubble!
Wol62 · 51-55, M
@EmilyEdith Well, one guy I knew who went to a school like this, knocked out a kid who was picking on weaker kids, with one punch! When that kid went down, he put him in the recovery position, checked his breathing, vital signs etc and called an ambulance. The medical staff were impressed and said he was a true gent for that.
DunningKruger · 61-69, M
Punitive puritanism.
Seems like the reverse of, “If you can’t say anything positive, don’t say anything.” Hearing nothing but complaints would be demoralizing until one learned how to fly under the radar. That’s not so much being good, it’s avoiding trouble.
EmilyEdith · 56-60, F
@bijouxbroussard YES. That is my sister's concern, that perhaps he has just learned how to play their game rather then learn what got him there and how to change those behaviors

 
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