Wait . . . what? Both college degrees AND high school diplomas are worthless now? We're doomed . . .

Photo above - Wanda the welder. This girl is going to buy a home of her own, some day.

I have a college degree in English Lit (minor in Cultural Anthropology). I’m a loser – those degrees would be worthless if I was graduating in 2025. The only reason I’m making it is because my parents paid my tuition, instead of brushing me off and telling me to take out 4 years of student loans. (There are $2 Trillion in unpaid student loans outstanding now. Hundreds of billions in new loans are made each year.)

If I had followed my high school guidance counsellor's advice, I might be WORSE off. Accounting, software coding . .. THOSE are the careers of the future, he told me. What a load of BS. Those are the jobs being wiped out right now by all kinds of automation. AI is only the latest threat.

Corporate hiring managers say 80% of high school graduates lack the basic skills to do ANYTHING in the workplace. Unable to get along with co-workers, showing up on time, basic math, solving simple problems, showing up on time, not pilfering the inventory. See link below.

My father was smarter than me. He only had a high school diploma, but he was a whiz at math, showing up on time, at spending less than he earned, and avoiding committing felonies. He’s the reason I didn’t have to take out student loans. My father also bought a home, put savings in the stock market, and briefly ran his own business. He never took a European or Vegas vacation.

I have zero statistics to prove it, but most people would agree that high school grads today are less prepared than those of a generation or two ago. High school kids used to work at McDonalds, or as construction laborers, or on local farms when not in class. Now those jobs are done by migrants, whether “documented" or not. Kids aren’t being slackers for staying at home and playing videogames. The shift manager at Wendy’s is hiring only workers from her country of origin, because she feels sorry for them, and they can converse in their native tongue when not doing customer-facing tasks.

Nobody is going to be able to buy a house or start a business based on today’s high school diploma. If they go to college instead, it’s a massive roll of the dice, and they are as likely to end up in loan default as not. They are as likely to drop out of college as not. If they get a degree, they are as likely to have a first job unrelated to that degree as not.

Let's not to simplistically blame public school teachers. They just do what the district administrators tell them. The administrators are happiest when parents DON’T turn up at school board meetings, and start asking questions. Anyway, when parents do show up, they seem more interested in ferreting out LBGT library than talking about SAT scores. Librarians are stocking the shelves with stuff nobody ever heard of, without even reading it first. Kid’s aren’t checking out school library books anyway.

If column this was only about the $300 billion in new student loans being made each year, soon to be uncollectable, the answer would be simple: stop throwing gas on the fire at the same time last years loans going into default by the Trillions.

America's education problems are more basic: our career counsellors are idiots, our kids can’t get after school work, and nobody trusts either a high school or college diploma.

If I was a high school junior today, I'd ask about an apprenticeship in welding.

I’m just sayin’ . . .

Opinion: Why America has lost faith in college and what to do about it

Future Workforce Could Be at Risk as Hiring Managers Doubt High School Graduates' Readiness

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SunshineGirl · 36-40, F

Do you really see no value in your degree? You seem pretty literate and, without knowing much about you or your career, I would imagine fairly resilient and resourceful in a rapidly changing economy. I am sure at least some of that is attributable to your higher level education. Hopefully some of the interest you showed in the subject as a youngster has remained with you and provided you with a lifelong passion.

It is easy with the benefit of hindsight to match certain qualifications to high paying jobs and dismiss all others as "poor value" (certain politicians make a career of this). But unless you are gifted with the power of fortune telling this is not such a great idea. If the bottom falls out of the market for welding (possibly because everyone has followed your advice to take up a welding apprenticeship), do you think this qualification alone will fit people well for life?

My first degree in pure maths qualified me for nothing. I had to compete for jobs alongside people from a wide range of backgrounds and eventually take a professional qualification to advance. Do I regard my bachelor degree as worthless? No, it is the foundation of everything I subsequently achieved. I know many historians, sociologists, linguists, etc, who feel exactly the same.

If high school graduates lack basic social and ethical skills, I wouldxsuggest this is due to them having too narrow an education focused only on what they can extract for themselves from the workplace.

