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I Am Going to Say Something Controversial

When they report a crime，media should be obliged to always tell the criminal's citizenship, and in case they are second or third generation immigrants, to mention it.

Population has the right to know which people groups are their strongest potential threats, and then demand authorities that measures are taken against them.

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room101 · 51-55, M

@Cierzo A lot of therefores in the above.................all of which are completely contradicted by the undeniable fact that every culture [b]enshrines the basic principles of; do not kill others, do not steal and, do not lie in its social constructs.[/b]

Above you said:

“with laughable attempts to awake ideologies that have been dead for 70 years to describe those who dare to disagree the status quo”

Are you suggesting that Nazism and Fascism are long dead ideologies?

I took the following photographs at an anti-immigration and anti-EU rally in Rome in May, 2016.

https://similarworlds.com/9408790-I-Am-Flabbergasted/635542-I-dont-know-whats-going-on-in-the-world-Ive-spent

The rally was organised by a group who call themselves CasaPound. The second part of their name is taken from Ezra Pound, a renowned fascist and supporter of both Mussolini and Hitler.

You will note that, in the first photo, the guy in the front is making a white power salute while the guy behind him is making a Nazi salute. In the second photo we see what was at the head of the march. Interestingly, Spain, France and Italy are all represented. And that black flag that you see second from the left is not an ISIS flag. It’s the flag of a Greek far-right group who call themselves Χρυσή Αυγή, or Golden Dawn. They too are a fascist group who celebrate and promote Nazism. So no, Cierzo, Fascism and Nazism are not long dead ideologies and what you are advocating is playing straight into their narrative.

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room101 · 51-55, M

@Cierzo Think about what you've said. Think about how this discussion has evolved. Your proposal is that the nationality of criminals should be stated by the media, then you say that the information is hidden by the media. You seem to acknowledge that much of the media has its own agendas. So, what happens to that data when it comes into contact with the agenda of a given media outlet. A right-wing outlet will present the data in one way whereas a left-wing outlet will present it in an opposing way.

How does that help the general population?

This is yet another reason why I disagree with your proposal. But, it boils down to the same thing. A narrative is established which divides and discriminates and does nothing to help neither the migrant population nor the homogeneous population.

Cierzo · M

@room101 My point is that media should forget about narratives, just present the facts and let people get their own conclusions. Treat their readers and viewers like adults, and not like kids.

It is you who is talking all the time about left, right, being divisive. I know that strategy of blaming others of your own behaviour, and it sucks.

room101 · 51-55, M

@Cierzo Yes, I'm talking about left and right because, as history (not the media) has shown us, it's at the extremes of political ideology that we find strategies like the one that you are proposing being enacted. And always with divisive, and devastating, results.

We've been going backwards and forwards with this for days and you are yet to provide any kind of tangible evidence that supports the idea that some nations are more inclined towards crime than others. Without that evidence, your entire proposal falls flat on its face and shows itself to be nothing more than blaming others for the ills of our societies.

SW-User

In most places you only know no foreigner is involved because they say explicit "it's done by a white man", otherwise you just don't hear anything about their back ground.

Cierzo · M

@SW-User If the background is not mentioned, it is a sign they are not country citizens, but why must the truth be hidden?

SW-User

@Cierzo That's the question of the coming decades, why are some categories treated like a lesser kind of people, a group of people who needs special protection, and certainly not a honest evaluation of their criminal behaviour.
And who and why are SJW protecting them like the do?
I never believed in cultural Marxism but it's hard to deny it exists now.

SW-User

In a way that sounds discriminative but at the same time it’s equal treatment of criminals and not shaming one particular ethnic group over the other, the media so play sides with certain ethnic groups, and the word “Terrorism” should be used for [b]all[/b] hate crimes on behalf of any ethnic group rather than single out one with the label of terrorism. If a guy blows up a location or a mass shooting, in my eyes that’s Terrorism, doesn’t matter the ethnic group.

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SW-User

@Cierzo so true, I agree with this one, and it’s important to do this so that the media can show that not all of one group is bad all the time, but what bugs me about the media is that how they use Terrorism when the act is caused by a middle eastern ethnicity, where as if an Anglo did the same crime, it’s a “mass murder” or some mental “fruit loop”. Yes the Islamic ethnic groups are more responsible for some of these acts but the word terrorism shouldn’t just aim at one group. They do mention ethnic groups on the Australian media when gang related news is reported and the usual suspects mentioned are the Lebanese, Vietnamese, Maori/Pacific Islander and the main ones the Sudanese immigrants but then again it’s also the way the media portrays and stereotypes the certain groups.

Cierzo · M

@SW-User Terrorism is terrorism, no matter the race, religion or citizenship of the terrorists, but we have the right to know (not only guess) that some of them are a bigger threat than others

SW-User

@Cierzo exactly.

Scribbles · 36-40, F

I'm a bit confused

Can you explain this to me using a specific example?

Because at a glance this sounds like a bad reality TV show that encourages fear mongering and stereotyping.

