Do you believe in God? [Spirituality & Religion]

@LeopoldBloom He is Eternal obviously. Something has to be eternal and we can see that the universe is not.

@LeopoldBloom Very doubtful statement.

@hippyjoe1955 How can you say the universe is not?

@Elessar Red Shift. It you trace the movement of the stars it indicates that the universe had a beginning. You do follow science don't you?

@hippyjoe1955 No, red shift only says it's expanding lol, or are you admitting the big bang theory? I thought you believed we were all born from two men and a serpent..

@Elessar So it suddenly changed direction? For no reason? If it is expanding it came from smaller if you keep going back it becomes what Big Bang postulates as the singularity. Do try to keep up child. Science is not that hard. Logic may be beyond your ken but this is pretty basic stuff. The universe had a starting point.

@hippyjoe1955 Oh, I studied all that stuff, don't worry for me. What amazes me is that you've become a man of science now, lol. What about the Genesis and the world/universe being created in seven days?

@Elessar I was doing science long before you were born son. Maybe you should try to learn to reason rather than make a fool of your self all the time. So if the universe had a beginning what was before it?

@hippyjoe1955 Yeah, I believe it. If you have a scientific background after proving yourself incapable of understanding the very same basic concept after having it explained to you 4+ times you either got your degree from a bag of chips or you're the umpteenth MSc from YouTube, or something f*cked your brain somewhere in the process.

No one knows what was before. Neither me, neither you.

@Elessar Because God tell us that everything visible is temporal and unseen is eternal, and we know it’s true since all material deteriorate! God is unseen! He is a spirit!

@Elessar So what could have caused the incredibly complex and carefully tuned universe in which we live? A cosmic accident?

@Carazaa Unseen by definition can't be observed, hence it might even be non-existant from all what we know.

@Elessar Nope!

@hippyjoe1955 You don't know, and neither do I. Randomness, a higher civilization running a simulation, a creator, an abnormality, an upper dimension we don't know of? There are many plausible hypotheses, and none proven or more likely than the others so far.

@Elessar So if I flip a coin a trillion times and every time it comes up heads what are the odds? Care to make a bet on a game that is so obviously rigged?

@hippyjoe1955 Non-zero. Especially if you can retry infinite sequences of trillion flippings, which considering the vastity and age of the universe, might be possible for it and yet unimaginable for us.

@Elessar So in the age of the universe there have been 1 E+17 seconds. In the known universe there are 1 E+90 atoms. The odds of forming 1 single cell is
1 E+42,000. There isn't enough time or matter in the universe that this could happen by accident. Now let us do a little more math shall we? The Earth is about 4 billion years old. Life has been on this earth for 3.5 - 3.8 billion years. Suddenly that time line you seem to think as infinite has become very very short. That miraculous first cell spontaneously generated itself in about 200 million years. Now let us assume that that first cell was somehow able to form but how long would it have lived if the earth was not prime for its survival? After all you put a yeast into a bit of water add a bit of sugar and the next thing you know the yeast is dead from its own waste. Yet 3.5 billion years of life has somehow managed to recycle all of its waste in such a way as other life is sustained. Hmmmmm Accident or plan?

@hippyjoe1955 If you really knew anything about science you'd know how stupid that question is.

@Elessar As you know, that can be no before spacetime began.

@Sharon The only stupid question is the one not asked. Strange how you become so incurious when your favorite theory fails to answer the question isn't it.

@Sharon
And you have proof of that where?

@hippyjoe1955 actually, yeast won't die if you add sugar to it. It will consume the sugar and produce ethanol and CO2. It will remain dormant and still be able to produce CO2 if you add more sugar. This is homebrewing 101.

@basilfawlty89 Until it dies from lack of food and too much waste. Sorry but yeast is not a life form that can sustain itself without food to eat. Where does that food come from?

@hippyjoe1955 never claimed yeast is immortal, and obviously it requires food just as much as any open system does. Just saying you're wrong claiming that sugar will kill yeast.

@basilfawlty89 The point I made was that life forms are not self sufficient. They will die in their own waste and starve from their own inability to make or find food. They need other life forms in order to survive. A single cell as is imagined by neo darwinists won't live very long and will be dead long before it 'evolves' sufficiently to meet its other needs.