I just don't understand the exaggerated worship of science by many today and why they've held it up as a force that would somehow solve everything.

@ElwoodBlues Listen, I'm not saying that science has not done any good. That's not the point of the post. Keep in mind that believing that you understand life because of science is like believing that you understand Los Angeles because you have the telephone directory. Scientists say they understand life because they can look up where the genes are, the coding for the proteins. Does this tell us anything about a broken heart or a Hitler? I don't think so. Science now depends on an extremely alienating instrumentality.

While you bring up some of the pros of science, you also forget to mention all the bad that has come from science and what it has destroyed. While you contend that it has improved our life, well, while it has improved certain things, at the same time, it has made things worse. Just observe the social effects technology has had on people collectively and what that is doing to people's health - mental and physical.

Also, thanks to science, In the 1950's they introduced chemical farming. From the 1950's we have had an epidemic of cancer in the western world. Because they've been using fungicides on fruits and vegetables, they've been killing the funguses and fungal attacks artificially, which means the fruit and vegetable plants are not longer producing salvestrols to deal with the fungal attack because it is being done externally for them. Salvestrols are what the fruit and vegetables produce to deal with a fungus attack and the reason why salvestrols work against cancer because cancer is a form of fungal attack on the body. The most used fungicides used in the world have another effect: they neutralize the effect of CYP1B1 - the enzyme in cancer cells, so you can eat all the salvestrols all you like but if your body accumilates the fungicide poisons through eating these foods it won't matter anyway, because the salvestrols will not be activated as a cancer killing agent because the enzyme within the cancer cell has been neutralized. The food we eat is poison, thanks to science.

People before the technological and industrial society were far healthier. Tribes who don't eat the garbage we consume are far healthier and don't get as many diseases as we get, among many of those are heart disease, and they don't really don't get cavities. Cavities were very rare before the technological industrial society. Specifically, as an example, (and I could give many) one group that is said to have the world's healthiest hearts is the Tsimane people.

About 90 percent of the Tsimane people’s food comes from hunting, fishing, foraging, and farming. Until two years ago, none of their communities had electricity. None have running water. They live in the Bolivian Amazon with relatively low contact with the rest of Bolivia. Most still speak their traditional language. It takes days to get from villages to towns. They eat about the same amount of meat that Americans do, but it’s much leaner, coming from wild animals. Shows you that the processed meats we eat are really bad for you. Something else to note: they have not taken our pharmaceutical position also, which is destroying people's health more than it is healing them.

As for your point on life expectancy, but you're wrong here. Humans do not live longer. I know you don't accept this, but the ancient Biblical lifespan was 900 something years and our genetics have been declining since. Now we are at 70-100 years. It isn't only the Bible that mentions this long lifespan, though, as most cultures all around the world talk about a golden age where people lived much longer. Some cultures have the lifespan at over a thousand years. Almost all cultures discuss this golden age because it is in the collective memory of mankind, because it is true.

@SW-User [quote]Keep in mind that believing that you understand life because of science is like believing that you understand Los Angeles because you have the telephone directory[/quote] Classic straw man. Every life scientist I know regards life as a fascinating mystery.

[quote]From the 1950's we have had an epidemic of cancer in the western world.[/quote] No, we've had an epidemic of cancer [b]diagnoses[/b] in the western world. They used to give it other names. Look at the life expectancy chart - it continued to grow all thru your "epidemic." Also, cancer is a disease of the long-lived. If they're dying around 42, there's not enough time for most cancers to develop.

[quote]People before the technological and industrial society were far healthier.[/quote] Healthy enough to live only 40 years instead of 80. Doesn't sound like a win to me.

[quote] Shows you that the processed meats we eat are really bad for you.[/quote] Nothing you stated shows anything like that.

[quote] but the ancient Biblical lifespan was 900 something years[/quote] Should I also believe ancient tales of the strength of Hercules and the invulnerabilty of Achilles? Nobody has ever excavated bones with any extraordinary lifespan like that. Pure mythology without a shred of evidence.