The commoditisation of higher education is an unfortunate legacy that America has bequeathed the world. Chill out a little and enjoy the diversity and ingenuity of the human race before we are all coralled into slaving for Trump Plc. It is a beautiful world out there once you remember what matters 🌈

ElwoodBlues · M

@SusanInFlorida says

Wait . . . what? Both college degrees AND high school diplomas are worthless now?

No, not quite. YOUR college diploma in English Lit may be worthless; most peoples' diplomas are worth a fair amount.

BTW, your field of "expertise" explains why your postings on economics & science related topics are so full of howlers🤣😂

I have zero statistics to prove it

Nothing new about that!! Let's look at the stats of what people actually major in.

■ Business: 375,400 degrees (19%)
■ Health Professions and Related Programs: 263,800 degrees (13%)
■ Social Sciences and History: 151,100 degrees (7%)
■ Biological and Biomedical Sciences: 131,500 degrees (7%)
■ Psychology: 129,600 degrees (6%)
■ Engineering: 123,000 degrees (6%)

Social science may seem worthless at first glance, but it's the starting field for cops and social workers; jobs NOT getting replaced by automation. Psych majors often go into human resources or marketing. In short, most college students have a clear pathway to gainful employment related to their education.

It might be wise to take a look at the most and least under-employed majors:
https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2025/aug/jobs-degrees-underemployed-college-graduates-have

Wow, nursing, education, and computer science top the list of LEAST underemployed majors. Wait, what?? You just told us, @SusanInFlorida, that a software related degree was worthless. Turns out you're DEAD WRONG!!!

SusanInFlorida · 31-35, F

@ElwoodBlues please link to the income and employment states (after graduation) for "psychology" degrees and "social sciences". those things are fast track to being a starbucks barrista.

i complete support your view on engineering, business and health degrees. you'd have figured that out if you'd bothered to read the links included in my original post.

to win debates, you to read first, elwood!

ElwoodBlues · M

@SusanInFlorida Sorry, you must have mistaken me for your research assistant🤣😂

There are a lot of "social sciences" in the basket. As I said, some degrees lead to social work; others to police work. Please present the data behind your "fast track to being a starbucks barrista" claim.

The key howler I disproved was your claim that a software degree was being wiped out by automation. Turns out you're DEAD WRONG!!!

to win debates, you to read first

Lemme quote your headline to you one more time:

Wait . . . what? Both college degrees AND high school diplomas are worthless now?

Did you read your headline??? Because I did. It claimed college degrees are worthless.

idontcareok · 70-79, M

i'm 75, in 1998, i made 54k working in a union factory, as a machinist and maintainence man just high school, same factory is begging for help, and no one wants to get hands dirty, what is wrong now adays,

SusanInFlorida · 31-35, F

@idontcareok kudos on learning a trade and holding down a job that is beyond "intellectual property". factories would have better luck recruiting today it.

1 - they uniformly offered comprehensive health benefits for people who stay

2 - pensions are dead, but match 401k accounts aren't (yet)

3 - we didn't have crazy see-saw trade and tariff wars when nobody can figure out what their products will sell for next week.

idontcareok · 70-79, M

@SusanInFlorida %100 right

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GerOttman · 70-79, M

We pay licensed boiler operators $45/hr. to start...

Union with pension!

ElwoodBlues · M

@GerOttman How does one obtain a boiler operator's license?

GerOttman · 70-79, M

@ElwoodBlues there's a course you take online and a test. it's 600 for the course and 100 for the test. you need an EPA cert too. this is the process in my city, your local requirements may differ. New Jersey operators need a Black Seal license. A more extensive test but many local high schools offer the adult night class fot a reasonable price.

Oh, where I work has a reimbursement once you pass the test and get the license.

Zonuss · 46-50, M

No it isn't.
Credentials will always have importance.
But you have the option of going to
a trade or nursing school
if that's your cup of tea. ☕

SusanInFlorida · 31-35, F

@Zonuss most people have no idea of the difference between "credentials" and "qualifications"

credentials are a piece of paper. my nephew wanted to get a 4 year degree in "hospitality management", figuring he'd end up managing a ritzy hotel in las vegas.

he dropped out after one semester because he over-partied, as if he was in vegas. i told him he could have enlisted in the US military to get that training, and be paid for it. He said he didn't want to work that hard.

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