Excuses excuses and excuse

Most of us can agree that r*pe and slavery are egregious and abhorrent things, so why do christians make every excuse for laws where such things are permitted (ie Deuteronomy 21:10-14 and Leviticus 25: 44-46) they will make any and every excuse for these verses and not see how psychotic their arguments are.

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BibleData · M

@Khonsu

insults

Fairness is very important to me. If someone were to disrespect to me like an evil little creep I respond accordingly. It doesn't matter to me what your beliefs or lack thereof are. I respond to whatever you say, but in kind. I don't believe saying someone is ignorant of something is an insult. We are all ignorant of many things, so it wasn't my intent to insult.

You claim that the Bible doesn’t promote any of theses and it records history. Christians throughout history and the people whose entire cultures have been destroyed would definitely disagree with you on that.

So you say, but they would be wrong; abusus non tollit usum (Latin: misuse does not remove use). My argument here wouldn't necessarily be that what you are suggesting isn't true, but rather that it shouldn't have been. It isn't the fault of the Bible or it's writers that it has been abused due to ignorance. And it most certainly has been and continues to be to this day. The Bible wasn't written for us specifically, it was written for the people in a specific time and place. The people it was addressing. To Adam, to Moses, To Judges, Prophets, ancient Israel and early Christians to name a few. To those who adhere by it, it is a warning example. (1 Corinthians 10:11; Romans 15:4; Jude 1:7) The Law of Moses applied only to ancient Israel until the messiah. Christians were to obey the laws of their respective countries as if they were God's law unless those laws were contrary to God's actual laws. Of course, that goes for rape and slavery. So, the cultures of which you speak - which were destroyed by Biblical principles - are responsible for their laws.

It's you that are blaming the Bible for your sociopolitical frustration with the tyranny disguised as theocracy? That's pretty much the norm for militant atheist ideologues. Like all ideologues they would simply replace current tyranny with their own. It doesn't matter if it's God and the Bible or anything else. The true Christian is no part of the world, but there are very few true Christians.

What this means in the case of slavery is that if it's legal in the country you live in then it's acceptable to God for you to have slaves. If it's illegal to have slaves in the country you live then it isn't acceptable to God. In the case of ancient Israel it was acceptable to God. As for you, you wouldn't have to have slaves if you find it, like I find it, objectionable, even if it were acceptable to God, but at the same time you haven't the merit or the authority to make that call for anyone else unless you make the laws in the country you live. Since every single human being alive on earth has enslaved and been enslaved it's somewhat hypocritical and myopic of you to protest. That's more about virtue signaling and groupthink. It may seem morally or politically correct or not at any given point throughout history, which means you would be likely to just go along with whatever was the norm. So your objection doesn't impress me, especially when it isn't very well thought out.

This law was for Hebrews only.

See? Not very well thought out. What about Joseph and his brothers? Was the law for them? Abraham? Peter? Paul? Also, what was the law regarding non-Israelites on the matter?

Khonsu · 26-30, M

@BibleData “ Fairness is very important to me. If someone were to disrespect to me like an evil little creep I respond accordingly”

First off, the tone of your very first reply comes off as condescending and what’s insane to me that you’re virtue signaling fairness when you’re the one that has been butchering quotes and taking things out of context.

Case in point

“ See? Not very well thought out. What about Joseph and his brothers? Was the law for them? Abraham? Peter? Paul? Also, what was the law regarding non-Israelites on the matter?”

This right here let’s me know that you we’re definitely not worth my time. You couldn’t even fully quote me💀.

You claim “Before the common era war, poverty and crime were the factors which reduced people to slavery. Captives of war were sold into slavery (2 Kings 5:2; Joel 3:6). If a person became poor they could sell themselves and their children into slavery to pay indebtedness. (Leviticus 25:39, 47; 2 Kings 4:1) and a person found guilty of thievery who was unable to compensate was sold for slavery to pay for the things he stole, regaining his freedom once the amount was paid in full. (Exodus 22:3)”
You left out the context that this only applied to Hebrews you left out what the rest of Leviticus 25 said
44“‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 45You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 46You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.

I pointed out that the version of slavery you’re selling was for Israelites only while showing what happened to non-Israelites. See? Not very well thought out was it? How in the world did you think this was a good idea? Also I raise you one question, since you want to argue slavery in ancient Israel was acceptable to god. What made owning people morally acceptable?

“ It's you that are blaming the Bible for your sociopolitical frustration with the tyranny disguised as theocracy? That's pretty much the norm for militant atheist ideologues. Like all ideologues they would simply replace current tyranny with their own. It doesn't matter if it's God and the Bible or anything else. The true Christian is no part of the world, but there are very few true Christians.”

What is even the point to even replying to you people when you’re willing to sink this low EVERY SINGLE TIME these subjects are brought up. Most of you preach so much about accountability but can’t apply that to yourselves. Your beliefs are by definition tyranny. If your religions stems from a book where it’s main deity makes laws on who and how to enslave people, has easily abused rape laws and then is willing to put souls into eternal torment because you either didn’t worship him right or you don’t fuck with it. Why is it that the Christian majority states are the most oppressive places to live in? Violent crimes, voter suppression, example after example of Christians sadistically enjoying the suffering of people who are like you. And while I can wholeheartedly agree that there a very few “true Christians” at the the end of the day these people still worship your deity, they preach about your deity, they spread the word about your deity, and don’t even for one minute think to consider yourself (someone who’s been disingenuous and misquoting me throughout this entire exchange) a true practitioner of the teachings of the christos. You are no different from the rest of the rest of the npcs.