We had to start from someplace. The universe may be old but it had a beginning so where did that come from? We are matter but matter is energy condensed so perhaps all matter and the universe is just a dream. We are all just a dream. And the dreamer is God.
The universe is a reality and it's temporary. God is The Creator. We were created for a purpose that goes beyond this world. There is a life after death and we should live our life according to God's terms to enter Paradise, which is permanent.
I think Gods terms are pretty loose if one takes the New testament seriously. But the idea of immortality and a heaven are difficult for me to take seriously. If you never see a valley how do you appreciate the peaks? If everyone is together how do they get along? Memories are mortal. We easily loose them. What are we without them?
@Tastyfrzz: The fact that we didn't have a choice in when we were born and we will not have a choice in when we will die indicates that there's much more to this world than just eat, drink, go to work, sleep.. then wake up again and repeat the same routine over and over again. No matter how much we earn in this life, it all will come to an end, so our work will be for nothing. There's a purpose for our creation that gives meaning to every action we do on this earth.
And since you mentioned dreams, there are dreams that come true, don't you think that this is a clear sign that this life is controlled by a Higher Power?
@Madeleine: I'm not sure that I would say it is "controlled" by a higher power as he seems to be deaf to some pretty big things. Such as the seven million of his chosen people who were annilated by the Nazis in WWII. Didn't tell me they didn't pray. Someone said if God is good then he is not great, but if he is great then he is not good. I tend to think that God is both and neither. The Ying and yang concept. Light and dark. It is interesting that the further man explores with his telescopes, antennae and mathematics the bigger and stranger it all seems to be. It's like it is anticipating our desires and expanding accordingly. There are things like black holes that leave our dimensions completely so we cannot even as yet comprehend what the universe really is. To illustrate this get some of those 3D wood puzzles and try to put them together. Your mind will be twisted by the time you are done. Now imagine how twisted your or my mind has to be to understand God. I can not do it.
Yes, I have. It's been a while. Also, some of the writings of the Buddha and I did start the book of Mormon and Ron Hubbard's Dianetics but both were to fictitious to merit wasting my time on them. I have also read the Bible cover to cover several times. I have also examined Mithraism, the Dead Sea scrolls, the lost Gospels and I have listed to and watched and read many of the courses on religion by Bart ehrman, and the books and lectures by Spong.
One life time is not enough to grasp all of the thought that man has put into relious texts. Codes and alagories and many other tools as well as downright changes have been included in them so as to serve the agendas of the day. You must remember that until recently the magic of "reading" was reserved only for the high end of society. Religion was one means of controlling the people. The Catholic Church made people pay money to avert purdition
@Tastyfrzz: I like your sense of curiosity to read all of these books. But since you read the Quran, what did you find appealing in it? And which part that did not make sense to you?
The idea of one God instead of the three in one makes more sense to me, as does the gratitude to God for our existence. But it is an ancient text filled with the rough survival skills of the desert. It is misogynistic in some ways by our standards now, blood thirsty and unforgiving, Jesus would shake the dust off his sandals of unbelievers, Mohammed preached of murder There are some issues.
@Tastyfrzz: I appreciate your answer. What made sense to you in the Quran is actually the essence of the message of the Quran.
The Quran was revealed to Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) throughout 23 years. A lot of events happened during that time and Muslims were attacked by non-believers.. a lot of verses came down to encourage Muslims to hold on to their faiths and defend themselves. I don't see why this is a negative point. It's not "blood thirsty" when after every verse that talks about fighting, God would command Muslims to seek peace if their enemies seek peace as well.
[Quran 8:60-61] [quote]And prepare against them all the power you can muster, and all the cavalry you can mobilize, to terrify thereby God’s enemies and your enemies, and others besides them whom you do not know, but God knows them. Whatever you spend in God’s way will be repaid to you in full, and you will not be wronged. [b]But if they incline towards peace, then incline towards it, and put your trust in God. He is the Hearer, the Knower.[/b][/quote]
Believing in God doesn't make you passive, but a game changer. It's not "blood thirsty", but a message for justice.
[sep]
What are your standards now regarding women? I am a woman. And women nowadays are required to become men to be considered "good enough". Islam gave women their full rights as women. Islam acknowledges that men and women are different, but equal in their value in society and in the sight of God.
[Quran 33:35] [quote]Muslim men and Muslim women, believing men and believing women, obedient men and obedient women, truthful men and truthful women, patient men and patient women, humble men and humble women, charitable men and charitable women, fasting men and fasting women, men who guard their chastity and women who guard, men who remember God frequently and women who remember—[b]God has prepared for them a pardon, and an immense reward.[/b][/quote]
And misogynistic you say?
