@Quizzical Yeah, looks happy and healthy, to be honest.

@SatanBurger Absolutely!

@AlyssaG Well I can't speak for them. I just want everyone to be happy and healthy. I'd hope they want the same, as do you. Although they clearly have a bad way of going about it

@fortycreek In many ways you are correct

@AlyssaG My view is, if you're not fucking me good, paying my bills or taking care of me as an individual then no one gets to say what I do with my life even if the concept of the individual is mostly false.

If it hurts no one, do what thou wilt, shall be whole of the law.

It doesn't hurt anyone for people to surgically get a pussy or a dick.

Unless they're planning to fuck you, why would they care?

Ask them next time if they want a piece of your ass, if not, tell them to shut the fuck up.

In real life that may get you into a fight but it's a pretty good way to end a conversation online.

@fortycreek what’s not to understand?

@AlyssaG I get it, that's a complicated answer

@Qwerty14 Most of the Christain people I've met who say they are not against gay rights also make ignorant statements regarding gay people that suggest they have a bias. I know because I've met plenty.

Most politicians leading the fight against gay marriage in the U.S. are Evangelical, that's a fact. There's Milo whose gay and doesn't support gay marriage but he's conservative Catholic so it's pretty clear that there are certain personality traits at play here.

We could argue all day on "one or two" secular people being opposed to gay marriage, but in the end, one or two isn't enough to take away marriage on the whole. On the other hand, people who have power do and those people in power have certain characteristics as you've guessed.

The numbers are not on your side.

More to the fact, atheists get discriminated against in law so do minorities or anyone, not Christian. Granted, that's starting to change but it's very clear there's a larger ruling class that has affected minority group rights.

If you look at the Middle East, it's the same thing except with Islam, certain personality characteristics but also nearly identical to those Evangelicals in America.

@SatanBurger Anecdotes are fine and all but I can't do much with them. I've never met a Christian irl that has opposed gay rights in any way. So does that mean none of them do? Of course not.

[quote]Most politicians leading the fight against gay marriage in the U.S. are Evangelical, that's a fact[/quote]

Why are they trying to fight it? It's already been put in. Would take a lot of effort to get it removed now and even then, most states would still have it. In fact, only 25% of the US is evangelical and they won't all be that radical about it. Though I do agree that evangelicals are crazy. They interpret the bible worse than atheists sometimes.

[quote]There's Milo whose gay and doesn't support gay marriage[/quote]

I think I know who you're talking about. The British guy right? I wouldn't take what he says at face value. It is clear he wants money and attention. He's said he's Jewish but I don't even believe that.

Imma pause here and just say that we needa clarify how you define secular. You use it a lot so best I find out how you intend for me to take it.

[quote]More to the fact, atheists get discriminated against in law[/quote]

How so?

@Qwerty14 Secularism how I define it as what it was originally coined by George Holyoake ironically also convicted of blasphemy.

[b]http://eremita.di.uminho.pt/gutenberg/3/6/7/9/36797/36797-h/36797-h.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Holyoake[/b]

*With permission to copy from the Eremita site, the first one.

SECULARISM is the study of promoting human welfare by material means; measuring human welfare by the utilitarian rule, and making the service of others a duty of life. Secularism relates to the present existence of man, and to action, the issues of which can be tested by the experience of this life—having for its objects the development of the physical, moral, and intellectual nature of man to the highest perceivable point, as the immediate duty of society: inculcating the practical sufficiency of natural morality apart from Atheism, Theism, or Christianity: engaging its adherents in the promotion of human improvement by material means, and making these agreements the ground of common unity for all who would regulate life by reason and ennoble it by service. The Secular is sacred in its influence on life, for by purity of material conditions the loftiest natures are best sustained, and the lower the most surely elevated. Secularism is a series of principles intended for the guidance of those who find Theology indefinite, or inadequate, or deem it unreliable. It replaces theology, which mainly regards life as a sinful necessity, as a scene of tribulation through which we pass to a better world. Secularism rejoices in this life, and regards it as the sphere of those duties which educate men to fitness for any future and better life, should such transpire.

II.

A Secularist guides himself by maxims of Positivism, seeking to discern what is in Nature—what ought to be in morals—selecting the affirmative in exposition, concerning himself with the real, the right, and the constructive. Positive principles are principles which are provable. "A positive precept," says Bishop Butler, "is a precept the reason of which we see." Positivism is policy of material progress.

III.

Science is the available Providence of life. The problem to be solved by a science of Society, is to find that situation in which it shall be impossible for a man to be depraved or poor. Mankind are saved by being served. Spiritual sympathy is a lesser mercy than that forethought which anticipates and extirpates the causes of suffering. Deliverance from sorrow or injustice is before consolation—doing well is higher than meaning well—work is worship to those who accept Theism, and duty to those who do not.

IV.

Sincerity, though not errorless, involves the least chance of error, and is without moral guilt. Sincerity is well-informed, conscientious conviction, arrived at by intelligent examination, animating those who possess that conviction to carry it into practice from a sense of duty. Virtue in relation to opinion consists neither in conformity nor non-conformity, but in sincere beliefs, and in living up to them.

V.

Conscience is higher than Consequence.*