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Scribbles · 36-40, F

@Cierzo Here's the thing...homogeneous societies have their own elites and plenty of in-fighting too. Because nobody is ever all exactly the same. Control and power quickly becomes more important. They put the squeeze on their own people until it all implodes or they start to terrorize people outside their little bubble of a society. sorry, I don't see how it would "work better".

@room101 I know it, thanks Roomie. 😁 I believe it has great potential to lead to that outcome you mentioned and MORE besides.

Scary example you made to fit cierzo's proposal below regarding "UK's should know if white male americans are among them because of gun violence". Even though America has a serious gun violence problem. Cierzo's thing here made me think of the movies minority report and Gatticca in an odd way. Imagine if the world and everybody WAS so profiled and stereotyped to death by race, culture, parents, education, socioeconomically circumstances, history, everything etc, etc...and people thought they could predict everything about you and your actions. And nobody cared to change anything except for a few people.

Would probably make a good scifi book. Can I call dibs?
Who am I kidding, I'd probably never find the time to write it.

room101 · 51-55, M

@Scribbles The story has been told in various way by various authors.

1984 by George Orwell
Brave New World by Aldous Huxley
A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess

Those are the old classics...............and my favourites ☺

Scribbles · 36-40, F

@room101 😳 I forgot about those stories...though it's probably been 15 or so years since I've read them or seen the films. And I'm not sure if I've ever read Brave New World or if I only ever read excerpts of it in long ago classes. 🤔

I first thought of the more modern takes. Vonnegut's Harrison Bergeron for one, and some Ursula K Leguin and others. Or maybe I just accidentally lean more towards American authors first? 😂

CopperCicada · M

I am third generation Euro-trash. If I do something good or bad in this life, how does that reflect on my ancestry? I already live in a time and place in America where the majority would insist that I'm not a real American. When do I get to move past this?

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CopperCicada · M

@Cierzo I guess I am just trying to understand the benefit of your thesis.

I think I live in a time and place where culture matters more than respect for American political and social values.

Cierzo · M

@CopperCicada I don't think culture and political and social matters can be separated, especially in America. You know better than me, but don't you think that you cannot define American culture without mentioning at least the 1st and 2nd amendment?

CopperCicada · M

@Cierzo well. i would say the articles of government like the 1st and 2nd amendments to the constitution transcend culture and are what allow american society to be pluralistic. that is the spirit that my immigrant ancestors came to america for. and it was how and why we maintainer much of our culture for 100 years. that always seemed to be possible. to keep our american cultural identity along with our european cultural identity. to bring our religious identity under the 1st amendment. to speak our language under the 1st amendment. that is gone.

which is why i was curious about your proposal. it seems in the same spirit, but i suspect spain is different thing all together.

CrazyMusicLover · 31-35

They should always show their faces and reveal their names as well! No double standards for rich people of high social status.

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Cierzo · M

@room101 It is not always a double standard. There are celebrities who are famous for their job, and care to keep their private life private, and and celebrities who are very willing to sell their private life, their charity work, or their attendance to parties to media. I don't agree with the demeanours of the former ones being public, but I don't think the latter ones have the right to complain if that happens

room101 · 51-55, M

@Cierzo We're not talking about the behaviour of celebrities nor are we talking about their complaints or how they deal with their celebrity status. We're talking about how crimes are reported by the media. We're talking about the assertion that if the crimes of people of power and status are reported by the media then so should those of migrants and refugees. We're talking about the blatant disparity between those two types of people and their subsequent treatment (or non-treatment) by the media.

Cierzo · M

@room101 I think my point has always been clear, for important crimes like rape or murder the identity and nationality of the criminal should be revealed, no matter if they are celebrities or immigrants. And that there should be crime statistics by nationality.

room101 · 51-55, M

So let's all embrace racial profiling........riiiight. Because that's worked out so well in the past 😒

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Cierzo · M

@room101 Solid ideas like this one:

Nation is cultured-based. All cultures are different. Therefore their attitudes regarding crimes like murder, rape, theft are too.

Therefore I have the right to know if there is some nationality (hence culture) whose crime propensity to crime is too high beyond average to avoid it, not living in or going to places they go to, and having in mind parties' regarding them when I vote

I just want information that is useful for self-preservation, because I think that is the task media have to perform in a society

room101 · 51-55, M

@Cierzo sorry, I messed up. I meant to post the above as part of this dialogue thread but posted it as a separate comment in error.

Cierzo · M

@room101 It is ok, I see it was meant to be an answer to my last reply.

novembermoon · 51-55

Facts are facts. No need to hide details. People need to know. And when the media reports, these things should be made known. Of course the human rights groups will come chanting that it is an infringement of human rights blah blah blah.

Cierzo · M

@novembermoon Exactly, facts are facts and must be known. Then interpretations come, and may be criticised if inaccurate.

questionWeaver

Media won't tell us any more than age.

It is sad

but, you are correct ... we should be told citizenship ... at a minimum ... and if they are natural citizens.

Cierzo · M

@questionWeaver Exactly

Firespirit · 26-30, M

Lets do let the media do that they are bad enough already

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Cierzo · M

@MalteseFalconPunch And if the criminals are not American, wouldn't you prefer to know it?

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