WestonTexan · 18-21, M
No.
If Israel has a right to exist, then so does Iran, and any other nation. But this "right to exist" is only ever stated of Israel, because it's used as a defense of the specific project of Zionism. A project I disagree with. So no, I do not believe in the "right" of the ethno-nationalist state of Israel to exist.
If Israel has a right to exist, then so does Iran, and any other nation. But this "right to exist" is only ever stated of Israel, because it's used as a defense of the specific project of Zionism. A project I disagree with. So no, I do not believe in the "right" of the ethno-nationalist state of Israel to exist.
Richard65 · M
The Talmud contains The Three Vows Argument: This perspective argues that God imposed three oaths on the Jewish people when they went into exile: not to force themselves back into the land, not to rebel against other nations, and not to hasten the redemption.
Rejection of Secular Zionism: Some Orthodox groups believe that creating a Jewish state by human power (secular Zionism) is a theological error and a rebellion against God, asserting that it should only happen in the messianic era,
So, many Jews themselves believe they shouldn't have a homeland because it is a sin against God. Of course, others interpret the Talmud differently, but it's not necessarily anti-Semitic to say they shouldn't have a homeland. Of course, those on the right don't think too deeply about such subjects. Knee-jerk reactions are their forte.
Rejection of Secular Zionism: Some Orthodox groups believe that creating a Jewish state by human power (secular Zionism) is a theological error and a rebellion against God, asserting that it should only happen in the messianic era,
So, many Jews themselves believe they shouldn't have a homeland because it is a sin against God. Of course, others interpret the Talmud differently, but it's not necessarily anti-Semitic to say they shouldn't have a homeland. Of course, those on the right don't think too deeply about such subjects. Knee-jerk reactions are their forte.
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emiliya · 26-30, F
@Convivial They are called the Shalosh Shavuot (Three Oathes). Richard got the third oath wrong, which is that nations should not oppress Israel too much. Rabbi Hanina came up with them and Rabbi Levi a further three. They were from Galilee. Not hasten the redemption is a fourth and fifth, not third, oath. In Midrash it is listed as six. You have Rabbi Yehuda and Rabbi Ze'era debating the oathes in the Talmud. The Talmud is like a book of priests talking about what is the right interpretation and what is the wrong interpretation, and often the interpretation is not from the Bible, but something a rabbi said.
Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you is a command given by Christ in Sermon on the Mount. Turn the other cheek also. Christ says no more eye for eye and tooth for a tooth. And if you are slapped in the right cheek, turn the other one also.
Love thy neighbor as thyself is a commandment given to Moses from God. Christ said it is one of the greatest commandments.
Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you is a command given by Christ in Sermon on the Mount. Turn the other cheek also. Christ says no more eye for eye and tooth for a tooth. And if you are slapped in the right cheek, turn the other one also.
Love thy neighbor as thyself is a commandment given to Moses from God. Christ said it is one of the greatest commandments.
PicturesOfABetterTomorrow · 41-45, M
BlueVeins · 26-30
It isn't the fault of the current generation of Israelis, that their nation was built upon the graveyard of native peoples. People should have a right to live where they were born, ideally, and the existence of an Israeli state in modern times makes sense in upholding that right.
However, Israel has, through its actions, chosen to make its existence incompatible with the existence of other nations and peoples in the Middle East. For that reason, it has lost its right to uphold itself as a political entity.
However, Israel has, through its actions, chosen to make its existence incompatible with the existence of other nations and peoples in the Middle East. For that reason, it has lost its right to uphold itself as a political entity.
Northwest · M
You present this as if the issue is theoretical.
It is not.
Just like any other nation, Israel exists.
What Israel does not have the right to do, is occupy the West Bank and wage a war of near extinction, directly through sustained carpet bombing and making living conditions impossible in Gaza.
It is not.
Just like any other nation, Israel exists.
What Israel does not have the right to do, is occupy the West Bank and wage a war of near extinction, directly through sustained carpet bombing and making living conditions impossible in Gaza.
Jackaloftheazuresand · 31-35, M
sree251 · 41-45, M
@Jackaloftheazuresand
This is a discussion forum. We come here to talk and express our views. What is wrong with you? If you want coffee, go to a coffee shop.
You've already been told or did you forget. Do the work yourself
This is a discussion forum. We come here to talk and express our views. What is wrong with you? If you want coffee, go to a coffee shop.
Jackaloftheazuresand · 31-35, M
@sree251 I don't jump into the weeds with adders. You get what you put out
hippyjoe1955 · 70-79, M
sree251 · 41-45, M
@hippyjoe1955
Israel is an invasive project for acquisition of territory by force. There has been no attempt at resolution till this day.
More than that is the abetting of this criminal behavior by the US and its western allies.
I object to its religious base and the inherent bigotries involved in that form of a country.
Israel is an invasive project for acquisition of territory by force. There has been no attempt at resolution till this day.
I also object to it stealing land and killing the owners of the land.
More than that is the abetting of this criminal behavior by the US and its western allies.
ididntknow · 56-60, M
Roundandroundwego · 61-69
@ididntknow Israel said to turkey that they're next, after Iran and Lebanon.
sree251 · 41-45, M
@Roundandroundwego
I don't how Israel can emerge intact when the smoke clears after the Iran war. China's Nostradamus aka Professor Jiang has his predictions:
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/weird-news/chinas-nostradamus-makes-eight-terrifying-36889300
Israel said to turkey that they're next, after Iran and Lebanon.
I don't how Israel can emerge intact when the smoke clears after the Iran war. China's Nostradamus aka Professor Jiang has his predictions:
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/weird-news/chinas-nostradamus-makes-eight-terrifying-36889300
SumKindaMunster · 56-60, M
MasterLee · 56-60, M
Yes of course. A no brainer.
Waveney · 41-45, M
Israel has the right to exist within the boundaries that were originally drawn up in 1947.
basilfawlty89 · 36-40, M
Roundandroundwego · 61-69
@basilfawlty89 bedlam lovers need chaos!
sree251 · 41-45, M
@basilfawlty89
A citizen is also a social construct. You can be a citizen of this country and a citizen of that country; and in the USA, you can be a citizen in another country. The UK takes the cake and allows citizenship in any country you want.
Do you think being a human being is biological and, therefore, not an artificial construct?
why? The nation state is a social construct. It's not biological, it simply exists due to the prevailing social contract at the time
A citizen is also a social construct. You can be a citizen of this country and a citizen of that country; and in the USA, you can be a citizen in another country. The UK takes the cake and allows citizenship in any country you want.
Do you think being a human being is biological and, therefore, not an artificial construct?
sree251 · 41-45, M
@Roundandroundwego
Conversation is getting heavy. Link below may be helpful.
[media=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtP-N9pqoKk]
define exist!
Conversation is getting heavy. Link below may be helpful.
[media=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtP-N9pqoKk]
MarkPaul · 26-30, M
Every nation with territorial rights is an artificial construct. Why start and stop with Israel?
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SumKindaMunster · 56-60, M
Pfft, all countries borders are an artificial construct.
Why are you singling out Israel?
Why are you singling out Israel?
emiliya · 26-30, F
@SumKindaMunster Israel is younger than my grandparents. And it is in the news every day.
SumKindaMunster · 56-60, M
Diotrephes · 70-79, M
turningthekeys · 31-35, F
Roundandroundwego · 61-69
No.
ididntknow · 56-60, M
jackjjackson · M
