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This Is Coming Soon [Spirituality & Religion]

Prophesy Of Revelation 8

8 When the Lamb opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven for about half an hour. 2 Then I saw the seven angels who stand before God, and seven trumpets were given to them. 3 And another angel came and stood at the altar with a golden censer, and he was given much incense to offer with the prayers of all the saints on the golden altar before the throne, 4 and the smoke of the incense, with the prayers of the saints, rose before God from the hand of the angel. 5 Then the angel took the censer and filled it with fire from the altar and threw it on the earth, and there were peals of thunder, rumblings,[a] flashes of lightning, and an earthquake.

6 Now the seven angels who had the seven trumpets prepared to blow them.

7 The first angel blew his trumpet, and there followed hail and fire, mixed with blood, and these were thrown upon the earth. And a third of the earth was burned up, and a third of the trees were burned up, and all green grass was burned up.

8 The second angel blew his trumpet, and something like a great mountain, burning with fire, was thrown into the sea, and a third of the sea became blood. 9 A third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed.

10 The third angel blew his trumpet, and a great star fell from heaven, blazing like a torch, and it fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water. 11 The name of the star is Wormwood.[b] A third of the waters became wormwood, and many people died from the water, because it had been made bitter.

12 The fourth angel blew his trumpet, and a third of the sun was struck, and a third of the moon, and a third of the stars, so that a third of their light might be darkened, and a third of the day might be kept from shining, and likewise a third of the night.

13 Then I looked, and I heard an eagle crying with a loud voice as it flew directly overhead, “Woe, woe, woe to those who dwell on the earth, at the blasts of the other trumpets that the three angels are about to blow!”

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LeopoldBloom · M

That passage is a metaphor for the political situation of the time. The writer couldn't come out and say anything about the Roman government directly, so he expressed it in poetic terms.

Also, has anyone noticed that it's written in the past tense? This isn't a "prophecy" of something in the future; it's a description of something in the past.

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GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]This isn't a "prophecy" of something in the future; it's a description of something in the past.[/quote]

John only wrote what he saw in the vision of the end times even though he wrote it in past tense.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 He wrote it in the past tense because it had already happened.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]He wrote it in the past tense because it had already happened.[/quote]'

If that was case, we'd be living on the new earth without death, or sorrow, or illnesses, or pain, or suffering. Everyone of would have eternal life in paradise which God promises at the end of the book.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 That part is fictional, like most of the rest of the Bible.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]That part is fictional, like most of the rest of the Bible.[/quote]

Convince me.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 Actually, you're the one making the extraordinary claim that a book of mythology is true, so it's on you to convince me.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

A better description of the Bible is historically-based fiction. For example, there was an Ancient Egypt, but there is zero evidence that the Ancient Hebrews were ever slaves there. The Egyptians kept very good records, and if any of those stories were true, we would expect to find accounts from them.

Also, there is no way a woman could be made from a man's rib, snakes can't talk, and it would be impossible to keep every animal species on earth alive in a wooden boat for 40 days.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]Actually, you're the one making the extraordinary claim that a book of mythology is true, so it's on you to convince me.[/quote]

I take it then, you have nothing to convince me that the Word of God is a fairy tale? I thought so. Get used to the fact that the Word of God is the actual truth.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 Prove it.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]Prove it.[/quote]

Why? You already did a good job of it yourself. Why do you need me to prove it to you again?

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 OK, please explain how Noah collected animals from all over the world, including Australia (which is an island), and kept them alive on the ark for 40 days. Then explain how we see genetic diversity in every species inconsistent with all of them being descended from only a few breeding pairs.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]OK, please explain how Noah collected animals from all over the world[/quote]

God brought them to him. Read it for yourself.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 That's not an answer. That's just saying "you must not ask that question."

OK, please explain the specific mechanism by which God created the universe. I'm expecting the same level of detail that you would find in an astronomy textbook discussing star formation. Then you can tell us exactly where heaven and hell are located.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]That's not an answer.[/quote]

How's that not an answer? You asked how Noah got all those animals and I answered you.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 "Goddidit" is an answer, just not a satisfying one. I asked [i]how[/i] it happened, not for you to simply claim that it [i]did[/i] happen.

