Bases like RAF Fairford are a perfectly good example of the nonsense of the UK government on the war with Iran.

@SunshineGirl That is the legal fiction. The UK likes to pretend that unlike Germany or Japan that they are not occupied by the US military because they painted RAF over the front gate.

But the reality is they have zero say in what is going on on those bases.

And it does have alot to do with Iran because B1 bombers with 2000lb bombs have been flying out of "RAF" Fairford for weeks now.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow I didn't know that, but if they are legally USAF airbases that is consistent with the UK's refusal to allow its own bases to be used for offensive actions.

@Richard65 I think a bigger problem is that a foreign country can launch strategic bombers from the UK in a war the PM said he wants no part of and is forced to change his stance because he has no ability to do anything about it.

@SunshineGirl Technically on paper the are RAF bases but in practice the UK government has no control over what is going on on those bases and Starmer can say whatever he likes and he doesn't get a vote.

@SunshineGirl Fairford or Diego Garcia being British on paper and legally doesn't mean much if the British government has no control over what goes on from that territory and if the foreign occupants can start wars from your soil regardless of what UK government says or wants.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow that's not entirely true. Starmer CAN refuse permission for American bombers to take off from UK airbases and has already done that. He caved into domestic pressure and finally allowed a limited takeoff for "defensive" reasons only. The issue is Starmer's weakness in relenting, when he does retain the power to block US bombers from taking off from UK soil.

@Richard65 What he can do in theory is totally irrelevant. And they are already flying and bombing regardless of what he says which is why he moved the goalpost to this "defensive operations" nonsense because the alternative is admitting the UK has no control over what is supposed to be their territory.

Again, theoretical authority that the US can and has completely ignored is irrelevant.

@Richard65 What Starmer did was no different than Trump claiming he "allowed" China to buy Russian oil.

It is a desperate man pretending to authorize something he has no control over.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow he does have control over it. He just caved into pressure. A stronger leader would have continued to deny the Americans permission to take off. Starmer has that power. He just chose not to use it, which is a different issue.

@Richard65 Saying so doesn't make it so. The current events prove that he doesn't have control over anything.

He didn't cave to anything. He was simply forced to put his stamp of official approval on something that was done regardless without his input.

Again, whether he denied them permission or not is irrelevant because they were flying bombing sorties out of Fairford regardless of what he had to say about any of it.


He moved the goalpost because the alternative is admitting the uncomfortable truth that the US dictates the terms, not the UK.

We know those bombers were flying the entire time regardless of what the UK government had to say about it.

The fact some if the UK don't want to admit that they no longer matter on the world stage and the US just allows them to pretend to be relevant is why people like Starmer pretend their opinion still matters. Because the alternative is too hard for the national pride to admit.

Do you seriously think if Starmer said no he has any power to enforce that? You can't be that naive.

@Richard65 Starmer was likely told to piss off and that the USAF was going to fly bombers regardless and he could either pretend it was his idea or suffer the public embarrassment of it being official that the UK doesn't control those bases.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow I live here. The Ministry of Defence has to authorise any takeoff from UK soil of any foreign aircraft, including the USA and the PM has final authority. That's why he's Prime Minister. He carries ultimate authority. It doesn't really matter what you suspect. You're just wrong. Why do you think Trump was pissed off at us if he could just authorise takeoff of US planes himself? He was pissed because we wouldn't let him. I didn't vote for Starmer. But you're making a different argument. Starmer CAN block US flights. He's just a weak man who caved into domestic pressure here. Even now, he's not allowing full US autonomy to fly as they please. I know this. I live here. Starmer is being criticised by opposition parties because he WON'T allow the USAF to have free reign. He's literally getting shit for blocking them.

@Richard65 Again, you are obsessing about theoretical BS that only exists on paper. You have to be very very naive to believe that the PM has any power to enforce any of that.

Again, authority on paper is irrelevant when you have no ability to enforce it. It is not what I suspect. We have literal video footage from the base of bombers being loaded and flying off regardless of what Starmer had to say about it.

The reason why Trump was pissed off is because Starmer embarrassed him. Trump is all about ego.

