I Am Against Bullying
I am still against the LGBT community. I don't hate the people it's just that to God it's an abomination and I'm with him. Don't hate me for truly being right.
41-45, F
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CopperCicada · M
None of the Gospels mention homosexuality in any way. That's code for it wasn't an issue for Jesus. Or at least those who wrote those narratives.
Three verses in the letters of Paul mention it, Romans 1:26–27, 1 Corinthians 6:9–10, and 1 Timothy 1:9–10. The interpretation hinges on three words in Koine Greek: [i]arsenokoites[/i], [i]malakos[/i], and [i]porneia[/i]. Nobody really seems to know what these words definitively mean. Why? Because one has to bore down into the sexual life of a foreign culture 2000+ years old. They seem to relate to pederasty, prostitution, and generally immoral sex. If you're a fucked up person you'll conflate these with consensual sex between adults-- now or in ancient times.
As for Jude 1:7, this refers to a desire for "strange flesh", [i]sarkos heteras[/i]. This has been interpreted as wanting to get it on with angels. Yea. Leave the angels alone. Of course if you've got issues you'll project anything onto it.
Of course one can fall back on Old Testament law. That's always fun. 76 things are banned in Leviticus. Unless someone lives like an Orthodox Jew and keeps them all, picking and choosing is a little questionable. Leviticus 19:19 prohibits wearing clothes with two kinds of fabrics mixed together. We're all screwed right there with cotton-polyester blends. I'm screwed because of shrimp. In the end I thought the whole point was that Christ put an end to his Mosaic law, so falling back to pick and choose is a little sketchy.
So I'm glad you're super clear about it all. That rocks. My reading of scripture is probably wrong, but I tend to not find anything that makes me think of other people's genitals.
Three verses in the letters of Paul mention it, Romans 1:26–27, 1 Corinthians 6:9–10, and 1 Timothy 1:9–10. The interpretation hinges on three words in Koine Greek: [i]arsenokoites[/i], [i]malakos[/i], and [i]porneia[/i]. Nobody really seems to know what these words definitively mean. Why? Because one has to bore down into the sexual life of a foreign culture 2000+ years old. They seem to relate to pederasty, prostitution, and generally immoral sex. If you're a fucked up person you'll conflate these with consensual sex between adults-- now or in ancient times.
As for Jude 1:7, this refers to a desire for "strange flesh", [i]sarkos heteras[/i]. This has been interpreted as wanting to get it on with angels. Yea. Leave the angels alone. Of course if you've got issues you'll project anything onto it.
Of course one can fall back on Old Testament law. That's always fun. 76 things are banned in Leviticus. Unless someone lives like an Orthodox Jew and keeps them all, picking and choosing is a little questionable. Leviticus 19:19 prohibits wearing clothes with two kinds of fabrics mixed together. We're all screwed right there with cotton-polyester blends. I'm screwed because of shrimp. In the end I thought the whole point was that Christ put an end to his Mosaic law, so falling back to pick and choose is a little sketchy.
So I'm glad you're super clear about it all. That rocks. My reading of scripture is probably wrong, but I tend to not find anything that makes me think of other people's genitals.
SW-User
@CopperCicada So Jesus didn't mention bestiality, incest, or rape. Does this mean those issues are a code that it wasn't an issue for Jesus? Hogwash! Jesus followed the Mosaic Law ("I came not to destroy, but to fulfill the law".) Just because the gospels might be silent on a moral issue does not mean that they are in support of it.
CopperCicada · M
@SW-User legit.
which is why i mentioned the other verses and the specific meanings of four terms in koine greek.
and i think my comment on leviticus stands. nothing like having a cheese burger or eating shrimp or oysters as somebody tells you homosexuality is forbidden in leviticus.
which is why i mentioned the other verses and the specific meanings of four terms in koine greek.
and i think my comment on leviticus stands. nothing like having a cheese burger or eating shrimp or oysters as somebody tells you homosexuality is forbidden in leviticus.
EnjoyingLife · 61-69, F
@CopperCicada Wow, you have too much time on your hands.
bijouxbroussard · F
@EnjoyingLife The OP had time enough to post what she did.
SW-User
@CopperCicada What is the normative understanding of human sexuality within the history of Judaism and Christianity up until the mid 20th century? What is the understanding of human sexuality when Paul wrote the epistles?
The understanding of human sexual relations was between a man and woman within the marriage relationship. This is why the writer of Hebrews writes to keep the marriage bed pure and undefiled. (Heb. 13:4).