[sep]
Unforgiving?
[Quran 39:53] [quote]Say: "O my Servants who have transgressed against their souls! Despair not of the Mercy of Allah: for [b]Allah forgives all sins: for He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.[/b][/quote]
[sep]
If the core message of the Quran (which is the most important aspect) makes sense to you, I believe you should give it more consideration, this is what I would expect from an intelligent man like yourself.
There are positive aspects to most religions but there are also negative ones. Hopefully someday they can be melded into a final form that filters out the unacceptable issues.
The Quran I'm sorry to say is a work of man like all religious texts are. The words are inspired perhaps but there are obviously human passions in them too. Nothing has ever been truly written by God, at least not in any form that we can understand yet. Not the Bible, not the Quran. They too, in time will be foegotten.just like the songs to Zeus and Osiris.
@Tastyfrzz: The more I study the Quran, the more I am convinced that this can never be a work of man. Just take try to study its remarkable structure. Allow me to give you an example of the ring compoition of the Quran.
Surah al-Baqarah, happens to be the longest chapter of the Quran and was revealed over a span of [b]over nine years[/b]. Surah Al-Baqarah consists of [b]286 verses[/b] and can be divided into [b]nine main sections based on theme/topic[/b] (verse numbers in parenthesis):
1. Faith vs. unbelief (1 – 20). 2. Allah’s creation and knowledge (21 – 39). 3. Deliverance of Law to Children of Israel (40 – 103). 4. Abraham was tested (104 – 141). 5. Ka’ba is the new qibla (142 – 152). 6. Muslims will be tested (153 – 177). 7. Deliverance of Law to Muslims (178 – 253). 8. Allah’s creation and knowledge (254 – 284). 9. Faith vs. unbelief (285 – 286).
[b]Re-arranging this list to fit into a ring composition:[/b]
[c=#359E00]A Faith vs. unbelief (1 – 20).[/c] [c=#008099]——–B Allah’s creation and knowledge (21 – 39).[/c] [c=#7700B2]—————-C Deliverance of Law to Children of Israel (40 – 103).[/c] [c=#800055]————————D Abraham was tested (104 – 141).[/c] ——————————–E Ka’ba is the new qibla (142 – 152). [c=#800055]————————D’ Muslims will be tested (153 – 177).[/c] [c=#7700B2]—————-C’ Deliverance of Law to Muslims (178 – 253).[/c] [c=#008099]——–B’ Allah’s creation and knowledge (254 – 284).[/c] [c=#359E00]A’ Faith vs. unbelief (285 – 286).[/c]
The coherence in the form of a ring composition is best illustrated in the diagram below:
If we examine the [b]9 sections[/b] we find that they contain [b]sub-ring compositions[/b]. So what we have is [b]rings within rings[/b]. I'd like to explain them in detail later if you want.
Here is a table showing parallels between the corresponding sections (the correspondences here are indicated horizontally):
A noteworthy point is that [b]the middle of Surah Al-Baqarah[/b], the 143rd verse, mentions an important turning point for the Muslims. This turning point was the change in qiblah, the direction of the daily prayers, from Jerusalem to Makkah. This represented a big test for the believers. We find the mention of this important turning point in [b]exactly the middle of the chapter[/b]. Moreover this verse even contains the word ‘[b]middle[/b]’!
Finally, it’s worth paying special attention to a particular verse of Surah al-Baqarah, the 255th verse known as ‘[b]Ayat al-Kursi[/b]’. This verse is considered the most excellent verse of the Quran, according to Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Its memorization is highly encouraged, and it just so happens that it too exhibits a ring composition:
Notice that the [b]middle[/b] of Ayat al-Kursi mentions ‘[b]before[/b]’ and ‘[b]after[/b]’ which could be yet another allusion to the mirroring of ring composition.
It’s worth highlighting that not only does Ayat al-Kursi contain its own ring composition, but it is also positioned as a sub ring within two larger rings – a concentric ring composition:
And all of this precise work was conveyed [b]VERBALLY[/b] by the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). It wasn't like he sat down with his pen and paper, no.. it was verbally in span of more than 10 years! (It's mind–boggling!) And you still believe that the Quran was work of a man?. (And this was just ONE of MANY example I could give you in detail). Plus, the Quran' structure is just one aspect that proof the Quran is indeed an absolute word of God.
[sep]
NOTE: The case study above was a work of Raymond K. Farrin, the author of [Surat al-Baqara: A Structural Analysis].
Here's a link to his book: http://www.academia.edu/8642515/Surat_al-Baqarah_A_Structural_Analysis
Here's a link to Surah al-Baqara: http://www.clearquran.com/002.html
