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Are there any GOP running that are NOT 2020 election deniers?

My #1 criteria for deciding who to vote for. If the candidate believes the 2020 election was illegitimate, I see no reason to vote for that person, because I would then believe elections are pointless.

Right now all the Rs on my ballot are election deniers. So I guess I am voting all D.

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Freeranger · M

Are there any Dem's running that, support Biden 'effing up our country for four more years? This, I assume would be the more salient question.

The old sot has stated he's actually going to run again! Hah.....arrogance /ignorance reaches new levels in the stratosphere kids! I mean, it's telling us that, even though, the curtain has been pulled back displaying his teleprompting facade, ala Wizard of Oz....the corrupt, doddering auld hair-sniffing idiot actually believes he has a sliver of a chance in the next cycle?
Holy shit.....I'm making a deep bowl of dip and buying huge bags of chips and pulling up my chair to watch this hysterical fiction play out. Shit.....this has become better than Monday Night Football.

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trollslayer · 46-50, M

@Freeranger This post isn't about Biden. Stay on topic or get deleted.

Freeranger · M

@trollslayer Ha, ha, push the button bub. This is so instructive in that you not only have no answer, like Biden's spokeswoman out on the dais, doing the daily deflection, she has no answer.
So sure, reveal your true self then. Push your delete button and show this website who you truly are.

TheSentinel · M

@Freeranger While Biden has his issues, no true American can deny that the nation is better off without trump.

easterniowegin · 51-55, M

@TheSentinel list one measurable area where it is better now than trump's term.

SomeMichGuy · M

@easterniowegin Jobs growth.

Done.

Budwick · 70-79, M

@TheSentinel

no true American can deny that the nation is better off without trump.

Every American would be lucky to have Trump back in the White House.

Ryderbike

@Freeranger still dividing america lying about the election?

Ryderbike

@Budwick pretty good joke

Freeranger · M

@Ryderbike

[image/video deleted]

Sorry.....it's just that you deniers are so incredibly boring. And when your leader continues to not only search for dead Congressional people and the Veep goes to the DMZ and salutes North Korea.....well...I can either stress to the max or take a cat nap, because at that point, I know mid-terms are coming and hell.....I can continue to hunker for two more years.
Open borders......fentanyl, Central American nations opening up their jails and prodding it's denizens to head for America. Briefings where, the new talking head explains that, "hell yah, we'll take in all those Russians" (not that any of them could ever be KGB.)
I mean......dude....do you not get that your shit list and how the disgust level is growing to dynamic proportions? You're fekked boyo.......feked. Even Hitler finally realized the jig was up and capped himself.
But.....keeping sitting there at the piano playing yer tunes....

Tappin' out.

Ryderbike

@Ryderbike fascist movements are never a joke

Ryderbike

@Freeranger yes trump did salute an n Korean general and humiliated America,

How uninformed are you kid?

Ryderbike

@Freeranger North Korea’s state news channel on Thursday was the first to broadcast a 42-minute video from Trump’s meeting this week with Kim Jong Un. In a clip shared by the BBC, Trump is shown meeting various North Korean officials, including a North Korean military general.

The general first salutes Trump, to which the president salutes back, before shaking his hand. Kim is seen smiling in the background.

“To no one’s surprise, North Korea used our President for their propaganda campaign,” tweeted Sen. Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.), calling it “nauseating” to see the salute after Trump had just bashed traditional U.S. allies days earlier over trade disputes at a G-7 meeting.

Ryderbike

marke · 70-79, M

@TheSentinel

While Biden has his issues, no true American can deny that the nation is better off without trump.

Why? Because Biden is shutting down American energy independence? Because Biden is clamping down with leftist opposition to the Constitution and the 1st and 2nd amendments? Becaude Biden supports teaching school kids that whites are racists and that parents have no right to keep them from getting sex changes? Is there something else?

marke · 70-79, M

@Ryderbike

Trump was the first president in US history to successfully dialogue with North Korea.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/president-trump-travel-dmz-meet-kim-jong/story?id=64042883

ElwoodBlues · M

@marke

Trump was the first president in US history to successfully dialogue with North Korea.

You have a strange definition of "success."

In 2019, NK launched missiles on May 4 & 9, July 25 & 31, August 2 & 24, Sept 10, Oct 2 & 31, and Nov 28. Some of those days had two launches.