Do not put 21st understandings of sexuality upon the Biblical texts. You are then doing eisegesis and not exegesis.
The understanding of human sexual relations was between a man and woman within the marriage relationship. This is why the writer of Hebrews writes to keep the marriage bed pure and undefiled. (Heb. 13:4).
Do not put 21st understandings of sexuality upon the Biblical texts. You are then doing eisegesis and not exegesis.
bijouxbroussard · F
Persephone · 51-55, F
@bijouxbroussard I want to high five you for that comment. Oh yeah. ✋
CopperCicada · M
@SW-User first, i have to say i respect your comments.
regarding biblical exegesis-- that is something outside my pay grade. i seek out people who are educated in these things and i am their student.
i believe their analysis as i have studied the classics. and there the spectrum of human sexuality was far broader than "marriage between a man and a woman". it pretty much has been everywhere, anywhere, throughout history. that is the anthropological and historical record.
what do [i]arsenokoites[/i], [i]malakos[/i], and [i]porneia[/i] mean in the minds of the authors of the new testament? quite honestly-- i don't know. i can say "don't know" with complete certainty as i am a writer and often nuance contemporary meanings of words in the 21st century as i feel fit, to communicate my meaning. it's possible that the intention was the accepted meaning of those terms around the time of christ. it's possible there is another nuance specific to the authors of the new testament. whatever the meaning is-- it's not in the KVJ. it's in the koine.
so i'm good with "don't know".
what i'm not good with is 100% certainty that "god hates fags".
for me personally, it's irrelevant. i'm happily married (to a woman) for 21 years next week. when somebody tells me they are gay it's about as relevant to my life as them telling me they have a dachshund. [i]oh, ok.[/i]
regarding biblical exegesis-- that is something outside my pay grade. i seek out people who are educated in these things and i am their student.
i believe their analysis as i have studied the classics. and there the spectrum of human sexuality was far broader than "marriage between a man and a woman". it pretty much has been everywhere, anywhere, throughout history. that is the anthropological and historical record.
what do [i]arsenokoites[/i], [i]malakos[/i], and [i]porneia[/i] mean in the minds of the authors of the new testament? quite honestly-- i don't know. i can say "don't know" with complete certainty as i am a writer and often nuance contemporary meanings of words in the 21st century as i feel fit, to communicate my meaning. it's possible that the intention was the accepted meaning of those terms around the time of christ. it's possible there is another nuance specific to the authors of the new testament. whatever the meaning is-- it's not in the KVJ. it's in the koine.
so i'm good with "don't know".
what i'm not good with is 100% certainty that "god hates fags".
for me personally, it's irrelevant. i'm happily married (to a woman) for 21 years next week. when somebody tells me they are gay it's about as relevant to my life as them telling me they have a dachshund. [i]oh, ok.[/i]
SW-User
I don't ascribe to the "God hates fags" mentality.
I do believe that we are all sinners (myself included) who are only saved by the mercy of God through His son Jesus Christ.
I understand others believe differently and live in light of that.
Yes the New Testament was written when society at large had different views and opinions of sexuality. However the Biblical ethos calls for purity and holiness. Many fall, but it is still the goal.
Peace.
I do believe that we are all sinners (myself included) who are only saved by the mercy of God through His son Jesus Christ.
I understand others believe differently and live in light of that.
Yes the New Testament was written when society at large had different views and opinions of sexuality. However the Biblical ethos calls for purity and holiness. Many fall, but it is still the goal.
Peace.
CopperCicada · M
@SW-User legit. respect.
i live in the middle of the rural south. gay people form less than 2% of the american population. homosexuality became the subject of more than 20-30% of the sermons in the last congregation i attended.
as i dig into that, i wonder why.
there are so many ways to fall short with purity and holiness. there are so many ways to strive to live up to that.
when i sat down with people who could read the koine it made less sense to me.
but that's just me. but i've been repeatedly told i have place at the table of christ, so so be it.
i live in the middle of the rural south. gay people form less than 2% of the american population. homosexuality became the subject of more than 20-30% of the sermons in the last congregation i attended.
as i dig into that, i wonder why.
there are so many ways to fall short with purity and holiness. there are so many ways to strive to live up to that.
when i sat down with people who could read the koine it made less sense to me.
but that's just me. but i've been repeatedly told i have place at the table of christ, so so be it.