Please explain the exact mechanism. Did God pick them up by the scruff of the neck? How did he move them at the required speed without terrifying them? How did Noah manage to feed all of them, and keep the carnivores from eating the prey animals? Since they came from vastly different ecosystems, how were the varying requirements for sunlight, humidity, and other factors handled?

If your answer is "it was a miracle," I hope you can see how a non-believer would find that unsatisfying, and even ridiculous. Like asking a mechanic how your car works, and his answer is "because it does."

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]"God did it" is an answer, just not a satisfying one.[/quote]

God is not a man that He is capable of lying in His Word (Holy Bible). If you're going to tell me that men wrote the Word of God, you're half right. As the Scripture says,

16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for [c]instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work. 2 Timothy 3:16 & 17

It also says,

19 [i]And so we have the prophetic word confirmed, which you do well to heed as a light that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts; 20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private [j]interpretation, 21 for prophecy never came by the will of man, but [k]holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. 2 Peter 1:19-21

So, don't take my word for it, take His.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 I've read the Bible, and came to a very different conclusion than you did.

Putting aside whether God is lying or not, I asked you for an explanation of a specific mechanism. If you don't know the answer, then just admit it.

It makes more sense that the Noah's Ark story is a fictional account. Even aside from the impossibility of moving that many animals and keeping them alive for that long, the observed genetic diversity among living species is greater than would be possible with that number of ancestors. Not to mention, there isn't enough water on earth for it to rain worldwide for 40 days.

So if the Bible is fictional there, it could be fictional everywhere. Certainly all of the "miracles" are fictional as we never observe them today.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]I've read the Bible, and came to a very different conclusion than you did[/quote]

There's only one interpretation of the Word of God (Holy Bible) and that belongs to Him since He wrote it. No man can accurately interpret the Word of God accurately unless the Spirit of God dwells within him.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 So you can’t interpret it either?

You haven’t offered any proof that “the spirit of God” dwells within you, or even that it is a real thing.

The solution is very simple. Bring God into this discussion and give him an opportunity to clarify what he meant, since as the author, he’s the only one qualified to interpret it. His failure to appear can only mean that he doesn’t exist, or doesn’t care what we think.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]So you can’t interpret it either?[/quote]

I have the Spirit of God dwelling within me so I can interpret His Word more accurately. You can too if you give yourself half a chance.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 No, you just [i]think[/i] you have “the spirit of God” dwelling in you, because you have a very high opinion of yourself. And I’m no more capable of choosing to believe in God than you are of choosing to believe in the Church of Scientology. One of the most pernicious lies that religious people promote is that belief in God is subject to free will.

If you disagree, prove it by [b]not[/b] believing in God for the next five minutes. Let me know how successful you are.

If you can’t do what you’re demanding that I do, that makes you a hypocrite, sir.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]No, you just think you have “the spirit of God” dwelling in you[/quote]

Wrong, I know without a shadow of a doubt that He dwells within me. As far as I know, you and I have never met before I was saved. I was way out of control back then and I've never been in more control than I am now and not of my own volition but His will done in me.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 Many people's lives are improved by joining a spiritual community. For example, the Nation of Islam has reformed many hardened criminals. That doesn't mean it's a valid belief system.

Other people, like me, experienced an improvement by [b]leaving[/b] a spiritual community. Not that you're interested - you don't see me as a human being; you only consider me a "problem" that you want to convert so you can boast to your friends at church how you "saved another atheist."

Your personal experience doesn't apply to everyone else, and your belief that it does is just another example of your incredible arrogance and self-importance. You actually believe that you are the designated spokesman for the most powerful (imaginary) being in the universe. That would be a form of mental illness if it wasn't shared by so many people.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]Many people's lives are improved by joining a spiritual community. For example, the Nation of Islam has reformed many hardened criminals. That doesn't mean it's a valid belief system.[/quote]

Religion had nothing to do with my reformation, I assure you.

Harriet03 · 41-45, F

@GodSpeed63 Neither do facts!!!

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@Harriet03 [quote]Neither do facts!!![/quote]

Facts concerning what? Here are some facts for you: I was dead and now I live, I was lost and now I'm found, I was blind, and now I see, and I was deaf, and now I hear.

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