China does not have a political system.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow
China's society today bears no resemblance to its imperial past that was wiped out by Mao's cultural revolution. It cleared the way for China's economic transformation that began in 1979 under Deng Xiao Peng. To modernize China, he copied from the best in the west: governance and public policy from Singapore, manufacturing prowess from Japan, and technology from America.




Don't argue with me. Go to China and see the truth for yourself. Better still, study the Singapore model of so-called parliamentary democracy inherited from the Brits. It's ruling People's Action Party has been running Singapore since its founding in 1959 by Lee Kuan Yew whose iron grip was as strong as that of North Korea's Kim Jong Un. Lee Kuan Yew was astute in dealing with the US to avoid getting assassinated by the CIA. He came on as anglophile, offered Singapore's as a port of call to the US Navy, armed Singapore with US made weapons, and fostered economic ties with the west.


Quite right. China practices "socialism with Chinese characteristics" aka Confucianism. It is not communism which is a western political ideology. Confucianism is cohesive and inclusive based on the family structure. Everybody gets to eat. It has no room for black sheeps like individualistic oligargh Jack Ma who behaved like the monkey king who wanted to go west. China operates like one big family business designed to encompass the whole world through its Belt and Road initiative. NATO views that a a threat to its rules-based order.

@sree251 The difference here is those changes happened within the same system. The feudal empire was a completely different beast.


And yikes. Talk about bias bordering on racism when you can only describe the progress of one of the oldest societies on earth as imitations of countries that are just a few hundred years old.



I can argue with you. "Political system" has a definition. And the definition is not American Repbublicanism. Your argument is literally that no political system outside variations of the Westminster system are valid. That is factually wrong.




Well in stating that you agree it happened within the Chinese system that invalidates your own initial argument.


And Socialism with Chinese Characteristics is NOT confucianism. Holy shit. The Chinese system was quite literally a complete rejection of Confucius.


And I know for sure you have never heard of market socialism.


And you clearly don't understand communism either.


And there is no such thing as a rules based order.

The rules based order is the US makes the rules and gives the orders and demands the rest of the globe complies.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow
Do you think it is the US alone imposing a rules-based order? Seems to me that the rest of the western pack is part of the gang facing down Russia and China. I can't for the life of me understand why Australia has a nuclear sub, and stationing a warship in the China Sea confronting China.

@sree251 Absolutely. That is how global colonial empires work. Just like Britain before it. The biggest difference being the US uses military basis as colonial outposts more than anything.

The rest of the "west" are just vassal states that just follow along like pets. Australia has nuclear subs because they are a vassal state and the Australian Navy is basically part of the American foreign legion.

Look at many NATO countries. Many have no defense white papers. Which means they have no independent foreign policy. This is because they just follow along the Americans.

My country of Canada is a perfect example of this. Heck the US even largely dictates our military purchases.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow
Can you clarify what you mean?


Why do you say that?

@sree251 You say China doesn't have a political system because their political system is not one you recognize being from a part of the world that operates within variations of the Westminster or similar parliamentary system.


The problem here is you assume the default for what a political system is is defined by what you are personally familiar with.

It is a complete misunderstanding based on assumptions and inherent bias.


To be fair someone from 500 years ago would be just as confused by a political system that didn't involve a monarch.


During the cold war there were many similar claims made about the USSR simply because their system was so alien to what people in the west understood and had no frame of reference.


Many people assumed they didn't have a political system because they could not find a 1 to 1 equivalent to their own familiar system.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow



Do you think the US has a hold on you guys? The Hong Kong riots were funded by the CIA and people were paid to cause that upheaval that ruined businesses. After the fiasco that failed to bait a China crackdown, hundreds perhaps thousands of those Hong Kong Chinese recruited by Americans for the riots were given asylum in Canada. This is the rumour and I find it credible.

@sree251 I don't think, I know. We went from being a vassal of one empire to another. My father did 35 years in the military and one thing is clear we are at best a self governing colony or vassal. We get to make our own choices domestically......unless it pisses off Americans and we do not get to choose our foreign policy. Period.


And you are right about the Hong Kong protests and how the US often gets their vassals to provide safe harbour for their failed coups and "revolutions".


Why do you think so many of Yeltsin's cronies are in London?

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow
You have a point and I see where you are coming from. How do we define politics in the affairs of the state? Is it not a matter of public policies of one kind as opposed to that of another? You want to run the country one way and I want to do it in another way. So, we split up and let the people decide as in a democracy, or variations of that. I told you that China operates as a business corporation except that you can't buy up 51% of the shareholding and take over the country. At the end of the day, China is still controlled by a ruling elite but it is not the kind running western democracies. Western ruling elites seems insensitive to the masses they are supposed to represent. Are you telling me that China's government is no different?

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow
Wow, I didn't know that you guys are as helpless as us Americans suffering the dictate of the US government. I thought it was just Trudeau. Look, I don't know what is going on in the west. Looks like Deep State is some monstrous phenomenon with a grip on the entire west, not just the USA.

@sree251 I am saying you are trying to understand the Chinese system by trying to fit it into a western frame of reference. The fact it doesn't fit the political systems you are familiar with but shares some characteristics that superficially line up with analogues in business makes it seem like it is a business. But the reason why it doesn't really fit that either is because it is ultimately something different.

@sree251 Yep. Even every single war we have fought since 1945 has been something the Americans dragged us into.

And the Bush administration tried to crash our lumber industry when we refused to fight in Iraq and that was because we literally could not. We literally don't have a big enough army to fight in 2 wars at once.

But we were punished regardless for our "disloyalty".

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow
Ok, I see where you are going. You may be seeing something I am not aware of. My opinion is formed from my observation of the Singapore government. I spent 6 months a year living there and had some on-the-ground familiarity with how the PAP party runs Singapore. China had been sending officials to study the Singapore model in every aspect of governance. Singapore's elections are a farce in terms of Westminster-style democracy. There is nothing sinister about it because the PAP ruling party attends to the needs of Singaporeans 24/7. There is no litter in the streets. Every complaint from the public no matter how minor is attended to immediately. Singapore is like a well-run country club. No one is allowed to slip through the cracks. I have not seen a single beggar in all my time there. No violent crimes. The government checks itself and literally corruption free. This was what Lee Kuan Yew told Deng Xiaoping if the latter wanted China's government to run successfully: no corruption.

So, the deal is that the government in power can only stay in power if it is fit for purpose. This includes the ability to do what is best for the people the way a business succeeds by bringing the best product to the market.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow
I can imagine that both Australia and New Zealand are in the same pickle as Canada, all bullied into submission by the US. What about the UK and the EU? Are they all under the thumb of the US also?
I never understood why the EU is facing down Russia. They had been wrecked by two world wars and seem to be inviting another bashing.

The US seems deranged since 1945. We have become a rogue nation. According to Professor Jeffery Sachs, we have been responsible for overthrowing 80 governments since 1947 (see link below).

I watched "The Quiet American" movie just yesterday. I am ashamed to say that I was unaware of what we are as a nation.

https://www.jeffsachs.org/newspaper-articles/wspgnywf65g3dw8wnkb6x4x84wrmz7

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow
You have no idea how the Chinese suffered on account of their entrapment in cultural superstitions. The Japanese were the first to pull away from their cultural attachment and copied the industrialized west. This enabled them to build their military and assert themselves.

Deng Xiaopeng was a pragmatist. He adopted any method that can benefit China. Western democracy was not good, and neither was religion be it from the east or the west. Confucianism is not a religion. It espouses family ethics and the cultivation of self-perfection in relationship.