Do we need God for Morality? [Spirituality & Religion]

Obviously the secular answer is a resounding NO.
But if you're a theist who says "yes", i want to hear your reasoning.

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Abstraction · 61-69, M

I'm a theist who says no. Morality can be socially derived.

What's really interesting to me is -
1. how much our basic principles of right and wrong, in essence, can be agreed across cultures. (eg, human rights are pretty universal. Those who say 'it isn't part of our culture' are usually ruling class people.) Of course details differ here and there.
2. that this includes people who insist there is no morality - not during their third-glass-of-wine-party-discussion, but through their outrage when these 'wrong' things that don't exist are done to them.
3. how consistently all humans fail to live up to their own morality.
4. that the attempt to deal with guilt or psychological impact by rationalising behaviour, often doesn't stop the damage in terms of broken relationships, etc.
Whilst I'm a theist, I observed these same things as an agnostic.

Carazaa · F

@Abstraction I would agree that morality can be learned socially!

Pikachu

@Abstraction

Very well said. This ubiquity of certain fundamental moral concepts among cultures beyond and before the abrahamic religions seems to show that morality is not dependent on these religious teachings.

Abstraction · 61-69, M

@Pikachu This universality can be consistent with both agnostic view and Christian view. It was this exploring this puzzle (in a lot more depth) that was one of the reasons CS Lewis embraced Christianity.

I think lots of christians only half understand the arguments and try to argue that there's no basis for morality apart from God. Demonstrably wrong. The full argument though, is interesting.

Pikachu

@Abstraction

It is interesting. I've watched a few debates on this subject and it appears usually to come down to whether there can be an objective standard for morality that we should care about.
Of course this question is not actually answered by saying that a god is the standard.