@Fukfacewillie Some guy from India once asked me why I was "pro-choice" when I didn't think people should be able to choose if they wanted to pay for Social Security. I had to explain that it only referred to abortion, not "choice" in general.
Like it or not, pro-choice and pro-life are the preferred terms even if they're not really accurate.
@BohemianBabe pro-life is a bad term for them. The level of care they have drops significantly after the child is born and becomes nonexistent at eighteen. Really they are just pro-birth.
Next time someone mentions being pro-life ask them how they feel about Healthcare being free at point of service.
@Lila15 I don’t care if it’s “preferred”, “pro-life” is an inaccurate name for that group that cedes them the moral high ground. I refuse to label them as such and it seems to me that Vox ought to know better than that too.
@ViciDraco If someone was against abortion because they honestly believed it was murder, but they also wanted essential services to be free, I'd respect them. At least then they're being consistent and truly pro-life. But with the Right, it's not about life, it's about keeping people poor.
@JPWhoo But then pro-lifers would want to call our side "pro-abortion," implying that we think all pregnancies should end in abortion. At some point you have to accept that the inaccurate terms are the ones most people understand. You can't expend a paragraph every time you want to mention a pro-lifer to explain whatever other term you're using.
On the Reddit abortion sub, they require PL and PC, and you can be banned if you call someone "pro-abortion" or a "forced birther." Everyone also uses ZEF (zygote/embryo/fetus) to refer to humans in utero.
@Lila15 But it’s so unfair to call them “pro-life”. I mean, if you call them that you’ve already lost the debate. Without explaining what they mean, ask any kindergartner whether she’d rather be pro-choice or pro-life. What do you think the vast majority of them would say?
Imagine, if you will, this absurd scenario: in the fictional sovereign nation of Whooistan religious fundamentalists are leading a grassroots movement to pass a law requiring all citizens when they reach the age of 21 to enter a draft not for military service but for clown service, and they must each work ten years as a clown. What do you think would be an appropriate name for this movement? Forced Clown supporters?
Well in Whooistan it is generally accepted that the two sides of the issue are called pro-choice and pro-happiness. Do you accept those terms of debate? Now, now, you must call them pro-happiness, otherwise they should get to call you pro-undertaker (replace undertaker with the name of a drearier profession if you can think of one).
Do we really just have to go with what’s become generally accepted, or should we try to change the framing of a debate if it’s being framed improperly?
@JPWhoo I don't like the terms PC and PL either, but those are the terms we're stuck with. You can try to change them, but good luck, at this point I wouldn't know how to do that.
