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Will the British Far-Right do well out of Brexit?

Unfortunately, I think they will. Tommy Robinson is the founder of the English Defense League (EDL) and he is organising a protest around Brexit betrayal, just as Parliament is about to vote on Thereasa May's dog's dinner Brexit deal. The EDL are an outright Fascist organisation which have been involved in street violence and though Robinson claims to have left them behind, the EDL and other such groups are avid followers of his.

So why might British people be taken in by such a man and what does Brexit have to do with it?

Under any possible circumstances, a large number of people who voted to leave the EU will be disappointed with the outcome. This is inevitable because Brexit itself was always a fantasy promised by certain politicians but never deliverable in the real world. There are three possible outcomes to the Brexit mess:

1) Brexit is cancelled. People will feel betrayed because what they voted for has been cancelled by politicians.
2) Soft-Brexit. Though the Leave campaign was [i]never[/i] unanimous on leaving the customs union and the single market, many Brexit voters see it as meaning just that. So a partial break with the EU will be seen as a sell-out.
3) Hard-Brexit. A lot of Brexit voters do claim to want this and think it will make the country stronger. Every economic expert thinks it will be a disaster but conservative politicians and press say this will be relatively easy and that is what people want to believe. The reality of hard Brexit is a huge economic crash and Brexit voters will still feel hurt and cheated.

Basically, the only way for people who voted for Brexit to be happy with the outcome is if Brexit hugely cuts immigration and increases the economic strength of the country, whilst retaining national sovereignty. This can't happen and was never gonna happen so one of the three scenarios above will leave people feeling betrayed by both mainstream politicians and the EU. The tabloid press is already pumping out the narrative of national pride lost and betrayal by elites.

Most Brexit voters want nothing to do with the far-right, but a section of them will be seen as low-hanging fruit. 30% of people in this country believe that the government is deliberately hiding immigration figures 18% believe that there is a deliberate plan to make us a Muslim majority country. Most of these people will be Brexit voters.

The aforementioned Robinson is now aiming for political legitimacy by trying to join UKIP (Nigel Farage's old party) and UKIP themselves have gone from 2% to 7% in the polls. UKIP has the potential to push the UK Conservatives further to the nationalist right. The far-right is currently doing very well in Europe and one way or another, its ideas could permeate the UK.

Worrying times.
cultofaction · 26-30, M
[quote]the only way for people who voted for Brexit to be happy with the outcome is if Brexit hugely cuts immigration and increases the economic strength of the country, whilst retaining national sovereignty. This can't happen[/quote]
This is why no one takes you seriously
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Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@LvChris I'll never be rude to someone just for getting something wrong but it's that he does that AND calls me an idiot. Stupidity arrogance combo doesn't deserve manners.
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CountScrofula · 41-45, M
We live in pre-authoritarian times and unless there's a [i]serious[/i] revival and movement in the left we're going hard in that direction.

Like, you're writing this and you in the least have a major political party lead by a socialist with a reasonable hope of taking power. There's not even a prayer of that in many other countries with a similar problem with the far right rising.
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@CountScrofula Yes, though I am a realist about our chances. If hope exists, it's in the Labour left. There have been several lucky breaks which allowed Corbynism to happen. If it wasn't for that, I don't know where we'd be. Well... I do know and it would not be great.
CountScrofula · 41-45, M
@Burnley123 A lot of this stuff is about lucky breaks which is a little unnerving. A minute change in circumstances and Trump would have lost the 2016 election for example. The far right would still be a highly dangerous problem and possibly even more organized, but they wouldn't be implementing policy.
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@CountScrofula Yeah. I've seen John McDonnell speak a couple of times and one thing he said that struck me was that 'you have to take advantage of opportunities when they present themselves'.

He's Corbyn's shadow chancellor (economic minister) and they go far back. Both were veteran back-bench MPs heading for retirement when the 2015 Labour leadership election happened. Hangers on from the 'Bennite' era which everyone 'knew' that Labour would never return to. They can't have been prepared for it but have done remarkably well given all the shit that has been thrown at them. JM is the brains behind the operation.

Here is info about what McDonnell wants to do.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/28/john-mcdonnell-plan-transform-britain-labour-brexit
If that is true that 18% genuinely believe there’s a plan to make us a Muslim majority country, then what’s left of my hope for this country is dead. That can’t be true, it just...can’t be.
We have a lot of rubbish people but that’s madness
And even if it is true I might just go full Brexiteer-style and refuse to believe it, surely surely Britain can’t have fallen to that level of...even stupidity doesn’t seem strong enough. They’re deranged.