The real bombers flying regardless of what Starmer had to say is what matters.

Again, theoretical authority on paper is irrelevant when you have no ability to enforce it.


Again, regardless of what he says the bombers are flying. And strategic bombers with 2000lbs bombs are not "defensive".

Again, authority only matters with what you have the ability to enforce. The idea that a quibbling British bureaucrat will physically ground American bombers is laughable on it's face.

Hate to break the news to you but the empire is long dead.

@Richard65 The only person embarrassing themselves is you. Even local UK media has made public the bombers have been flying non stop regardless of what your PM has to say. They even put up tarps along the fence line to try and hide what they were doing.

And I am sorry but for literally thousands of years authority is determined not by words on a paper but what you can enforce.

That has never changed. The fact that you want to live in a delusion about how the power dynamic works and pretend that you still live in the British Empire and still call the shots that is on you.

And yes. I live in Canada where the US military has for decades designated our entire country the jurisdiction of US Northern Command making our sovereignty irrelevant as official policy.

And the reality is we have zero ability to do anything about it.

Some of the things the US has done to us as "allies" over the years.

-threatened our government into shuttering our military aerospace industry and strong armed us into putting US nukes on our soil (which we had no control over too).

-conducted experiments on our people without even notifying our government let alone asking for permission.

Anyone who has served or knows anyone in the service here doesn't live under any delusions that this is an equal partnership.

@Richard65 To be clear I am not saying it is right. But the reality is even in alliances "might makes right." If you don't have the force to push back what your theoretically or legally have the authority to says about something doesn't matter.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow If a foreign country allows quarter to US forces whether their own forces are involved in the conflict or not then they are legitimate targets for retaliation.

It gets really messy when a country uses hospitals or places of worship or schools, etc to hide arms, combat forces, etc. While I would certainly hope that American forces haven’t stooped that low since I retired, well, considering this is tRUMP’s, Kegsbreath’s, and Bibi’s show I have my doubts…

@KunsanVeteran That is one thing.

But this is a base that on paper is an RAF base on the UK mainland that is being used to fly B1 B sorties. They have been doing so regardless of what the PM had to say about it and he had to move the goalpost to claim he authorized "defensive" actions or admit he has no say over US bombers flying out of what is supposed to be sovereign UK territory.

The reality is the USAF flying out of there, or Ramstein, or Okinawa are not asking permission first.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow of course it matters. You actually think the USAF can tell the Ministry of Defence and the PM what to do on UK soil? You're forcing a point with zero actual evidence. Bombers are flying on limited missions because Starmer allowed those and blocked others. Trump was pissed precisely because we wouldn't bow completely to him. Those are just the facts. You're in danger of becoming the kind of MAGA style conspiracy theorist I suspect you despise.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow Oh I absolutely realize that. But since they are doing it—even just allowing them to fly within you air space—that makes them legitimate targets.

Not the RAF’s fault—purely tRUMP’s & Kegsbreath’s—but they’re still fair game for Iran. It would be nice if Iran said we will take the moral high ground, but then other countries would use that same argument. They almost have to retaliate.

When tRUMP doesn’t follow the LOAC, his enemies won’t either.

@Richard65 Again. It is an UK base only in name. The UK doesn't decide what goes on on American bases anywhere in the world regardless of what the sign says. And just because you don't like the facts doesn't mean they are not facts.

Again, Starmer made a statement to save face. They were flying before he said anything about it. If pretending otherwise makes you feel better so be it.

Again. What Trump gets offended by is irrelevant. The planes were flying regardless.

I am not the one trying to pretend facts are not real to protect the honour of Starmer.

Reality doesn't care if it is proceduraly correct. The US military doesn't ask permission. Just like the British Empire before it didn't ask permission. Whether you like it or not is irrelevant.

@KunsanVeteran I am trying to explain to another person here that if Starmer tried to say no to bomber sorties out of the UK that Strategic Air Command is not just going to politely pack up and go home.

The reality of foreign policy is Starmer can play ball or get run over.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow Oh I get that. And you are correct. I experienced this in every one of my deployments and my overseas assignments in PACAF. Nothing short of completely ejecting the US forces from the country would suffice.