NK's warlike behavior didn't change one whit. How is that "success"???

marke · 70-79, M

@ElwoodBlues

Nothing former presidents have done has stopped N. Korea from launching missiles, especially giving the rogues large payments, of cash. Trump was right to open an avenue of dialogue and negotiation rather than try to bribe them with cash like so many former presidents did.

ElwoodBlues · M

@marke

rather than try to bribe them with cash like so many former presidents did.

Seriously, who bribed them with cash? Trump bribed Kim with world attention, but NOBODY bribed them with cash.

Oh, wait, there's this:

U.S. President Donald Trump on Tuesday said he supported the provision of humanitarian food assistance to North Korea during a call with his South Korean counterpart Moon Jae-in, according to a statement from the Blue House.

The two leaders discussed North Korea’s recent short-range missile test and a recent joint food security assessment from the World Food Program (WFP) and Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO).

“President Trump assessed that South Korea’s provision of food to North Korea in a humanitarian move will be very timely and a positive step and supports it,” Blue House spokesperson Ko Min-jung said.

https://www.nknews.org/2019/05/trump-supports-seoul-sending-humanitarian-aid-to-north-korea-blue-house/

If that's what you call a cash bribe, then Trump was doing it. Maybe that's what happens when you fool "we fell in love" Trump. Oh, and let's not forget Trump giving Kim a place on the world stage for once in his life and Trump cancelling military exercises at Kim's request.

marke · 70-79, M

@ElwoodBlues

Seriously, who bribed them with cash? Trump bribed Kim with world attention, but NOBODY bribed them with cash.

"Bribed with world attention?" Is that why Biden flies all over the globe, except to areas that look bad for his presidency, to bribe them with attention? I thought I had heard the worst of the nonsense before now but I was wrong.

You are right. Clinton did not buy the N. Koreans with cash like OPbama bought the Iranian terroriosts, but Clinton did bribe them with a gift of $4 billion worth of nuclear enrichment capabilities.

Clinton Approves a Plan to Give Aid to North Koreans - The New York Times (nytimes.com)

Clinton Approves a Plan to Give Aid to North Koreans
By David E. Sanger, Special To the New York Times
• Oct. 19, 1994

WASHINGTON, Oct. 18 -- President Clinton approved a plan today to arrange more than $4 billion in energy aid to North Korea during the next decade in return for a commitment from the country's hard-line Communist leadership to freeze and gradually dismantle its nuclear weapons development program.
"This agreement will help achieve a longstanding and vital American objective -- an end to the threat of nuclear proliferation on the Korean Peninsula," Mr. Clinton said this afternoon, after his top foreign policy advisers described the details of an enormously complex agreement struck with North Korea late Monday.

American and North Korean officials plan to sign the broad accord on Friday, and almost immediately the United States will begin a remarkable new foreign aid program: it will provide for the North, with which it has never signed a peace treaty ending the Korean War, supplies of heavy oil to keep factories running and homes heated.
The Pentagon had expressed concern that some of the fuel could be diverted to the North's million-man army, but officials said they were working to assure supplies that would be incompatible with its tanks and other military equipment.

"This agreement is good for the United States, good for our allies, and good for the safety of the entire world," Mr. Clinton said in a brief appearance in the White House press room this afternoon. "It's a crucial step toward drawing North Korea into the global community."
The accord calls for a consortium of nations, led by South Korea and Japan, to provide the North with two light-water nuclear reactors, designed in a manner that makes it far more difficult for the North to convert nuclear waste into atomic weapons.

The total cost of the project was put at $4 billion by Robert L. Gallucci, the chief American negotiator with the North. The financing would be supplied by South Korea, Japan and possibly Germany, Russia and the United States.

Under the accord, North Korea would agree to allow full and continuous inspections of its existing nuclear sites, freeze and then later take apart some of its most important nuclear plants and ultimately ship out of the country fuel rods that could be converted into fuel for weapons.
But the agreement also allows North Korea to keep those rods for an unspecified number of years. This provision means that the potential that North Korea could break its agreements and quickly produce nuclear weapons will not disappear until the end of the decade.

