Do you believe Russia would have invaded Ukraine if Donald Trump was president at the time?

@22Michelle Back to the Wish.com Manchurian Candidate conspiracy theories.


This is just the end of the 30 year NATO march east. The US and NATO fucked around and now we are at the find out phase.

Trump is just desperately looking for a settlement so he can avoid a humiliation like the fall of Saigon or the fall of Kabul. No need for 3rd rate cold war thriller scripts.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow We get it. You love Trump and Putin.

@ItsMeMorgue Umm no. Not even close. I just deal with reality and facts not blind propaganda and fantasy.

I also don't pretend it is still 1982 and acknowledge the cold war ended.


But it is easy to ignore all inconvenient facts when you just scream "Russian propaganda" and don't actually have to engage any inconvenient facts and can just ignore reality.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow So then you're prepared to admit that Ukraine got screwed on the deal and basically had to hand over part of their territory to an expansionist empire.

@ItsMeMorgue They lost their entire sovereignty to an expansionist empire in 2014. The USA. But you are desperate to pretend otherwise because you clearly support empire as long as it is run out of Washington and Brusssels.

Then Zelensky agreed to be American cannon fodder and fight the Russians to the last Ukrainian for American interests. Choices have consequences. He will go down as the man who lost Ukraine selling them out to foreigners.

But don't worry. Zelensky an company will be evacuated on luxury private jets and play at being a "government in exile" and their great grand children can live off American, Canadian, or English tax dollars and pretend to rule a country they have never set foot on in a proud anti Russian tradition.

And the US and Canada will likely be a rat line for Ukrainian nazis again for the second time in 80 years.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow

@ItsMeMorgue So resorting to childish insults and doubling down on ideology over facts. And you clearly have no interest in discussing anything in good faith.

Got it.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow That's hilarious coming from you. I've watched people post multi-paragraph essays outlying why you're wrong in supporting this invasion, and you just dismiss them by calling them stupid little kids who think the cold war is still on. There's no such thing as discussing anything with you in good faith.

Edit: autocorrect being weird.

@ItsMeMorgue It's actually much worse than you think. Here's a timeline of @PicturesOfABetterTomorrow's pro-Russia arguments since the invasion began.

1. Russia isn't going to invade Ukraine.
2. Okay, Russia is invading Ukraine, but it's just temporary. Ukraine has a Nazi problem. They'll be out of there in a couple of weeks.
3. Okay, I guess they'll be there a little longer. I don't know what Putin is doing. He's crazy, and anybody who accurately predicted he would do exactly what he's doing is a big dummy head who indulges in Cold War fantasies.
4. Ukraine didn't count as a real country anyway, so it's not an invasion.
5. Russia never invaded Ukraine. It's your imagination.

@LordShadowfire Straight up lying and slandering me again I see.

The first point is the only one that is partly true.

And I admitted I got that wrong something you are completely incapable of.

@LordShadowfire Lets deconstruct your lies about yet again because you make the same ones over and over again.

1. In Feb 2022 it didn't seem likely Russia would cross the border. For one it was not an invasion force. 150 000 is barely enough to take a medium sized city as the war has shown. It is a good size for a show of force though which is what happened.

The other reason I did not think Russia would enter Ukraine is because people like you would use it as a pretext for claiming Russia is Hitler and taking over the world. Which I was right about. You are evidence of that hysteria.

It also seemed unlikely because Russian intelligence is perfectly capable of a counter coup without a war.

Based on all the evidence at hand a direct confrontation seemed the least likely. Being a civilian I don't have access to the same information as a world leader so there were factors that came out later that changed that.

And unlike you I am capable of admitting I misread a situation.

This is also around the same time Angela Merkel and Francois Holland both admitted they never had any intentions of honouring the Minsk agreements sending a message to Russia that yet again any treaty with the west is not worth the paper it is printed on.

Things like that change the calculation.

2.

Russia did cross the border and as predicted it was a show of force. That is why you had airshow type shit like daytime paratrooper drops.

It would have also been temporary because Zelensky and the Russians were negotiating a peace settlement in Istanbul within a month and Russia withdrew their forces as a show of good faith at the time.

