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How about instead of building a wall at the border ...

... we work with the countries to our south to make them places they don't want to leave? It would be cheaper and more effective in the long run.

Here is the argument against that approach, and here is 3 reasons why it is wrong.

"It's their mess, we shouldn't have to be the ones to clean it up!"

1) That is only partly true. Americans have a long history intervention in the region, and anti-communist driven initiatives of the 1950s-1980s left a considerable mess. We are obligated to pay for some of the clean-up.


2) The anti-communist coups are a damaging legacy that casts a shadow over the now. But it isn't more important than now. Let's admit two facts:

i) The US war on drugs has been an unmitigated disaster. It has been devastating in the US, doing far more damage than the drugs themselves ever could. But, as importantly, it puts a lot of resources in the hands of violent criminals in Latin America, making them too powerful for the weak governments there to handle.

This is a North American-made policy choice that is destroying Latin America, and driving their people north.

ii) America's love affair with guns ensures that the drug lords are well armed and capable of overwhelming countries with violence. Put simply, American gun manufacturers know that a part of their market are the drug cartels, and they produce the guns anyway.

While making this point tends to draw a lot of self-righteous noise about individual rights, the 2nd amendment begins "a well-regulated militia ..." not, "unregulated drug cartels...".

So here's a simple proposal: how about not producing guns for global criminals?

Starve groups like MS-13 of resources and armament, reduce the violence in Latin America and let people stay in their homes rather than coming to the US?

Unlike a wall, it just might work ...🤔
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Well you make guns illegal then the criminals will find a way to black market sell them - and the USA does more than pleanty to help ppl that dont know how to grow crops and food. What should we do teach them how to make microchips too ? Which by the way many USA companies set up shop and provide jobs to people that would not have anything. Of course these companies are making a profit from cheap labor. But it is better than looking at the sun.

We should make the USA a place that they would not want to come to to get govt freebies and handouts. They will self deport or think twice because they will soon realize that they are not wanted. Charity begins at home - many white people go to bed hungry each night/
WoodyAq · M
@MarmeeMarch I got through the 1st three sentences of that, and ... you still just aren't getting it.

Don't make guns illegal. Just don't sell them to criminals.

I don't know why that is a hard concept to grasp.
@WoodyAq God you are dumb - sell them to criminals ? who is going to SELL a gun to criminals. Criminals will get what ever they need when they need it. Sell ---lol what a boob.
"Hello sir welcome to Joe Honkey's Gun shoppe. " You want to by a gun /" well are you a criminal ?" "no" ok sir then I can sell you one. - HA HA
WoodyAq · M
@MarmeeMarch The gun companies produce a number of guns. They know for a fact that a percentage of these guns are going to end up in the hands of criminals.

Just like the drug companies that overproduce opioids, they could take measures to reduce those numbers.

They don't. It has nothing to do with rights or principals. It's profits.

And I think you shouldn't try to make up for your obviously limited capabilities by insulting others.
@WoodyAq OK - sorry but have to say that ppl that make guns make them for profit - it is called business. You cant buy a gun without getting a background check done. Criminals dont have to worry about background checks - they go to the guy on the corner - slip him a fifty dollar bill and he is the proud owner of his new gun. Of course serial numbers scratched off.
WoodyAq · M
@MarmeeMarch There are measures that can be taken. It doesn't involve making guns illegal, but it does mean making them more expensive to get.

The gun manufacturers and the NRA resist these changes because it will cost them. They would rather that other people pay the cost.
@WoodyAq And I will plainly explain this to you as simple as I can ---How are you going to know who are the criminals ?

If you dont understand this i can try to explain using building blocks or maybe picture ??? Or a Etch - A - Sketch
WoodyAq · M
@MarmeeMarch Most of the guns in the hands of criminals are stolen, or sold illegally.

Make guns harder to steal, and aggressively check gun sellers to make sure they are selling illegally.
@WoodyAq OMG dude -- OK , if you are a criminal YOU CAN GET A GUN FOR FREE - and what is the incentive for a store to sell a gun illegally ? Prison time --oh what fun
WoodyAq · M
@MarmeeMarch Free guns? 😅 yeah, that's a real thing.

Gun companies are handing out free guns.
@WoodyAq why ? even if I owned a lemonade stand I still would charge - anyway I am talking about the local thug on the corner that wants to rob a gas station.