The provision also means that it will be years before inspectors can resolve the question of how much weapons-grade plutonium the North has already produced and perhaps converted into a primitive nuclear weapon. Some of Mr. Clinton's defense and intelligence aides said today that they had hoped North Korea would be forced to surrender its nuclear fuel under a much more rapid timetable. But they said that this goal could not be accomplished, and that the agreement reached this week was better than a continuing confrontation.

In the view of the Administration's experts, North Korea clearly did not want to abandon its largest national project until large-scale aid began to flow in. Over the years, the North has come to view the nuclear program as its only true defense against what it sees as hostile neighbors: South Korea, Japan and American forces in the Pacific.
But Mr. Gallucci insisted to reporters today that the agreement "does not rely on trust."

He said that the Government in Pyongyang would not receive any nuclear-sensitive materials for the new reactors until the International Atomic Energy Agency was able to conduct full inspections of nuclear sites, including two sites that the Central Intelligence Agency believes will help unravel the mystery of whether the North already possesses one or more nuclear weapons.

The accord struck in Geneva gave the President a chance to proclaim a major foreign policy success just weeks before the midterm election. But Asian diplomats pointed out today that it also placed the United States in the odd position of bolstering the political capital of a man it has regularly denounced as a terrorist, a supplier of missile technology to Iran and a dictator: Kim Jong Il.

Mr. Kim is expected to take control of the country formally later this month, succeeding his late father, Kim Il Sung. Little is known about Kim Jong Il, but American, Japanese and South Korean intelligence officials have described him in the past as the chief proponent for the past decade of the North's secret nuclear weapons program.
Japan and South Korea endorsed the agreement today, but have not yet said what share they will take in the new energy consortium.

American officials said that after some initial balking, Seoul had agreed to pay somewhat more than 50 percent of the cost of building the reactors -- the design of which will be based on a nuclear plant in Ulchin, South Korea -- and that Japan would probably pay 30 percent or more.

Germany and Russia, possibly along with the United States, may also become minor investors.
The agreement that Mr. Clinton announced today is perhaps the biggest turning point yet in a nuclear program that the United States paid little attention to in the 1980's, then could not stop in the early 1990's, and that over the past year has sometimes seemed on the verge of setting off a military confrontation.

In June the Administration was on the verge of imposing sanctions against North Korea -- a step that would have required the commitment of thousands of American troops to Korea to reinforce the 38,000 already stationed there -- until former President Jimmy Carter invited himself to Pyongyang and negotiated directly with Kim Il Sung. Mr. Kim died just a few weeks later, but, to the amazement of American officials, the new tone set by Mr. Carter and the man known for four decades as the North's "Great Leader" survived.

Mr. Gallucci, a seemingly unflappable negotiator who has spent hundreds of hours with the North Koreans and still professes to understand very little about their motives, insisted at the White House today that the United States had obtained virtually everything it sought. "The agreement goes to concerns we've had about the North Korean nuclear program with respect to past activities, current activities and future activities," he said.

The main accomplishment of the agreement is that it commits North Korea to never resuming operations of its five-megawatt nuclear reactor -- a source of fuel for its nuclear weapons project -- and never to finish construction of two larger reactors, rated at 50 and 200 megawatts, which potentially could produce fuel for hundreds of additional weapons. In time, North Korea is also committed to dismantling the most crucial installation in its nuclear complex: a reprocessing plant that can convert spent nuclear fuel into weapons-grade plutonium.
The heavy oil and the new nuclear reactors are being described by the Administration as compensation for the energy production the North has forgone by shuttering the plants.

What bothers some nuclear experts, from the Pentagon to the International Atomic Energy Agency, is that the North will continue to possess nuclear spent fuel for years, surrendering it only when the new reactors are nearing completion. That leaves open the possibility that if it ever renounced this week's agreement it could eject all international inspectors and resume the bomb project.

"This means that we are living with a country that flouted the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty and will remain in noncompliance for years," an atomic energy agency official said today. "We wanted to get that fuel out of the country, and out of the country fast."

Similarly, some of the agency's officials are concerned that the so-called special inspection of a suspected nuclear site that they demanded two years ago -- a demand that prompted the North to announce it would pull out of the Nonproliferation Treaty -- will be delayed for five years or more. "It is not a good precedent to set," the official said, "if we have to demand a special inspection in Iran or Iraq or someplace else in the world."