And what can we even do about it? This fight against hate just seems like a lost cause. People just want to hate :(
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@AndrewtheAlu Current policy is to call for a general election if May's deal is voted down. If that is refused then they will call for a referendum. Problem is that its not in their hands to get a second ref because they are not in power. I have honestly no idea how this will play out but I also hope Brexit is cancelled.
@Burnley123 a general election seems like a bit of a long shot really though 😅 it looks pretty clear that labour would win that so there’s no way the government would give it to them.
I heard today (I think it was shelagh fogerty but I’m not sure) that if labour did support a 2nd referendum then with them, snp, Lib dems and current Tory remain rebels (and Caroline lucas lol) then they would have 51% but really that’s a bit of an ambitious prediction 😅 but there’s some hope for ya.
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@AndrewtheAlu I don't think a general election is a long-shot. I get your reasons and in normal times there is no reason for the Tories to agree to an election or a referendum but these are not normal times. If (as looks likely) May's Brexit deal is voted down in both readings; there will be a political deadlock in Parliament. If no Brexit deal can be voted through then eventually something has to give. What does give, I do not know because the situation is such a mess.
I don't think Brexit is necessarily what matters exactly. As was proven in Ukraine the extreme right benefits from any political chaos.
@Burnley123 Agreed. I am just pointing out that these nutters are good at capitalizing on any political mayhem even when on the surface it goes against their own interests and rhetoric. The Euro Maidan fiasco is a good example. Getting Ukraine into the EU does not exactly benefit a bunch of racist xenophobes but a week sock puppet for a president with their own people controlling the security services worked very well for them.
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow I think moves to get Ukraine in the EU is actually about extending NATO power. I hate Putin but I think if the West is serious about peace and security, we need to stay out of Russia's traditional area.
@Burnley123 Oh absolutely and NATO is just the US Foreign Legion. Anyone who thinks NATO members have sovereignty need their head examined. It is funny that no Western media will cover large anti NATO demonstrations in Eastern Europe. Most that are already members their political elite rammed it through whether they liked it or not. Then again that is also an EU tactic to keep having elections till they get the result they like. Honestly the only reason the UK was even given the option to leave is because they can fight back. Those that can't end up like Greece. As for Putin he has his problems but he is a far cry better then anyone the US thinks should be running the country. The US still idolize Yeltsin a gangster and a drunk. The Russian people are in a bad spot. Putin at least means stability. The US has rigged elections to prevent the communists from coming to power and their current leader is a joke. The people the US want in charge would bring Russia back tot he 90s where the vori v zakone ran the country. Then again when they did away with El Duce the Americans basically put the Mob in charge of Italy.
Writer · 100+, F
They will gain power if Brexit doesn’t happen. I believe this whole ordeal was due to a deep felt but often ignored fear of globalization. There are so many fears to be had: fear of losing control, losing identity, losing ones language, religion, values. It is not about muslims or immigration. It is about my tribe versus yours. Muslims are the jews in the 30’s. Muslims are the African Americans of 50’s... fear is an ugly creature. I hope one day we will learn to listen to each other.
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Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@kingkyri I was completely honest and even posted that Robinson claims to have left them behind. I could have posted that he was EDL founder and left it there and I would not have been lying. I added that he left because I think its fair to provide that context.

Personally, I don't think Tommy Robinson has changed that much from his EDL days and i think he's just more strategically clever. He has friends in Generation Identity and is supported by what is left of the EDL and the Football Lads Alliance. These are far-right hooligan groups.

I don't see good sides to him and I think he is playing a long-game to make far-right ideas acceptable.
Longleggedlady · 31-35, F
It is rubbish idea that is plainly going to be unworkable I for the record would back immediate cancelation of it
Robinson and co are bunch of naive idiots
Screws are turned to atop deal going through Parliament
Then as Corbyn and co found out with the no confidence thing they get turned the other way
MartinII · 70-79, M
Lies, lies, lies! Every economic expert does not think “hard” Brexit (what on earth does that mean?) will be a disaster. Do you read the tabloid press? The Daily Mail has been taken over by remainers, joining the Mirror. And you seem to have overlooked the possibility of a second referendum, disgracefully advocated by your bad loser friends but a serious option if Parliament rejects all attempts to deliver what the people voted for. Oh, and your sainted leader is a lifelong opponent of the EU. As to Fascists, isn’t one of their characteristics that they ignore what people voted for and impose their own will instead? Do wake up!
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@MartinII Wow that is angry. I sometimes read the Sun in my local greasy spoon.