That came to an end when Boris Johnson showed up and demanded Zelensky fight to the last Ukrainian or they would be treated as collaborators which was a very direct threat.

That is when the war started. Russia then pulled back and was forced to mobilize a real invasion force at that point.

This last point comes from former members of Zelensky's own government btw.

Ukraine does have a nazi problem. That is simply a fact. Even Radio Free Europe an outfit that was literally created solely to be an anti Russian propaganda outlet wrote a piece in 2019 that the Azov movement was a nazi state within a state and the real power behind the throne.

I never at any point made any claims about timelines or anything else so that is a lie you made up.

3. I at no point ever claimed Putin is crazy. That is your own feelings based opinion with no basis in fact or reality.

4. Your last point is just a lie you made up. I never said anything of the sort. But you operate from feelings and blind ideological loyalty to American supremacy so whatever.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow I admit when I did something wrong. For example, I admitted there were Nazi paramilitary groups running around Ukraine. You love to pretend that I've been claiming there are no Nazis in Ukraine, because you constantly confuse Nazis with fascists, and at this point, I swear you're doing it on purpose.

For the rest of y'all, I'm going to say that's very clearly. Since it's apparently something that people don't understand anymore.

Nazis hate Jews. Zelinskyy is Jewish.

@LordShadowfire Lol. No.



You have been making those claims. You just did in your last post implying it is all made up.



Ukrainian fascists and nazis are distinction without a difference. Even 80 years ago that was true. Even scholars state that the difference between Banderites and the NSDAP basically no longer existed by the 40s.

The Banderites also fought for the Waffen SS so again a distinction without a difference.

And again you oversimplify the far right to fit your narrative.

And as I pointed out whether Zelensky is Jewish or not is totally irrelevant. He is not the real power behind the throne. He is a useful beard for the far right.

Oh and fun fact most of the far right neo nazi battalions in Ukraine are funded by Jewish oligarchs. So politics in Ukraine in general don't fit your neat oversimplifications.


And it is not even like Jewish collaborators didn't exist. In fact it was common enough that they came up with a Yiddish name for them.

Whether Zelensky is a hostage to the far right or whether he has bought into their view because he likes power ultimately doesn't matter.

And your argument about Zelensky is exactly the same argument Zionists make about Bibi Netanyahu btw.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow Wow, okay. Nazis and Jews love each other now. Okay, hon.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow You do realize that your comments are public and anybody can go through them, right?

@ItsMeMorgue Lol. Going with the Bbib Netanyahu argument of "I can't be a fascist because I am Jewish" That is your argument? Seriously?

Just ignore everything else apparently.

@LordShadowfire Yes. But you routinely lie about me so whatever. That doesn't change from the 10 other times you spread these lies about men over the last 4 years.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow So now I'm going to do it. You consistently level your false accusations at me, so I'm going to take the time and effort to go back through your comments over the years and prove that you're the one who's full of it.

@LordShadowfire The only person lying here is you. You slander me because you can't actually argue the facts. That has not changed in 4 years.

@LordShadowfire And yes I know you have deliberately taken my words out of context before again to slander me because again you can't argue the facts.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow I'm not going to let you bait me into reporting you again. That's your strategy every time you can't defend your pro-Russia position.

@LordShadowfire Lol. You are the one threatening to slander or report me because you can't actually argue the facts. You need to derail the conversation because you can't actually make a real argument.

The only one who cannot defend their position is you.

Everything I have said is backed up. Heck most of this comes from Ukrainian sources.

All because you are so arrogant you cannot ever admit you can be wrong about anything.

Engage the facts and make a real argument or shut up. 4 years of personal attacks because you can't admit you are wrong is getting tedious.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow It ain't slander if it's true. You're engaging in verbal abuse.
No, it's just boring going through four years of comments to find the first lie you ever told about Russia. It takes time.
Again, I admit when I'm wrong. You, on the other hand, call me a liar whenever I say something that hits a little too close to home.

Now don't bother me. I'm digging through your lies.
[quote]4 years of personal attacks because you can't admit you are wrong is getting tedious.[/quite]
So quit launching personal attacks, then.

@LordShadowfire Proving my point by claiming daring to not parrot your ideology is abuse.🤣