ElwoodBlues · M

@marke Energy aid is not cash. Also, this aid was when Kim Jong Il was the new leader.

The Pentagon had expressed concern that some of the fuel could be diverted to the North's million-man army, but officials said they were working to assure supplies that would be incompatible with its tanks and other military equipment.

. . .

The main accomplishment of the agreement is that it commits North Korea to never resuming operations of its five-megawatt nuclear reactor -- a source of fuel for its nuclear weapons project -- and never to finish construction of two larger reactors, rated at 50 and 200 megawatts, which potentially could produce fuel for hundreds of additional weapons. In time, North Korea is also committed to dismantling the most crucial installation in its nuclear complex: a reprocessing plant that can convert spent nuclear fuel into weapons-grade plutonium.

The heavy oil and the new nuclear reactors are being described by the Administration as compensation for the energy production the North has forgone by shuttering the plants.

BTW, nuclear reactors use uranium enriched to about 5% U235; nuclear weapons need about 90% enrichment. There's really no comparison. And as long as the US & allies control the fuel rods, NK can't extract plutonium either.

So what ultimately happened to the multi-lateral deal involving SK, Japan, the US and other nations??

Then intelligence agencies determined that North Korea was cheating on the agreement by trying to develop nuclear material through another method — highly enriched uranium. The Bush administration sent an envoy who confronted North Korea — and the regime was said to have belligerently confirmed it in 2002, just as the Bush administration was mostly focused on the pending invasion of Iraq.

In response, the Bush administration terminated the supply of fuel oil that was essential to the agreement — and then North Korea quickly kicked out the U.N. inspectors, restarted the nuclear plant and began developing its nuclear weapons, using the material in radioactive fuel rods that previously had been under the close watch of the IAEA. Japan and South Korea, the key partners in the accord, were not happy with the decision to terminate the Agreed Framework, but there was little they could do about it.

Within two years, U.S. intelligence analysts concluded North Korea was using the plutonium to create nuclear weapons.

After North Korea conducted its first nuclear test in 2006, the Bush administration tried desperately to negotiate a new accord with Pyongyang, including offering significant new concessions, but those efforts ultimately failed. Bush, to the anger of conservatives and the government of Japan, even removed North Korea from the State Department list of state sponsors of terrorism — only to see the hard work turn to dust. The nuclear genie by then was out of the bottle, and North Korea had little incentive to give up its stash of plutonium, no matter what the United States and its negotiating allies offered.

In short, Bush made a hash of it.

marke · 70-79, M

@ElwoodBlues

Energy aid is not cash. Also, this aid was when Kim Jong Il was the new leader.

Of course. It's all about how the wording is spun. Energy companies get some tax breaks just like other businesses yet leftists call those tax breaks "subsidies," which is just spinning the term in the wrong erroneous direction. When Congress cuts excessive tax rates across the board leftists claim the debt crisis is to blame because the rich are getting subsidized by republicans, which is also stupid and untrue. If democrats really wanted to tax the rich (themselves included) they would make yearly IRS audits of private foundations and charities mandatory.

Ryderbike

@marke Straight from the QAnon rabbit hole

ElwoodBlues · M

@marke There is a big difference between handing someone cash and building a nuclear reactor in their back yard. NK agreed to give up their reactor project in exchange for having our allies build one. Building the reactor gave us control over the fuel rods - very valuable; the point of the whole exercise.

That created an energy gap which we agreed to fill with non-military oil. The goal was no nukes in NK and this process was preventing NK from building them. And our allies who were NK neighbors were all on board.

Until Bush made a hash of it. Not only the allies; even Colin Powell was originally onboard with Clinton's plan. Until Bush made a hash of it.

Ryderbike

@ElwoodBlues that is correct. Bush destroyed the agreement like trump destroyed the Iran agreement.

And no replacement

marke · 70-79, M

@ElwoodBlues

There is a big difference between handing someone cash and building a nuclear reactor in their back yard. NK agreed to give up their reactor project in exchange for having our allies build one. Building the reactor gave us control over the fuel rods - very valuable; the point of the whole exercise.

Clinton gave NK nuclear reactors. Obama gave Iranian terrorist thugs $1.7 billion in cash (less his cut) and they are building WMDs with which to murder Jews and westerners. Just because these guys got elected does not mean they have good sense.

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