I just don't get how we can have free will in a universe where God already knows what will happen because that means it was always going to happen. [Spirituality & Religion]

@FreeSpirit1 Spot on hun 😊

@FreeSpirit1

No i really don't. How am i making real choices when the conclusion is determined before hand?
It's like saying a train conductor is deciding where to drive the train even though he can only go along one path.

If you understand how free will can co-exist with pre-determination then please, let's talk about it.

@Pikachu I dont believe in God therefore what's written in the bible doesnt have any impact in my life, just like yours.

@FreeSpirit1

lol you tease.

@Pikachu Is an atheist who worries about religion really an Atheist? 🤣

@FreeSpirit1

Is a rich man who worries about the poor really a rich man?😉

@Pikachu If hes a rich man who says to the poor , Why aren't you rich like me? Then hes a rich shit stirrer.

@FreeSpirit1

lol i was trying to come up with a response but i think the analogy begins to break down here. But the analogy was only meant to show that one can be interested or concerned with something that doesn't affect them personally.

I'm not saying to Christians :"Why don't you believe as i do". I'm asking how, in the context of their belief system, this idea remains coherent.

@Pikachu If you were interested or concerned you wouldn't have framed the question as disingenuous as you did. There is nothing a religious person could say to you which would change your belief on free will.

@FreeSpirit1

Oh...i didn't think i had framed it disingenuously. I thought i was just describing my point of view.
I think it's rather premature and more than a little unfair to declare that there is nothing someone can say to change my mind on this matter.

I do have a stance on the issue but this is still an invitation to discussion and debate.

lol Buuuut speaking of stirring the pot, that rather seems to be your goal here since you have neither a religious stance on this subject nor an apparent interest in discussing the subject itself but rather my motivations.

If you want to weigh in then i'm happy to carry on.
Until then, i think we can agree that this is not a productive line of dialogue 🙂

@FreeSpirit1 as an atheist I worry very deeply about religion because these people pass laws based on their holy book. And let's face it, there's some pretty nasty laws in there.

@ViciDraco

Yeah there is that aspect of it. It's all well and good to say that religion doesn't affect the non-religious but in point of fact, it does. When religious people want to ban abortion because of their religion, that's a problem that affects non-religious people. Same with treatment of homosexuality as a perversion.

@ViciDraco where do you live?

@FreeSpirit1 Florida, in the United States

@ViciDraco Which laws are being passed that worry you? I thought you were going to say some Muslim run country with religious nuts running things

@FreeSpirit1 anti gay laws, laws that violate women's reproductive rights are the big ones today. They've already got special tax exemption for religion. Biblical law has stuff just as bad as Muslim law. Our society is just advanced enough to ignore them. But backsliding becomes a risk.