The Burden of Proof: Theists of SW, do you believe that an atheist has a burden of proof when it comes to their lack of belief in a god [Spirituality & Religion]
or their rejection of the claim that a god exists?
If you say no, then i agree. If you say yes, then let's discuss.
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Like i said, there's no compelling evidence too think otherwise.
If you want to talk about evidence why i should believe then let's do it. If you want to preach then i don't think that would be a good use of our time.
I'm not trying to convince you. I'm simply replying on the same level you approached me on.
Correct me if i'm wrong but when you say "you don't owe [b]me[/b] an explanation for anything", what you're saying is "god is real and you'll have to explain it to him", yes? Well my response is of the same kind: "No i won't because god isn't real". This is not an explanation, it is a rejection of the faith claim which you have presented.
No, this was not a ploy to bait believers. This was an invitation to a debate. Sadly, believers have generally chosen not to engage on this subject, yourself included.
@Pikachu [quote]when you say "you don't owe me an explanation for anything"[/quote]
Let me break out my code book and decipher that for you. It means - "you don't owe me an explanation for anything"
But now, you want me to explain why Believers don't want to engage in a conversation with you!
Maybe, it's your insincere approach. I mean, you obviously have this all figured out for yourself. I never even asked but you decided to share that you don't believe in God. Why would I beat my head against a wall to try to change your mind?
I gladly help people looking for God. I just don't think that's you.
Hmm i can't help but feel that you're becoming unduly adversarial here.
All that i did was reject your assertion of a god and invite a discussion while warning you against preaching.
Your response was to call me a troll and to criticize my sincerity and motivation.
Whatever else you're doing here, you've clearly set yourself against me personally and elected not to discuss the subject which i raised in this thread.
@Pikachu [quote]Shall we go our separate ways then?[/quote] If you wish. Did I assert God? Or, did you assert there is no God? I ASKED if you are a troll. [I noted that you did not answer.] You asked me why other people won't talk to you on the subject. How would I know their motivation?
If you will as unreasoned in a discussion about God as you have been in my crystal clear responses - I think you will have nothing to gain in a discussion.
PS - The Subject of the thread is - "do you believe that an atheist has a burden of proof when it comes to their lack of belief in a god" It seems you've drifted away from that on your own.
By the way a [quote]warning you against preaching.[/quote] - sounds kind of vague. If you intend to censor my responses with claims of preaching - well, it's just another reason to not discuss with you. Your mind is closed and you apparently are afraid of bursting into flames or something if you decide I'm trying to prosthelytize.
Personally, I'm a firm believer in God, Jesus and Holy Spirit. I'm a [block your eyes] a [b][big]Christian[/big][/b]! I am delighted to share what I know to be true with anyone with a sincere interest.
So Pik - how do you think the universe got it's start? Where did Creation come from? How do you explain our existence?
Hey man, it seems pretty clear that the implication of "you don't have to explain anything to [b]me[/b]" is that i'll need to explain it to god. If that was not your implication then no worries.
You said i was insincere and asked if i was trolling, asked if this totally reasonable question was baiting. Don't clutch your pearls with me, ok? Perhaps this was all done in good faith but you'll admit that the effect is more than a little antagonistic.
Unless calling people insincere and questioning their motivation seems to you to be a friendly line of discourse 😉
[quote]The Subject of the thread is - "do you believe that an atheist has a burden of proof when it comes to their lack of belief in a god"[/quote]
Yup. So are you interested in discussing that subject?
@Pikachu [quote]So are you interested in discussing that subject?[/quote] Sure, but I think we've beat that horse to death already.
Of course you have been disingenuous and insincere. There is no clutching of pearls here Pik. I was fully expecting you to abandon your opening question and turn it around and insist that as a Christian, I have a burden of proof when it comes to my belief in God.
But, your still denying that - so maybe you are actually a new follower of Christ, looking for direction. [I actually have a straight face as I write this.]
So, I will answer your question again, with the same answer I gave earlier. [PS - I'm 68, so you might want to hurry along in whatever your scheme is.]
"Atheists don't owe me an explanation for anything."
Sorry, not really sure what your issue is but since you believe i am insincere and disingenuous, i cant really see this being a productive interaction.
If future you might consider not assuming these things if you want to have a friendly conversation.😉👍
@Pikachu [quote]not really sure what your issue is[/quote] Here's the deal, Pik. I'm into clarity over agreement and honesty over everything. In other words, it's not critical to me that we would agree, but it IS critical to me that we be honest with one another. I don't believe you are either, clear or honest.
See, i would describe my interests in the same way. I think maybe the difference is that i don't assume dishonesty until it appears to be the most reasonable option. You see, [i]clarity[/i] bud, can be a difficult thing to achieve via text. To that end, i find it more useful to clarify someone's position before criticizing them for it and certainly before i decide they're disingenuous.
If i'm insincere and dishonest and now also unclear...well i'm not sure what you're still doing here...
So are we done then or would you like to keep talking about me since the actual subject of this thread appears to hold little interest for you?
Up to you man. If you want to just keep talking about my obfuscating dishonesty then yeah, we're done. If you would like to talk about the subject at hand then you're more than welcome😉
In the discussion of the subject of god do you, a theist, feel there is a burden of proof on an atheist to show that a god does not exist in order for them to be justified in their lack of belief in a god or gods?
[quote] the BIBLE already establishes that God is not only morally superior[/quote]
Sorry, i actually just clarified this for you in my most recent post.
[quote] we are right back to asking why would a fictional being from a fictional book even BEGIN to make you question your own moral superiority?[/quote]
This is not about me questioning my morality. This is a discussion topic. Like who would win in a fight between batman and spider-man. (spider-man)
@Pikachu [quote]Do I feel there is a burden of proof on an atheist to show that a god does not exist in order for them to be justified in their lack of belief in a god or gods?[/quote]
OK, that's a little different than the first question.
I guess the follow up would be, justified to who? [Or, is it whom?]
The atheist doesn't believe in God, so wouldn't be interested in being justified in God's view.
Belief in God, or not, is a very personal thing. I can't think of a valid reason to insist on justification of someone else's personal beliefs.
Then there's ones self. What's the old saying - "To thine own self be true." In this context I think thorough justification is merited. After all we all are stuck with living with ourselves and our decisions and consequences.