@SW-User
Once more you are comparing science with applied science. Science is a process, nothing more or less. How it is used has no baring on the morality of science, because it has none. That is the human factor. Stop trying to comparing it to your idea of god.

@DocSavage whats the nuremberg code?

@gol979
Applied science by people. Not the science itself.

@DocSavage so the word science is clear of any ethical consideration? Even though it is a man made process? Theres nothing in the name of "science" that cannot be questioned as unethical?

@gol979 [quote]Theres nothing in the name of "science" that cannot be questioned as unethical?[/quote] Nobody said that. Nice straw man fallacy though!!

Science is a tool. Many people have used it to do great good. A few have used it to do great harm.

@ElwoodBlues remove yourself from an adult convo elwood. Your pseudoscientific, infantile takes are the last thing we need. Your takes on covid and the injection were flat out wrong and pretty gross tbh

@gol979 [quote]Your takes on covid and the injection were flat out wrong[/quote] Too bad you never had a shred of evidence to support what you've just said! Wanna see my evidence again??

@ElwoodBlues nah, i dont need a copy and paste of known liars and vested interests thanks. We all now know (or at least we should) lockdowns, masks, social distancing and injections were not needed and in most of those cases actually harmful to health. The fallout from your religious idol, The Injection, is awful. Yet you still pimp this hideous goo. Shameful

@gol979 Are you suggesting that the thousands of city & county medical examiners are "known liars"?? It's their data that makes up the table below. You've got evidence to back that accusation???

Here in the table are US death numbers for the top ten causes of death for six years ending in 2020. Notice how there are 20% more deaths in 2020 than the average of the previous five years? Doing the math, that's 500,000 excess deaths in 2020.

Notice how, in 2020, 345,000 of those 500,000 excess deaths are classified as Covid? Notice how almost all causes of death rose in 2020, including cancer & heart disease?
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2778234

If there's any validity to the claim that lots of deaths have been mis-classified as Covid, why did almost all causes of death increase in 2020? Wouldn't mis-classification produce a reduction in those other causes? The evidence says mis-classification is a red herring.

@ElwoodBlues all based on a bogus pcr testing regime. That was pointed out to you many times. You keep pimping for big harma pal....keep ignoring the results from your own version of scientism......inflation, massive increase in waiting lists for other health issues, mental health, huge amount of injection injuries.

This is what the OP is on about. Its in your face but because you worship "science" you refuse to see

@gol979 You're saying cities and counties can't count dead bodies??

Notice how, in 2020, 345,000 of those 500,000 excess deaths are classified as Covid? Notice how almost all causes of death rose in 2020, including cancer & heart disease?

How do you explain the 500,000 excess deaths above baseline in 2020? That's about ten standard deviations above baseline. Are thousands of city & county medical examiners falsifying the count?

Oh, and, lest I forget, similar proportions of excess deaths were counted in the rest of the developed world. Are all of Europe's medical examiners in on the conspiracy? With no leakers and no whistleblowers??

@ElwoodBlues lockdowns, midazolam, euthanising elderly its all there but your priests are blinding you.....and yes, many deaths were fraudulently written off as covid. Due to fraudulent pcr and the insane way deaths were counted "within 28 days of a pcr test". Its so obvious now that we have been lied to

@gol979 Believe me, I'm happy to get to the subject of misclassified deaths, but first let's agree on the body count. Are you accepting or denying the raw numbers of excess deaths in 2020? Are you suggesting there weren't 500,000 excess deaths in the US in 2020 compared to the 5 previous years? Are you suggesting there were massive numbers of falsified US death certificates in 2020?

