Everyone should get the vaccine, and not be dumbasses.

@doong no, that is false.

@Stopmakingsense It is true. Even vaccinated can carry and transmit the Viruses.

@doong blah blah blah. Credibility doesn't grow back.

@doong yep, but they don't get as sick, and don't carry and transmit as many virus particles. Nobody ever claimed vaccines were perfect, just that they help reduce the spread and the number of people in need of medical help, and they do.

@NerdyPotato They do make spread worse because vaccine turns them into [b]asymptomatic trasnmitter[/b]

@doong That would be a risk indeed, but practice shows that spread goes down in areas with high vaccination grades.

@NerdyPotato No it's not. This is ireland new cases graph. 90% vaccinated

@doong In the Netherlands it's going down steadily despite opening up completely and nobody caring about spread anymore. How are hospitalizations doing in Ireland?

@NerdyPotato I don't know.

@doong People still die in spite of seatbelts, let's abolish them because they're not 100% effective either?

@Elessar Seatbelt did not kill nor permanently hurt the person using it. Vaccine does.

@doong Oh no, they can definitely f*ck you up or even kill you.


It's just that, similarly to vaccine vs covid, compression trauma by the seatbelt in the event of an accident is preferable (by far) to becoming windscreen marmalade.

@Elessar It will be counted as the accident indirectly causing the seatbelt to hurt the driver. And seatbelt can easily be modified to make it less hurtful.

One will need years and years to develop a real safe vaccines.

@doong Not necessarily, you may have an accident in which your chances of survival would be much better without a seatbelt on than with, for instance if you happened to fall low-speed in a river. If you die drowning because you're trapped by the belt I wouldn't say it's an indirect kill of the accident or of water, similarly to how you wouldn't be saying it's an indirect kill by covid or bad luck if you experienced some significant event right after taking a shot to protect yourself from it.

The evaluation of times, safety and effectiveness of vaccines/drugs require competency that neither you (nor me) possess, regulatory agencies exist for that reason, and they've already expressed their (positive) opinion on the vaccines in question.

@doong At the end of the day, chances of dying from a seatbelt are infinitesimal in comparison to chances of dying in a crash, and similarly, chances of dying or experiencing anything significant as a consequence of ANY of the currently approved vaccines is infinitesimal to the risks of developing, in decreasing order, PASC/long-covid, severe-covid or fatal-covid.

@Elessar It could be true for sinopharm / novavax. Not with the current big-four
They kill, they paralyze people, etc.

@doong Events like the one you described have an odd ratio in the order of 1:10^5 to 1:10^6. In my country of ~60 million people with a vaccination rate of 71% (42,355,056 fully vaccinated people), events like that happened in less than 100 (one hundred) people. Probably less, some areas of the press would report any and every single case even if just suspect to have a point against vaccination and the current government, and they didn't get even close to reporting 100 events as far as I can tell. So, even being generous, we're speaking of 100 people in a pool of 47,355,056 vaccinated individuals. If you're concerned about that, you better seal yourself in your home and never leave, even just by standing close to a road you have a much higher risk of dying by someone crashing and getting over you. Even using the stove in your kitchen is MUCH riskier than that, statistically speaking.

Remember that covid kicks in the ass circa one person every 25 (not thousands, not millions - TWENTYFIVE).

100/47,355,056 (= 1/475,551), versus 1/25

0.0002% vs 4.0%