[quoteAs to Fascists, isn’t one of their characteristics that they ignore what people voted for and impose their own will instead?][/quote]

Its a reasonable comment but the point is that what you voted for is impossible. Nobody can give you that. If it was possible then I would be against the second ref.
MartinII · 70-79, M
@Burnley123 Thanks. I acknowledge I was angry. But you haven’t the foggiest idea what I, or anyone else, voted for, except leaving the EU!
Northwest · M
The extremist leadership, will turn it into a dog whistle, no matter what scenario gets picked. Ultimately, this is what they want, not some well planned and executed solution.
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@Northwest It's not quite true. May is just out of her depth and Boris Johnson is an opportunist. The real ultras leg by Jacob Reece Mogg wants chaos because they want to remake the UK as Ayn Rand island. It's their gaming the system which paths the way for the far-right below.
Northwest · M
@Burnley123 What I meant by "this is what they want", is that they did not want it to succeed in the first place. Does not promote chaos, and chaos enables their platform.
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@Northwest I agree
Nyloncapes · 61-69, M
Burnley Brexit can not be cancelled , or this country could never ever spout of about this great country of ours being a democracy,as for the experts coming out with what they are, they were same experts tellings us before during referendum, that we would face a great recession, high unemployment , and our economy going down, within 3 months if we left, and experts told us we had to join and have the euro , glad we never listened to them on that, also no one can predict or know what is
going to happen thats a fact , but your post was a great read
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@Nyloncapes Some experts did but not all. That is NO reason to dismiss ALL expert advice as invalid. Which economic experts think that hard Brexit will end well? I can't find any.

We will never join the Euro. We stayed out of it for twenty years and there is no way we will join now.
@Nyloncapes Britain turned away from trade with the Commonwealth and joined the European Economic Community (EEC) long before there was a Euro.
Nyloncapes · 61-69, M
@Burnley123 yes dont dissmiss them all, but, this doesshow experts are not always right then, and also if they were experts , and did not agree with the other experts, this does show then no one can predict 100% or know what will happen its there opinions when it comes down to it,
firefall · 61-69, M
I agree - the RWNJ parties will be able to scream, The Tories have cheated us, AND It's all the fault of the Dirty Foreigners We Should Kick Out.
SmartKat · 56-60, F
That’s too bad. I hate to see the turn to the extreme right that too many countries are taking.
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@SmartKat I think we are a long way from a far-right government. Like you, we have a two-party system and the worry is that the Conservatives could be pushed over time into that territory like the US Republicans have.

Who knows though? If there is a hard-Brexit, then that could destroy political parties. The 90s corruption scandals of Italian politics destroyed their entire political class.
sounds VERY parallel to many thing here in the US

a world wide ignorant populist fascust movement?
CountScrofula · 41-45, M
Haha shit Burnley, I didnt' realize this was a necro'd post from a year and a half ago.
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@CountScrofula Lol. Someone else commented and you got a notification.
MrSimons · 41-45, M
Could you define "far-right?" It seems to be a term that is thrown around a lot lately. From what I have seen, a lot of people branded "far-right" are just fairly patriotic, traditional working class English people.
MrSimons · 41-45, M
@CountScrofula Yes, I have seen that quote before. I would say that Brexiteers (people like Nigel Farage) would be patriots rather than nationalists. They are concerned about preserving certain traditions.
CountScrofula · 41-45, M
@MrSimons What traditions are those?
MrSimons · 41-45, M
@CountScrofula It can mean all kinds of different things for different people. For some it really is about history and traditions. Some of these folks seem very fond of their English flag and celebrating festivals such as St Georges' Day. For some it can be expressed through traditional sports and their local communities. Traditional Christian values and family values form part of it for some. That's certainly an important aspect to me. Allegiance to the Monarch is certainly part of it for many. British legal principles such as the presumption of innocence are pretty key. That is something which should be defended at all costs.
jackjjackson · 61-69, M
“Dog dinner Brexit deal” great line Burnsie 😉
jackjjackson · 61-69, M
Cuts immigration
Increases economic strength
Retains national sovereignty


I can’t see anything wrong with that policy.
jackjjackson · 61-69, M
Does it feel like your leaders betrayed you? @NoSugar
NoSugar · 22-25, F
@jackjjackson who do you think my leaders are ?
jackjjackson · 61-69, M
No clue. You tell me please. @NoSugar
NoSugar · 22-25, F
what the fuck did the british think they would get out of the brexit... of course you would ruin yourself over it. you deserve what you chose
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@NoSugar Thanks hun.
jackjjackson · 61-69, M
Damn right. The establishment are trying to screw the populace yet again. Meanwhile you socialists side with the establishment. Lackeys 😉
The British Pound is about to tank. There's an opportunity to make money on this......

 
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