@ElwoodBlues yes, every death was put through the fraudulent pcr regime. And as for your excess deaths if you isolate ppl, close much of the hea!thcare system and then force feed elderly and vulnerable euthanising drugs you will get a whole lot of deaths. Its really not hard to see and we now all know this was happening....many were telling you all this at the time

@gol979 [quote]yes, every death was put through the fraudulent pcr regime. [/quote] FALSE. Actually, there were very few PCR tests available during much of 2020, and they were reserved for the living. Most 2020 Covid deaths were diagnosed by symptoms.

[quote]close much of the hea!thcare system[/quote]
HUH??? Where did THAT come from??? The healthcare system was wide open and overflowing with Covid patients!!!

[quote]and then force feed elderly and vulnerable euthanising drugs[/quote] Great story! You're saying that in THOUSANDS of eldercare facilities, THOUSANDS of doctors and nurses suddenly started committing MASS MURDER via "euthanising drugs"! Great story!!

In school they taught me extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Too bad you don't have a SHRED of evidence for any of this alleged MASS MURDER via "euthanising drugs."

You didn't directly answer my question but I'm guessing you agree with the body count but claim the causes of death were all faked? Is that a fair statement??

It’s not science that has done bad things, it’s the bad humans who used science to do bad things. It’s quite simple really. Anything can be used for good or bad. It’s the people, not the science. @SW-User

@ElwoodBlues i see you and have debated the borg many times....you all say the same. No amount of suffering, that you are partially responsible for (remember bleating about "consequences") will open your eyes to the evil of lockdowns and injecting ppl with dangerous goo. You are in support of medico-fascism and if its tried again im sure you will be an avid supporter. I bet you were rubbing your hands with glee when moneypox came about.....the same ppl selling you the covid lie were selling you moneypox fear

@gol979 You've started DUCKING my questions!?!?

You're saying that in THOUSANDS of eldercare facilities, THOUSANDS of doctors and nurses suddenly started committing MASS MURDER via "euthanising drugs"? That's the hill you want to die on??

Followup question: does this claim only apply to the US, or did the same "euthanising drugs" mass murder occur all over Europe as well?

@ElwoodBlues calm down. And yes, many were murdered. Theres form as well. Just today an elderly person starved to death. See the huge increase in midazolam ordered in the uk. Care homes and healthcare massively short staffed. Dnrs being imposed on ppl with no consent......amd again, all were tested while alive with a fraudulent pcr test so "covid" could be put on the death cert. Stop apologising/supporting mass murder, its sick

@gol979 OK, you're standing by your allegation of mass murder. I assume you're pinning most of the 500,000 increase in deaths in US 2020 on mass murder? Likewise Europe??

[quote]all were tested while alive with a fraudulent pcr test [/quote] Nope. When the US Senate reconvened in the autumn of 2020, they didn't have enough spare PCR tests to test 100 senators. PCR tests were SCARCE. Your claim here is demonstrably false.

Since the deaths happened in many facilities in all states & countries, your alleged mass murder is quite de-centralized. It all started in March 2020. Did all these murders start that month spontaneously?

Or was it a conspiracy and TENS OF THOUSANDS of eldercare doctors and nurses and attendants received their orders and started using the alleged "euthanising drugs" on command?? Why are there no leakers? Why are there no whistleblowers?? Why is there no evidence whatsoever of this alleged VAST WORLDWIDE conspiracy???

I have the evidence of 500,000 excess bodies and their death certificates and the diagnoses of TENS OF THOUSANDS of doctors worldwide. What's your evidence??

@ElwoodBlues ive given you a list of atrocities you supported now off you toddle......not my issue if you dont want to look at it....maybe becuase youre complicit

@gol979 NO.
You've given me ALLEGATIONS without a SHRED of evidence. You've alleged 500,000 murders in the US, committed in thousands of eldercare facilities via "euthanising drugs." Where's the evidence, dude??

@ElwoodBlues look it up yourself. See midazolam, dnrs, starving ppl in care homes, liverpool path careway, fraudulent pcr (which im sure you were saying were the "gold standard" like a good drone), changed the law in the uk feb 2020 on how to sign off death certs....im sure you wont bother though